Will Trust Registration Query

Slowplod

I've just registered the will trust of my late mother who died in October 2021 but I'm not sure if I've made a mistake somewhere as it didn't ask for any details of the actual house address or price.  There is no tax to pay as step dad currently lives there rent free until he dies or remarries under the will trust.  Am I right in answering "NO" to "has the trust acquired land or property in the UK since 6 October 2020" as the property was bought in 1995 as tenants in common with step dad, or should I have answered "YES" because her share transferred into the trust on her death?

Thanks for any help.

Slowplod

I've just rung the Trust helpline and I am right in answering NO to the question above, it is only if the trust buys any new land or property (not the property left in the will) that you need to answer YES. Just in case this helps anyone else filling in a trust registration in the future.

RnK136

@Linwhite how easy/difficult was it to register your will trust please?
It is coming up to 2 years since my Mum died and her 50% share of the property was left to me and my Brother in trust in her will.
My Dad is still alive and just recently has gone into residential care so end of next year we have to sell up to use his 50% to pay for the care fees 
I was just trying to figure out if the trust registration is something tricky I need external help with?
What does it ask, so I know what I need to answer?
Thanks for any advice! 

Slowplod

Sorry to hear about your mum and dad.  The trust is really easy to register yourself online.  I found a guide online by Wesleyan which was very helpful.  You need to create an "Organisation"Government Gateway account for the trust.  It is an Express Trust. As my trust was not taxable I did not need any info regarding the address of the house or the price.  The answer to "has the trust acquired land or property" is NO as this does not include the original house (only YES if trust has bought any new land/property). You do not need to complete the registration in one go, it is saved and can be edited for 28 days before you actually submit it. 

You will need the name, date of birth, date of death of the settlor (your mum). Don't think I needed my mums NI number. You will need the name, email address/phone no, date of birth and NI number of the Lead Trustee and if they are UK resident. You just need name, date of birth and if uk resident of other Trustees and beneficiaries.   

Once you submit the declaration you will get a Unique Reference Number, mine appeared straight away on screen, but may be emailed to you.

As you answer the questions online it removes any irrelevant questions. I did not have to answer any questions on the assets in the trust as no tax is payable.  

It didn't take me long to fill in as I had gathered all the info I thought I'd need beforehand. I thought I'd done it wrong as it was so easy but I've since rung the trust helpline to double check and it was fine.

Good luck if you decide to have a go yourself. Im quite happy to answer any queries you have if I can.

RnK136

@Linwhite that's really helpful. Thank you! 

RnK136

@Linwhite I've downloaded the Wesleyan guide which is great, but can you help me a bit please if I understand correctly?

The trust is a will trust from my Mum's will for her 50% of the property.
Me, my Brother and my Dad are the Trustees of her will.
Me and my Brother are the beneficiaries of her 50% of the property, but my Dad retains a beneficial interest in her 50% whilst he's still alive (so we remain as Trustees until he dies, only then do we become Beneficiaries of her 50%, at least that's if I understood a solicitor explanation correctly). So my Brother and I are "potential beneficiaries" at this stage?

What did you put for Name of Trust?

My Dad doesn't have capacity now. What does it ask about that? A simple Yes/No?

Is the property the Asset to be added? Is that what you did?

Sorry for the questions! and Thank you! Trying to do what I can myself 

Slowplod

Hi, you and your brother are the beneficiaries of the trust.  Potential beneficiaries are people who only benefit in certain circumstances, i.e. my mums will left her share of the house to myself and my brother and sister (the beneficiaries) but if one of us passed away before the trust finished (my step dad died or remarried) their share would go to their children (so each child is a potential beneficiary as only benefits if their parent dies).  I put potential beneficiaries under "class of beneficiary".

For the name of the Trust I put "The Will Trust of  (mums name).

Re capacity it was just a yes/no but as I answered yes it didn't ask anything else. Not sure if you put no whether more questions would be shown.

I wasn't asked anything about the assets of the trust. When I queried this with the helpline I was told it was because I had answered no to the question whether the trust had paid any tax in the past. I was told that if the trust ever needed to pay tax I would have to amend the details on the trust registration and then I would have to fill in details about the assets.

Hope this helps, don't worry if you need to ask anything else, quite happy to help if I can.

RnK136

Hi @Linwhite,

It is 2 years since Mum died on 6 February so that means the will trust becomes registrable for us.

Do I understand this bit of the HMRC information correctly (below) in that I have 90 days after 6 February to complete the registration?

I'm wondering what happens if my Dad dies within that time frame? I think I have to register the trust and then immediately notify it as ceased because whatever happens from 6 February it exists, even if only for a short time? I think that's what the second paragraph says.

Registration Deadlines

Non-taxable trusts

Registrable non-taxable express trusts that were in existence on or after 6 October 2020 must register within 90 days of becoming registrable, or on or before 1 September 2022 (whichever is later).

This includes trusts that were in existence on or after 6 October 2020 but have since ceased. Trustees should register such trusts on TRS with the required information and then are able to immediately close the trust record to record the fact that the trust has ceased.

Where a trust is set up or otherwise becomes registrable in the 90 days immediately prior to 1 September 2022 the trust must instead register within 90 days of the date of creation.

Slowplod

Hi, I don't think the 90 days is relevant for the will trust as you already have the extra 2 years from the date of death which other types of trust don't.  I'm not an expert on the trusts I only know what I have read up when I had to register a trust myself so I may be wrong.  I took it that it had to be registered by the 2 year anniversary of the first death at the latest.  On the death of the second parent you would then have to go back online and close the trust. I registered my trust a few weeks before the 2 years as I wasn't expecting it to end quickly. You may be better ringing the helpline close to 6th February and asking their advice if you believe there is a chance that your dad isn't going to survive for long.  I hope your dad picks up now he's in a care home and survives longer than you expect.

jojebe

Hi. I am in a similar position to you. My aunt died in April 2023 and her will left her 50% of her property as follows: 50% divided equally between her two step-sons and the other 50% between myself and my two cousins, with a life interest in the property for my Uncle. As Executor I've dealt with probate and the finances are now sorted, so I'm moving on to the Trust. The will writers who drew up my aunt and uncles wills and trust say that the trust needs to be "formalised" as well as registered with HMRC. Did either of you do this and, if so, what did it entail? Thanks for the info on filling in the registration - it's very helpful

RnK136

jojebe said:

Hi. I am in a similar position to you. My aunt died in April 2023 and her will left her 50% of her property as follows: 50% divided equally between her two step-sons and the other 50% between myself and my two cousins, with a life interest in the property for my Uncle. As Executor I've dealt with probate and the finances are now sorted, so I'm moving on to the Trust. The will writers who drew up my aunt and uncles wills and trust say that the trust needs to be "formalised" as well as registered with HMRC. Did either of you do this and, if so, what did it entail? Thanks for the info on filling in the registration - it's very helpful

I'm just about to submit the HMRC trust registration for ours now. Really simple to do online actually and once you start (with a new Government Gateway for the trust) you get 28 days to complete it. Get all your info. ready upfront and it's very straightforward.

• The Will trust of [Your Aunt]

• Created on her DOD

• Settlor: your Aunt (Name, DOB, DOD, Nationality, Residency)

• Trustees: ? (who are they in your Aunt's will?) (Names, DOB, Nationality, Residency, Mental capacity yes/no)

• Beneficiaries: 2 step-sons, you, and your 2 cousins (NB: your Uncle is not a beneficiary) (Names, DOB, Nationality, Residency, Mental Capacity yes/no)

@Linwhite was so helpful ♥ and the Wesleyan pdf guide also helped to follow along although it isn't tailored for a will (express) trust registration of a property share, but you can still work with it: https://www.wesleyan.co.uk/help/register-trust

Happy to help if you get stuck!