Gemini Parking Solutions - Sept 2023

RedCuppa

Good afternoon all,

Hoping for some guidance. A little bit of background:

Gemini Parking Solutions sent me (keeper) a PCN, it arrived 17 days after the date it says the driver 'parked' in their car park (even though the date on the letter is a full 5 days before I received it). The duration they state is 28 minutes.

1. I've complained to the establishment and have just been told that they won't discuss it and that I should go directly to Gemini. I've raised a complaint and received no response thus far. I will chase this today.

2. I've sent Gemini the blue template (through their appeals process as per the PCN) and in response they have sent me the following (details removed to protect anonymity however, let me know if this is required for better guidance); 

Dear [x],

Re: Parking Charge Notice Number [x] (Vehicle: [x]

Site: [x]

Issue date: [x]/09/2023

We refer to correspondence received from you concerning the above numbered Charge Notice.

Please note that responsibility for this Charge lies with the driver of the vehicle at the time the parking contravention was observed. However, we are unable to ascertain who the driver was on the date in questions from the information given within your appeal.

In order for us to process your appeal correctly, please follow the instructions below:

1. Notify the driver of the vehicle that they will need to appeal to us directly, including their FULL NAME (Forename and Surname) and a valid FULL SERVICEABLE ADDRESS within 14 days.

 2. If you are representing the driver we require a signed and dated statement from the driver of the vehicle confirming that you are authorised to appeal on his/her behalf; this needs to be an original signature and not a photocopy or a stamp. The statement MUST contain the drivers FULL NAME (Forename and Surname) and a valid FULL SERVICEABLE ADDRESS.

Please ensure that correspondence is sent to APCOA Parking, PO Box 815, Wigan, WN1 9WX in order to correctly adhere with the appeals process.

OR

3. Pay the PCN. Payments can be made online at www.geminiparkingsolutions.com by following the links for "Pay Now" It is your responsibility to ensure that payment is received within our office by the date specified.

As a gesture of goodwill we have placed the charge on hold for an additional period of 14 Days to enable one of the above actions to be complied with.

We are willing to re-offer you the original discounted charge of £60 as full and final settlement of this Notice, if payment is received within our office on or before the [x]/10/23

If payment is not received by this date, the amount payable will revert to £100, payable by [x]/11/23. Failure to pay this charge within the stated times, may result in Debt Recovery action been taken and further costs up to an additional £70.00 been incurred.

Yours sincerely,

Appeals Department

So, a few questions here; 

1. I understand that this is pretty much copy and paste. However, they haven't (on this response, but they did on the original PCN) said anything about keeper liability if they can't pin down the driver. Does this mean I should just respond and ask them to find the driver as I'm not liable? in order words, go fish.

2. They've stated for me to 'correctly adhere to appeals process' via APCOA. The original PCN does not provide any details re APCOA so my initial appeal was lodged with Gemini (through their website). Should I now appeal through APCOA as keeper, same blue template etc? Will Gemini even be notified that I've appealed? (Having read through the forum, the general guidance with APCOA seems to be to string it out for 6 months, at which point they'll just give up. Is this still the case?).

Thanks everyone, and I appreciate that this is 'just another PCN' to the veterans, but just hoping for a bit of guidance to 'fight the good fight'.

KeithP

Hello and welcome.

I suggest you ignore that letter and simply wait patiently for your appeal to be rejected and then file a PoPLA appeal as described in the third post of the NEWBIES thread.

RedCuppa

KeithP said:

Hello and welcome.

I suggest you ignore that letter and simply wait patiently for your appeal to be rejected and then file a PoPLA appeal as described in the third post of the NEWBIES thread.

Thanks Keith. I thought this letter meant that they weren't accepting my appeal as keeper and that the appeal needs to be made by the driver who they can't verify? Do you mean I should appeal to APCOA as per their letter and wait for that to be rejected?

UncleThomasCobley

Does the original NtK mention PoFA 2012? If so, what exactly does it state. Regarding the date you received the NtK is irrelevant. What is relevant is the date of the alleged contravention and the date of the NtK. Please tell us those dates.

Coupon-mad

Or do this and tell them to either let you appeal as keeper, or go straight to court if they think they have a case, and not add the fake £70 that the Government is set to ban because you will not be paying a debt crawler:

 Does this mean I should just respond and ask them to find the driver as I'm not liable? in order words, go fish.

RedCuppa

UncleThomasCobley said:

Does the original NtK mention PoFA 2012? If so, what exactly does it state. Regarding the date you received the NtK is irrelevant. What is relevant is the date of the alleged contravention and the date of the NtK. Please tell us those dates.

Thanks for your post UncleThomasCobley. Date of the supposed contravention is 8th Sept. Date on the NtK is 20th Sept.

Coupon-mad said:

Or do this and tell them to either let you appeal as keeper, or go straight to court if they think they have a case, and not add the fake £70 that the Government is set to ban because you will not be paying a debt crawler:

 Does this mean I should just respond and ask them to find the driver as I'm not liable? in order words, go fish.

Thanks Coupon-mad. Would rather get them to just cancel this charge than go all the way to court. The thought of going to court makes me nervous..

KeithP

RedCuppa said:

KeithP said:

Hello and welcome.

I suggest you ignore that letter and simply wait patiently for your appeal to be rejected and then file a PoPLA appeal as described in the third post of the NEWBIES thread.

Thanks Keith. I thought this letter meant that they weren't accepting my appeal as keeper and that the appeal needs to be made by the driver who they can't verify? Do you mean I should appeal to APCOA as per their letter and wait for that to be rejected?

No, that's not what I meant.
They have not rejected your appeal yet.
They are waiting for you to name the driver before they reject your appeal.
Do not name the driver.
As I said earlier, do nothing but wait for their appeal rejection and then move on to PoPLA.

Coupon-mad

RedCuppa said:

UncleThomasCobley said:

Does the original NtK mention PoFA 2012? If so, what exactly does it state. Regarding the date you received the NtK is irrelevant. What is relevant is the date of the alleged contravention and the date of the NtK. Please tell us those dates.

Thanks for your post UncleThomasCobley. Date of the supposed contravention is 8th Sept. Date on the NtK is 20th Sept.

Coupon-mad said:

Or do this and tell them to either let you appeal as keeper, or go straight to court if they think they have a case, and not add the fake £70 that the Government is set to ban because you will not be paying a debt crawler:

 Does this mean I should just respond and ask them to find the driver as I'm not liable? in order words, go fish.

Thanks Coupon-mad. Would rather get them to just cancel this charge than go all the way to court. The thought of going to court makes me nervous..

They aren't going to cancel it and you won't win at appeal, and they don't do court!

My advice was given for a reason. 

1505grandad

Not forgetting Gemini are IPC AoS members

RedCuppa

1505grandad said:

Not forgetting Gemini are IPC AoS members

Does this mean that I don't have the opportunity to appeal through PoPLA?

UncleThomasCobley

RedCuppa said:

1505grandad said:

Not forgetting Gemini are IPC AoS members

Does this mean that I don't have the opportunity to appeal through PoPLA?

POPLA is only for BPA members. They are IPC members and use their incestuous IAS appeals service which is little more than a sham.