Poor log cabin installation

R8R

Hello, any forumites who may be able to advise on a cabin installation? A 2 room cabin is partly completed in our back garden, but there seems to have been/be multiple problems. We paid the cabin company for their "high standard" installation but... one example - under the 2 sliding doors they have placed a piece of wood which is shorter than the length of the doors, so the outside/inside can be seen! Also, in one internal corner they have added a piece of skirting board vertically, presumably to hide another hole, as the timbers don't seem to be locked together well. Tuin (not the company we have bought from) have an excellent blog with lots of advice and we wanted to contract the main writer to give some kind of feedback on the install but he has now retired. I have lots of photos, but we need the guidance quite quickly. Can anyone advise on who could do this
?

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head

Have you approached the company you paid to install with your concerns and if so what was their response? 

Services must be carried out with due care and skill and if that doesn't occur you'd be entitled to seek a price reduction on the cost of the service if after a repeat performance the service still has issues (or the company refuses to come back and try again). 

If there is an issue with the cabin rather than the install there are also rights here but you seem to suggest the cabin is fine and the install in the problem.  

I can't help with someone who could inspect the work other than perhaps suggesting a carpenter? 

eskbanker

What have Tuin the installers said when you've flagged your concerns?

[as below, misinterpreted the role of Tuin!]

ArbitraryRandom

You said 'partly installed' - so I'm not clear if this is still in progress or if the installers have stopped work without completing the job (or if they think it's done)? 

If it's still in progress then it could be the things you note are temporary until other parts are completed (to allow adjustment or pending finishing) - if the installers have stopped then you would need to document the issues and give them opportunity to remedy.

Ultimately, it could be that you need to get someone else in to fix the work (after following the correct process with the original installers) and then either withhold an appropriate amount of payment or seek damages. 

Hopefully you are holding a balance of payments against completion? 

Aylesbury_Duck

eskbanker said:

What have Tuin said when you've flagged your concerns?

I inferred that Tuin is entirely unconnected to this project, and that OP has found their blog and wants to consult them as an independent expert.  Perhaps?

TELLIT01

The OP needs to answer the question - 'Have you contacted the suppliers of the cabin in order to resolve the problems?'.  That must be the first step.

R8R

The cabin is almost finished, and everything is all paid for (balance has to be paid 1 or 2 weeks before installation). I have spoken to the cabin installers about the work done on the first few days. The company owner assured me that a broken timber wouldn't be a problem in the future and they would guarantee it. It broke because one of the installers jumped up and grabbed it to try to make it fit into the log below (instead of using a mallet). As it had a knot and was the beam above the space for the window, it broke. My husband saw this and they screwed or nailed it together and carried on. After day 1 I saw that the numbered timbers hadn't been put in the correct place - eg (stronger) timbers which were supposed to go at the bottom/top had been put in the middle. Again, the owner assured me it wouldn't be a problem. When they returned on day 3, I again expressed my concerns and the owner said if i wanted they could take it all down and I could find someone else to install. It's a big cabin, and rain was forecast for days, and i obviously didn't have anyone else to come and do it, so felt I had little option but to let them carry on. The owner assured me that it would all look fine when finished and the cabin has a guarantee. I'm obviously most concerned about potential problems in the future - we paid extra for roof and floor insulation, plus an extra £1700 for upvc windows and doors so we could use the cabin all year round, but with gaps underneath the doors that's not very likely! Perhaps for some issues I'm worrying too much (eg Tuin show various photos of damaged logs for people who are installing themselves and say they won't cause a problem.)
The installers are coming to do some decking on Tuesday - I haven't seen them since the day they did the doors. I wanted to have an independent log cabin expert report/comment on the issues so that I'm well prepared on Tuesday to tell them what needs to be addressed. 

R8R

Apparently, log cabins are quite particular in the way that the timbers need to be able to move. A carpenter won't necessarily have that knowledge. The cabin base is critically important for smooth cabin installation, and I'd already pointed out to the owner some base issues, which he said would try to rectify. The company have 5 stars on Trustpilot etc, and the owner does make me feel reassured when I speak to him. It's just that there are sooo many things that don't seem right - big things and little things.  Probably lots of things that I haven't even seen too. 

ArbitraryRandom

They're still installing it, and it sounds like they're actively snag fixing as they go, so I think the best thing to do at the moment is document anything you're concerned about and ensure that you have something in writing about the warranty/guarantee (if this wasn't provided as part of the original quote, then you could just ask them to email you a copy 'for your records').

At the end of the job, if something is not completed or there's still problems, contact them in writing giving details and asking them to fix. 

Down the line - IF something does go wrong and they refuse to fix it - then you could find another installer and pay them to do a report on if the problem was caused by the installation. 

Aylesbury_Duck

R8R said:

I again expressed my concerns and the owner said if i wanted they could take it all down and I could find someone else to install. 

This is the bit that would concern me.  Not the reaction I'd expect from a decent company, and I'd worry about their attitude if further problems arise.

Jumblebumble

R8R said:

The cabin is almost finished, and everything is all paid for (balance has to be paid 1 or 2 weeks before installation). I have spoken to the cabin installers about the work done on the first few days. The company owner assured me that a broken timber wouldn't be a problem in the future and they would guarantee it. It broke because one of the installers jumped up and grabbed it to try to make it fit into the log below (instead of using a mallet). As it had a knot and was the beam above the space for the window, it broke. My husband saw this and they screwed or nailed it together and carried on. After day 1 I saw that the numbered timbers hadn't been put in the correct place - eg (stronger) timbers which were supposed to go at the bottom/top had been put in the middle. Again, the owner assured me it wouldn't be a problem. When they returned on day 3, I again expressed my concerns and the owner said if i wanted they could take it all down and I could find someone else to install. It's a big cabin, and rain was forecast for days, and i obviously didn't have anyone else to come and do it, so felt I had little option but to let them carry on. The owner assured me that it would all look fine when finished and the cabin has a guarantee. I'm obviously most concerned about potential problems in the future - we paid extra for roof and floor insulation, plus an extra £1700 for upvc windows and doors so we could use the cabin all year round, but with gaps underneath the doors that's not very likely! Perhaps for some issues I'm worrying too much (eg Tuin show various photos of damaged logs for people who are installing themselves and say they won't cause a problem.)
The installers are coming to do some decking on Tuesday - I haven't seen them since the day they did the doors. I wanted to have an independent log cabin expert report/comment on the issues so that I'm well prepared on Tuesday to tell them what needs to be addressed. 

You are correct to be concerned
It is very clear that installing timbers in a different order than was recommended by the manufacturers is a potential recipe for disaster.
I know from experience that Tuin would have sent another beam to replace the broken one
( I am the happy owner of a Tuin Cabin that I installed 4 years ago )
I suspect that any guarantee is not worth the paper it is written on if installation has been bodged
I also suspect that the installer is not the manufacturer as the manufacturer would not be likely to make school boy errors.
On the other hand you need to be mindful that log cabins are made of imperfect natural material, expand and contract all over the place and the only really important things are that the base is completely level and that the cabin is not fixed to the base and that it gets good quality external treatment and the roof is sound and waterproof


The below is from Tuin

Question 2: Why is there a gap above the door and windows?

Answer: Due to local atmospheric conditions and treatment, the log cabin will expand and contract. Each untreated log can expand and contract by as much as 3mm over a year. A log cabin may have 15 logs in a wall, this equates at the maximum an expansion of 45mm. The gap is to allow for this expansion. When installed, this gap may be more and is visible. Lift the door frame so the gap closes more and put a slither of wood under the frame. Keep the frame square. You may need to remove this when the cabin has settled after a few weeks.

Question 3: Why does the door not close properly and have gaps surrounding it?

Answer:  This happens when the door and frame is not at right angles with each other. A slither of wood choking one side can often resolve this. Sometimes the hinges will also need adjustment. You can lift the door off the frame and adjust each hinge by screwing both the door and frame hinges in and out for a perfect fit. Depending on treatment you may need to do this again over the year.

Question 4: Will my log cabin settle?

Answer: After you have installed your log cabin there will be quite a bit of settlement as each log sinks further into the one below. Settlement can be as much as 100mm and will take a few weeks.