Self Build PC

scaredofdebt

Hi,

Looking at getting a new PC, I've tended to build my own but the cost savings nowadays seem to be less than they were just a few years ago.

I like the look of this:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B07798R425?tag=track-ecv-uk-308730-21&linkCode=osi&th=1&psc=1&ascsubtag=ecSEPfc1u83jlnuhk8we

But I would want 2 TB SSD and possibly more RAM, if I self build any ideas of cost?

It doesn't state what the motherboard is so I cannot get an accurate price but I reckon I could build that for about £200 less than the price on there and even with the bigger SSD and more RAM would still save a fair bit.

Also, what would be a slightly better GFX card, is it worth getting more/faster RAM and is that processor decent?

Thanks for any advice!

(I do play games but not cutting edge stuff, probably 2-3 year old games)

Neil_Jones

Ram you can probably add yourself, most boards in the last two or three years can take 32 of 64Gb of memory.

The motherboard according to a posted image is this one, though may change without notice:

https://www.msi.com/Motherboard/H310M-PRO-VDH-PLUS/Specification

Tom's Hardware GPU charts suggests the 4060 is becoming mid range card for gaming:

https://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/gpu-hierarchy,4388.html

The processor was introduced Q1, 2022, so its already 18 months old, but computer technology is such that it was already best part of 18 months old when it was first released:

https://ark.intel.com/content/www/us/en/ark/products/134587/intel-core-i512400f-processor-18m-cache-up-to-4-40-ghz.html

Am-I-Paranoid

What is your target budget or is that the limit already? Can you re-use any old parts: my last PSU and case took me from a Core2Quad 6600 through a i5-3570K, i7-3770K and even my Ryzen 7 2700X!!

What is your gaming resolution? 1080P only or are you aiming for 1440P anytime soon? High refresh monitor?

Looking at that build, there's a lot of corners being cut there to fit an RTX4### series card into the build (3 generations old CPU, last gen RAM, etc, etc).... and that RTX4060 is a seriously compromised card for the money.

I'd be tempted to go for a B-series AM5 motherboard (so an AMD Ryzen CPU), so you're not throwing money away with much older spec parts and then you can expand it at a later date. Avoid the A-series motherboards, but any B-series should be good for the next 2-3 generations of CPUs.

This is usually my starting point: https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/guide/wB6MnQ/great-amd-gaming-build and then I use the "customise" option and add/remove items to suit my budget.

Swap out the M.2 drive for a 2Tb version (or I'd recommend adding a 2nd larger, lower spec one for games).

I know the Radeon 6700XT is "last gen", but it has 50% more VRAM, 50% more memory bandwidth... it is around 10% faster than an RTX4060 8Gb now.... and that gap will show even more at 1440P.

Note that Techpowerup classes the RX6700XT as a 1440P gaming card, but the RTX4060 is only good for 1080P at high framerates.... it'll probably still play at 1440P (hell my old GTX1660S was okay for 1440P!), but it will be compromised.

https://www.techpowerup.com/gpu-specs/radeon-rx-6700-xt.c3695

https://www.techpowerup.com/gpu-specs/geforce-rtx-4060.c4107

If you're desperate to go with an Intel, use this as your starting point: https://uk.pcpartpicker.com/guide/Mhwrxr/entry-level-intel-gaming-build it'll still only be able to take the current generation CPU as an upgrade... and it still has the older DDR4, but it feels a better starting point.

Besides, it's £200 cheaper and would give you similar performance to the Amazon one you linked.

Which then gives you £200 to tweak a few things....

#1 I would DEFINITELY change out the case though: £70 extra for something like the Lian Li case from the AMD build or something like a Lian Li O11 Air mini - the microATX motherboard might be okay for THIS build... but that default microATX case will limit future builds and restrict your choice of future motherboards (note: you CAN put a small motherboard in a mid/full tower).

#2 the GPU: Granted that RX6600XT has all the drawbacks of the RTX4060, but at least you're not paying over the odds for it... but I'd almost consider a RX6700XT GPU, so you have the extra VRAM and bandwidth.... or I'd be REALLY tempted with a 2nd hand RTX3080 10Gb (around £300 on eBay), only 10Gb VRAM, but REALLY good memory bandwidth (nearly 3 TIMES that of the RTX4060), so it's still a really solid 1440P card and even 4K in some games - in fact even if you have to stump up £350 for it, it'll still only be £800 all-in.

The CPU is theoretically a lower spec i3-13100F vs i5-12400F, but that i3 is a really solid gamer (higher boost clock, better IPC and although it only has 4 threads, that is all that most games use!)... and the higher spec GPU would more than make up for that.

At least with that build you'll have named components that won't be swapped out on you.... and that way you'll have a solid B-series motherboard, not H (which would struggle on higher spec intel CPU's) - there's a fair chance that an H-series motherboard would be choking even a 12400F, so you might better off with a 13100F on a B-series than a 12400F on an H-series already!

DigSunPap

What is it you are primarily going to be using the PC for? If its mostly gaming but older games you might not need to go all out on the graphics card. I have the NVIDIA RTX3090 which I find is perfect. Not quite top of the range but in my opinion does just as good a job for a lower price.

Cisco001

No chance you will save £200.
The max you could save probably be £100

So how much you want to spend? £600 or £800?

If it is £600, it probably be R5 5500 + RX 6650XT

MattMattMattUK

You could self build the same for considerably less than that, or build something with a much higher spec, so it really depends if budget is your goal, or hitting a certain level of performance. 

akira181

The value in building your own PC just isn't what it used to be IMO. I built my gaming PC a couple years ago with relatively top end stuff (not top top as that's crazy prices) purchased from scan.co.uk and overclockers.co.uk and a friend bought a similar spec from pcspecialist.co.uk a couple months after me. 

IIRC, he only paid £100 more than me. Going for a custom prebuilt, you get some (albeit limited) flexibility in choice of components (at cost), comes fully assembled, cables routed neatly, tested, no compatibility issues, and has a guarantee. It's a no brainer when it's the price difference is so little IMO.

When it came to delivery of parts for me, DPD lost the PC Case and I had to wait 48 hours for DPD to confirm it lost and overclockers to refund me. Then they were sold out of the case I bought and I had to go elsewhere, pay extra for postage, and all in all, it took me a week before I could assemble my PC.

In addition, when you build PCs often enough, you eventually get a defective on delivery RAM chip, defective hardware slot on a motherboard, case/cooler combo incompatible, etc, and then you'll really wish you went pre-built after wasting a weekend or more troubleshooting, scanning, BSODs, RMA's, swapping hardware slots, etc.

I guess the saving depends on what you want the PC for as that'll dictate the components. If I was saving £300 to £400, then I'd say building and risking the hassle is worth it. If it's just £100 or £200, I'd rather spend my time using the new PC.

MattMattMattUK

akira181 said:

The value in building your own PC just isn't what it used to be IMO. I built my gaming PC a couple years ago with relatively top end stuff (not top top as that's crazy prices) purchased from scan.co.uk and overclockers.co.uk and a friend bought a similar spec from pcspecialist.co.uk a couple months after me. 

IIRC, he only paid £100 more than me. 

I would say that differential seems quite a way short of comparison, I built myself a new PC in mid 2022, 12900k, 64GB of DDR5, RTX 3090, plenty of M.2 storage, decent MB etc. and it cost me £550 less than the nearest pre-build of similar spec but with no control over the brands of components. Even now, looking at pre-built vs self build if I was building something I wanted now (Ryzen 9 7950X3D or 13900k and a 4090) it would be around £600 cheaper to self build even if I had to buy everything new again and I could reuse my current case, PSU, RAM and storage at a minimum making it even cheaper. 

akira181 said:

Then they were sold out of the case I bought and I had to go elsewhere, pay extra for postage, and all in all, it took me a week before I could assemble my PC.

These days everything turns up next day.

akira181 said:

In addition, when you build PCs often enough, you eventually get a defective on delivery RAM chip, defective hardware slot on a motherboard, case/cooler combo incompatible, etc, and then you'll really wish you went pre-built after wasting a weekend or more troubleshooting, scanning, BSODs, RMA's, swapping hardware slots, etc.

I have probably averaged a new build/significant upgrade every 18 months to two years for the last two decades, I might have been lucky but I have only have an issue once and that was a RAM socket on a motherboard. Case/cooler issues are user error so they should not be included in hardware issues. 

akira181 said:

I guess the saving depends on what you want the PC for as that'll dictate the components. If I was saving £300 to £400, then I'd say building and risking the hassle is worth it. If it's just £100 or £200, I'd rather spend my time using the new PC.

If you want anything mid-range or above then you will still save significant amounts, more so if you can reuse components. It takes less than half an hour to do the basics of the physical build, about an hour to install software whilst doing other things at the same time. I usually then go back and tidy cables up a week or so later once I know everything works fine which usually takes about another half hour to make everything nice and tidy, cables in jackets and kept clear round the sides etc. I also view it as time well spent, I know what I am getting and I can upgrade something any time I want. I know others will take ease over cost, but for me it seems crazy to throw money away. 

Edit to add: I also do not want loads of stupid lights on my PC, an advantage of self build is I am not paying for those that nearly every pre-build seems to insist on sticking in now. 

Cisco001

akira181 said:

The value in building your own PC just isn't what it used to be IMO. I built my gaming PC a couple years ago with relatively top end stuff (not top top as that's crazy prices) purchased from scan.co.uk and overclockers.co.uk and a friend bought a similar spec from pcspecialist.co.uk a couple months after me. 

IIRC, he only paid £100 more than me. Going for a custom prebuilt, you get some (albeit limited) flexibility in choice of components (at cost), comes fully assembled, cables routed neatly, tested, no compatibility issues, and has a guarantee. It's a no brainer when it's the price difference is so little IMO.

When it came to delivery of parts for me, DPD lost the PC Case and I had to wait 48 hours for DPD to confirm it lost and overclockers to refund me. Then they were sold out of the case I bought and I had to go elsewhere, pay extra for postage, and all in all, it took me a week before I could assemble my PC.

In addition, when you build PCs often enough, you eventually get a defective on delivery RAM chip, defective hardware slot on a motherboard, case/cooler combo incompatible, etc, and then you'll really wish you went pre-built after wasting a weekend or more troubleshooting, scanning, BSODs, RMA's, swapping hardware slots, etc.

I guess the saving depends on what you want the PC for as that'll dictate the components. If I was saving £300 to £400, then I'd say building and risking the hassle is worth it. If it's just £100 or £200, I'd rather spend my time using the new PC.

The main problem of these prebuilt is their limited choice of PSU and the upgrade option are usually crap anyway...
And when you want a slightly better motherboard, they charge you a fortune for the 'upgrade'.

Neil_Jones

Cisco001 said:

akira181 said:

The value in building your own PC just isn't what it used to be IMO. I built my gaming PC a couple years ago with relatively top end stuff (not top top as that's crazy prices) purchased from scan.co.uk and overclockers.co.uk and a friend bought a similar spec from pcspecialist.co.uk a couple months after me. 

IIRC, he only paid £100 more than me. Going for a custom prebuilt, you get some (albeit limited) flexibility in choice of components (at cost), comes fully assembled, cables routed neatly, tested, no compatibility issues, and has a guarantee. It's a no brainer when it's the price difference is so little IMO.

When it came to delivery of parts for me, DPD lost the PC Case and I had to wait 48 hours for DPD to confirm it lost and overclockers to refund me. Then they were sold out of the case I bought and I had to go elsewhere, pay extra for postage, and all in all, it took me a week before I could assemble my PC.

In addition, when you build PCs often enough, you eventually get a defective on delivery RAM chip, defective hardware slot on a motherboard, case/cooler combo incompatible, etc, and then you'll really wish you went pre-built after wasting a weekend or more troubleshooting, scanning, BSODs, RMA's, swapping hardware slots, etc.

I guess the saving depends on what you want the PC for as that'll dictate the components. If I was saving £300 to £400, then I'd say building and risking the hassle is worth it. If it's just £100 or £200, I'd rather spend my time using the new PC.

The main problem of these prebuilt is their limited choice of PSU and the upgrade option are usually crap anyway...
And when you want a slightly better motherboard, they charge you a fortune for the 'upgrade'.

Well they will do, as the prebuilt / branded systems are built down to a price and mass manufactured.

If you want something different it becomes bespoke and attracts surcharges.

If you just want something that works, a prebuild / branded system will full the need, but don't be surprised if the up gradability is limited - as they make more money from new sales further down the line rather than you shoving a new thingyjamig inside the doobry firkin

Am-I-Paranoid

There are a VERY small handful that are exceptions to this guideline, but normally prebuilds will tend to cut corners to make a margin... things to look out for include:
1) nasty motherboards (H-series or A-series, depending on the CPU) - they'll run an entry level CPU with compromised memory speeds and in the case of the Intel 12gen onward, will throttle even the entry level CPUs.
2) no-name PSU's with a high "###W" rating, but often very poor quality: shorter life, less stability,
3) a poorly designed case: possibly a "big name", but one that's being heavily discounted once people realise the airflow is awful
4) lower spec RAM that has one impressive number, but is actually a lower quality version of the genuine performance parts... e.g. DDR4 that's "3600MT/sec", but CAS18+ or  DDR5 that's "6000MT.sec", but CAS 36+
5) cheap fans.... once you're putting 4 or more in a case the costs add up.... cheap fans are about £4 each wholesale... and an entry level Noctua is £13.... that £36 (4x£9) savings for the company is all they care about.... but you end up with high noise + low airflow...