Worried about benefits review and going over £6K savings limit

CGold

Hi, 

I need to find out what to do about having gone over my savings limit on UC. I'm hoping people won't judge me as my situation is complicated & difficult. I think I have ADHD (as flagged by an NHS psychologist; I'm on the wait list for a diagnosis, but it's REALLY long). Like many people with ADHD, I find organising myself extremely difficult, and finances especially so as I find money issues very anxiety-inducing. My mum is also very mentally ill and has been for years, which takes a lot of time & energy to deal with. Yesterday we actually had to have her admitted to hospital for the first time as an inpatient, so we are going through a terrible time as a family.

When I began claiming benefits last year, I agreed with my parents (who I live with) to pay them back for a car and a computer they had bought me (both of which were necessary purchases to replace broken items.) We've also agreed I should pay them some money for rent & bills as I live with them, but we haven't sorted out what this should be yet, due to how chaotic & difficult life has been. I won't have enough for the 'going rate' given I can't claim housing help from UC when I live with parents, so it will be what I can afford to contribute & they agree to. They are fairly well-off, so aren't too rushed about when I pay them back for things, plus they are very busy with trying to keep their business going whilst my mum is ill. So having a conversation about rent amounts has just not been something we've managed to do yet, it keeps getting put off. As a result, at times I've had far too much in my account (£12,000 at one point I think). Since then I've paid them back for the computer & car, as those were both amounts I knew what they were, but we still haven't agreed on what rent should be.

My folks want me to have some savings as we are hoping to move soon and I'll either be in my own flat or an annex next to their house, and either way I'll need some savings to set-up home. I've never lived on my own before so I have none of the things I need, plus most of my furniture is very old / broken & needs replacing. If it's an annex it may even need building work or a kitchen or bathroom installing, but my parents may pay for part of that. I may also need to pay for a private ADHD diagnosis so I begin to get help & have access to medication, as the waiting list is years long ATM. A diagnosis could be £1,000 or so. Even £6,000 may not cover everything, but hopefully you can see why I need as much in savings as I'm allowed.

I had thought perhaps if I spend what I need for the month, then transfer anything over the £6,000 limit I'm allowed in savings to them to contribute to me living here, that would be ok, but then a friend of mine said that could be seen in a bad way, which really worries me as I now have a UC review coming up. I have already done this a couple of times, transferring odd amounts to bring my account to just under £6K. She didn't know if it might be seen as transferring money to other people as 'deprivation of capital', but surely as I live in my parent's house, paying them something in rent is acceptable? I just don't know if they'll see it that way if it's irregular amounts.

I haven't told UC about the times I'd gone over £6K, as I knew I'd be paying them back for car / computer / missed rent when we got around to it, but I'm really worried if I'll be in trouble now.

Thanks for reading if you got this far, sorry it's such a downer of a post! I'd really appreciate any help or advice on what to do, this situation is really adding to my stress and I know I should have worked out what to do sooner, but avoiding difficult tasks is very common for people with ADHD and obviously my family situation is really hard.

I don't know if having excess money in my account counts if I was saving it to pay people back for things I owe them?

I also had some back payment for benefits, I don't know if they're discounted for a certain length of time. There was £1,300 for PIP on 16 Sep 2022 and £1,000 for LCWRA on 9 Nov 2022.

Sorry this message is so long & rambling! I'm barely able to concentrate between my mum calling me from hospital, but I have to get my bank statements in by 13th Oct for this review. I just need any advice / info I can get. Should I ask in my journal to speak to someone? What should I say? I'm most grateful for any help anyone can give.

Alice_Holt

The benefits back payments will only count towards your savings and capital limit if you have any money left over after one year.
It's disregarded for the first 12 months.

As long as you didn't go over £16k at the end of your assessment period your UC will continue.

The savings above £6k will be subject to tariff income, assumed to equate to an income of £4.35 per month for each £250 over £6,000.
So you will have an UC overpayment to settle.

I'd get evidence to substantiate repayment of the car and computer. Get your Dad to confirm this in writing before the review..

What type of review is it?

I'd tend to advise in your journal that you are over the £6k limit (albeit after the event).

poppy12345

If at anytime you had more than £6,000 on the last day of each assessment period then yes, you should have reported the changes. There's a £4.35/month deduction for every £250 or part thereof over that amount. You would of course need to minus the money owed to you for your benefits last year.

With transferring amounts to someone else's account then this could cause issues if the transfers were often and regular. If they can see it's to keep your savings under the £6,000 then yes there could be issues. It will be down to a decision maker to make the final decision on that.

The worst that could happen is a small fine of about £50 and you'll need to repay back any UC overpayment. PIP isn't affected by savings but the money you have left from it at the end of the period it's paid for, will be classed as capital.

Spoonie_Turtle

The rules around capital are reasonably simple BUT sorting out what's what can be quite a task, especially when you've got other more urgent things going on requiring your attention.

I'd advise trying to get help from the CAB, or some other accredited benefits advice agency to get everything straight with bank statements from the first time you went over £6,000 (not including benefits backpay) and working out how much you had when.  Because income only becomes capital at the end of the assessment period after you received it, and I'm not 100% sure I'd trust UC to get it right the first time of looking at bank statements etc.

Apologies if I've missed it, but have you not told them yet?  I didn't see reference to them being aware yet.  I'd advise contacting the CAB and then sending a journal message to UC as soon as possible, today or tomorrow - in your message you can say you're trying to get an appointment for advice to help you work it all out, but you definitely need to tell UC now that you've realised they need to know.

Saving money for a specific purpose still counts as savings.

But as already advised above, savings wouldn't close your UC claim unless they went to £16,000 so you don't have to worry too much about that, just about them getting the overpayment amount right based on how much you've had and how you've used the amounts over £6,000.

CGold

Alice_Holt said:

I'd get evidence to substantiate repayment of the car and computer. Get your Dad to confirm this in writing before the review..

I have receipts for the car & the computer, and I have bank statements showing me paying those same amounts to my parents, albeit some time later. The car was purchased in Aug 2020, but we had agreed at the time I'd pay them back when I could. I can get a note from my dad to say he required me to pay him back, although not right now because he really is near exhaustion dealing with my mum. He's barely slept in days. Even now she's in hospital, he's in a hotel nearby so he can visit her everyday (the hospital is in London, a couple of hours from home.) My sister & best friend also know about the computer & car so could be witnesses?

CGold

Alice_Holt said:

What type of review is it?

I'm not sure what you mean or how to find this out? I've been asked to upload ID and my last 4 months of bank statements if that tells you anything.

poppy12345

Alice_Holt said:

What type of review is it?

Seems like it's just a review to make sure everything is correct with their UC claim. I've heard of quite a few people having these recently.

CGold

poppy12345 said:

With transferring amounts to someone else's account then this could cause issues if the transfers were often and regular. If they can see it's to keep your savings under the £6,000 then yes there could be issues. It will be down to a decision maker to make the final decision on that. 

Am I not even allowed to pay my parents some money for rent, bills and upkeep when I am living in their home? That seems so strange to me.

CGold

Spoonie_Turtle said:

The rules around capital are reasonably simple BUT sorting out what's what can be quite a task, especially when you've got other more urgent things going on requiring your attention.

I'd advise trying to get help from the CAB, or some other accredited benefits advice agency to get everything straight with bank statements from the first time you went over £6,000 (not including benefits backpay) and working out how much you had when.  Because income only becomes capital at the end of the assessment period after you received it, and I'm not 100% sure I'd trust UC to get it right the first time of looking at bank statements etc.

Apologies if I've missed it, but have you not told them yet?  I didn't see reference to them being aware yet.  I'd advise contacting the CAB and then sending a journal message to UC as soon as possible, today or tomorrow - in your message you can say you're trying to get an appointment for advice to help you work it all out, but you definitely need to tell UC now that you've realised they need to know.

Saving money for a specific purpose still counts as savings.

But as already advised above, savings wouldn't close your UC claim unless they went to £16,000 so you don't have to worry too much about that, just about them getting the overpayment amount right based on how much you've had and how you've used the amounts over £6,000.

I didn't know agencies like Citizen's Advice did this? I have recently organised my finances more, setting up my own spreadsheet. I'm not too bad at maths either, so I don't know if I might be able to work it out myself? 

I haven't told them yet, no.

I haven't gone over £12,000, but if they don't accept any of the amounts I paid to my parents (for the car, the computer & the two times I paid them irregular amounts for rent), if they decide any of that counts as mine ('notional capital') I think it's called, then that could be a problem. I'm hoping they won't though!

HillStreetBlues

OP please don't worry, the overpayment  will not be as much as you think, as been pointed out there will be money that won't be included in the £6k limit
Any COL payments, any benefit payments in that month,  disregarded back payments, it's amazing how they add up.
I also wouldn't trust UC to calculate any back payments correctly.

Also it would be reasonable to have to pay your parents back once you got the correct awards from UC & PIP

itsthelittlethings

CGold said:

poppy12345 said:

With transferring amounts to someone else's account then this could cause issues if the transfers were often and regular. If they can see it's to keep your savings under the £6,000 then yes there could be issues. It will be down to a decision maker to make the final decision on that. 

Am I not even allowed to pay my parents some money for rent, bills and upkeep when I am living in their home? That seems so strange to me.

It's your choice to pay your parents money for rent, bills and upkeep. I think that is fine. Just explain that is what it is.