Quote for Boiler Works

Alfster

Hi,

I previously posted about some shoddy boiler installation issues. It is only 2 years old. These are:

> the boiler is installed on a wooden box
> the plume kit is wonky
> the flue is not far enough from the ground outside which has caused rian water to leak in, flow down and pool all over the floor making the wooden crate wet and at risk of collapsing. Imagine Oftec signed it off.........

Anyway, I have been recommended a good plumber and oil boiler engineer from Grant. They have said that the external flue set-up is not even suitable for our situation so they won't replace like for like. They said the following needs to be done:

> Disconnect the boiler and move it back on the old concrete plinth (about 50cm away from its current position).

>Remove the old flue liner (previously for the old non-condensing oiler boiler which they said isn't suitable). 

> Install a new flue liner suitable for our condensing boiler and connect to the boiler. 

I live in Hertfordshire and have a quote for £3200 (this includes VAT). They said it would take two days. The boiler is in the cellar so the flue liner would have to climb 3 stories to the chimney. 

I just wanted advice on how reasonable you think this quote is? 

Thanks. 

Netexporter

Assuming it is a double-wall stainless steel insulated flue, I'd say that probably isn't unreasonable. Sounds like they may need scaffolding to install the flue.

Ectophile

Sounds expensive to me.  That's the sort of money I would expect to pay to install a new boiler.

Alfster

Thanks both. Netexporter no I think they are using a ladder as we have a cottage, the total height of which is quite low compared to a stanadard house. They have put in the notes that extra costs with be added if a cherrypicker is needed for example. 

So with this in mind, does that seem quite high? 

smallblueplanet

Alfster said:

Hi,

I previously posted about some shoddy boiler installation issues. It is only 2 years old. These are:

> the boiler is installed on a wooden box
> the plume kit is wonky
> the flue is not far enough from the ground outside which has caused rian water to leak in, flow down and pool all over the floor making the wooden crate wet and at risk of collapsing. Imagine Oftec signed it off.........

Anyway, I have been recommended a good plumber and oil boiler engineer from Grant. They have said that the external flue set-up is not even suitable for our situation so they won't replace like for like. They said the following needs to be done:

> Disconnect the boiler and move it back on the old concrete plinth (about 50cm away from its current position).

>Remove the old flue liner (previously for the old non-condensing oiler boiler which they said isn't suitable). 

> Install a new flue liner suitable for our condensing boiler and connect to the boiler. 

I live in Hertfordshire and have a quote for £3200 (this includes VAT). They said it would take two days. The boiler is in the cellar so the flue liner would have to climb 3 stories to the chimney. 

I just wanted advice on how reasonable you think this quote is? 

Thanks. 

Not an expert but we do have an old Grant oil boiler. Anyway that work doesn't sound like it needs a 'Grant' engineer, I'd have thought any OFTEC oil engineer should be able to move a boiler and put a new flue in. Why not go to the OFTEC site and see if there's a list of local, to you, engineers. But anyway even if you get some other names from Grants get more than two quotes. When we had our oil CH fitted over 18 years ago the difference in prices quoted was thousands (can't remember exact figures). (I can't imagine your work was signed off by OFTEC tbh.)

Reed_Richards

In our old house we considered bringing a disused chimney back into use but the cost of the flue liner made it prohibitively expensive (two floors plus the chimney).  if you ask for a breakdown of costs I think you will find that the flue liner is the major part of what you are being quoted for.    

Alfster

Dear all,

Thank you for all your great advice. 

 (I can't imagine your work was signed off by OFTEC tbh.)

Unfortunately, it was. I have the paperwrok for the OFTEC inspection and I called OFTEC who confirmed what was on the paperwork their end; namely all these faults were not flagged. I have emailed their complaints team and the guy who rang me back was nice and has sent me the info to complain. He was suprisingly transparent and thinks I have a good case in terms of incompetency of the OFTEC inspector.

I've consulted the instruction manual for the Grant boiler and it says the flue kit they have used must come out the wall 300mm from ground level. Well, since the original installer have fed it under the ceiling of a cellar it is, by definition, BELOW ground level outside. They have just dug a hole for it to come out of. 

I would greatly appreciate an alternative approach depending on the outcome of the OFTEC complaint as they said if it is upheld they will put it right with an installer (usually the original one who would be forced to put it right at their cost). The alternative suggestion is an external oil boiler which a highly rated oil boiler specialist in the local area suggested when i got another quote.

I thought this sounded crazy since the Grant boiler is 2 years old but the price difference is only £1200 for a new Worcester Greenstar Danesmoor External 25/32 heat only boiler with a 7 year guarantee. He asked how the current Grant one copes and I said ok most of the time but some rads on the end of the line are not that hot when the UFH ni the kitchen is on too. He asked how many rads we have (16) and with the UFH he said that more like 18 rads when both CH and UFH are on. He pointed out the Grant boiler is 21kW which I didn't know and is limited to about 10-12 rads. So for an extra £1200 I would get:

> A new boiler
> 7 year warranty vs no warranty (Grant was has just ran out)
> More room in the basement 
> More powerful boiler - 32kW vs 21kW so able to cope better when UFH and CH are on together

Would appreciate some advice. The new chimney liner would seem obviously the bets option if OFTEC put it right themselves as it would be free. 

lohr500

For what it's worth, we went for an external Grant 32kW boiler when we had our ancient oil boiler replaced a couple of years ago. 

Going external was the best decision we made.

It has freed up a space in the kitchen which has given us extra storage space. And with it being outside, there is silence in the kitchen and not a whiff of oil!

smallblueplanet

Alfster said:

...

I thought this sounded crazy since the Grant boiler is 2 years old but the price difference is only £1200 for a new Worcester Greenstar Danesmoor External 25/32 heat only boiler with a 7 year guarantee. He asked how the current Grant one copes and I said ok most of the time but some rads on the end of the line are not that hot when the UFH ni the kitchen is on too. He asked how many rads we have (16) and with the UFH he said that more like 18 rads when both CH and UFH are on. He pointed out the Grant boiler is 21kW which I didn't know and is limited to about 10-12 rads. So for an extra £1200 I would get:

> A new boiler
> 7 year warranty vs no warranty (Grant was has just ran out)
> More room in the basement 
> More powerful boiler - 32kW vs 21kW so able to cope better when UFH and CH are on together

Would appreciate some advice. The new chimney liner would seem obviously the bets option if OFTEC put it right themselves as it would be free. 

Hi Alfster I'm not quite following the ins and outs here, but I don't think I'd want the original installers anywhere near my house. I guess if you can afford £1200 it seems a good outcome - 7 years of 'additional' warranty for the other boiler would be a bob or two. So you get a better boiler in a better place that runs all your heating well. Good luck with your choice.

Alfster

@lohr500 thanks. We have had a few quotes now but some conflicting info about that size boiler I was hoping you could shed some light on. We have 14 rads and about 30 sqr mtrs of wet UFH. When both are on some rads on the end of the line are not fully hot. One company quoted that 32kW WB but another said as it is only struggling a bit that is too big of a jump from 21kW to 32kW. He said if it’s too powerful the boiler cycles, cutting on and off where the rads end up not being able to fully heat up as it can’t dissipate the heat quick enough. So he quoted for a Grant 26kW Pro and since he is a G1 Grant installer it could come with a 10 year warranty (WB 32kW was 7 years). 

Both companies specialise in oil boilers only with around 30 years of experience so was surprised with such difference in advice. When I went back to the 32kW WB guy he said you just simply turn down the thermostat on the boiler to avoid this? 

What are your thoughts on this? Also, if the quotes are similar is it worth going Grant for an extra 3 years warranty? Thanks 

Alfster

smallblueplanet said:

but I don't think I'd want the original installers anywhere near my house. 

Thank you for the advice. I'm glad you said this because OFTEC said part of the complaint with them should, in the first instance, involve contatcing the original installers to complain to. When I asked oftec who would reimburse me fhis expense they said they would work with original installers to rectify. I'm think they would threaten to remove them as a registered oftec company if they didn't rectify it for free is my guess. I don't want to really complain to them as I didn't instruct them (this may also lead to them trying to fix itI and nor do I want oftec working with them to rectify it.