Consumer advice - please

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head

tightauldgit said:

The only possible complication I can see is that if the doors were never delivered to you then I'm not sure if the contract has completed and you have actually taken legal ownership of them. In which case you'd have to pursue the person you had a contract with for breach of contract potentially. 

I believe this is still governed by the Sale of Goods Act and title for specific goods passes when the contract is formed if the goods are in a deliverable state.

Presumable OP would have been free to take them at any point so they were in a deliverable state. 

The only thing I'm unsure of here, OP are these doors sitting in the middle of a showroom or actually installed into the building (sorry if it's a obvious question)  

Tea_biscuits

sheramber said:

Are you saying the seller took out the orignal showroon doors and replqced them with yours. He put the orignal showroom doors in the container.

So, the doors you paid for are still in situ in the showroom?

Do you have legal cover on your house insurance?

Yes that's exactly it.  And no I don't think we have legal cover

Tea_biscuits

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head said:

tightauldgit said:

The only possible complication I can see is that if the doors were never delivered to you then I'm not sure if the contract has completed and you have actually taken legal ownership of them. In which case you'd have to pursue the person you had a contract with for breach of contract potentially. 

I believe this is still governed by the Sale of Goods Act and title for specific goods passes when the contract is formed if the goods are in a deliverable state.

Presumable OP would have been free to take them at any point so they were in a deliverable state. 

The only thing I'm unsure of here, OP are these doors sitting in the middle of a showroom or actually installed into the building (sorry if it's a obvious question)  

They are still installed within the building and in full use by the new tenant daily. 

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head

Tea_biscuits said:

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head said:

tightauldgit said:

The only possible complication I can see is that if the doors were never delivered to you then I'm not sure if the contract has completed and you have actually taken legal ownership of them. In which case you'd have to pursue the person you had a contract with for breach of contract potentially. 

I believe this is still governed by the Sale of Goods Act and title for specific goods passes when the contract is formed if the goods are in a deliverable state.

Presumable OP would have been free to take them at any point so they were in a deliverable state. 

The only thing I'm unsure of here, OP are these doors sitting in the middle of a showroom or actually installed into the building (sorry if it's a obvious question)  

They are still installed within the building and in full use by the new tenant daily. 

Was they like that at the time? 

If so it may be that title didn't pass but we kind of go back to professional advice to see exactly where you stand as what "deliverable state" actually means could be questionable beyond what any of us here know other than by guessing  

Tea_biscuits

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head said:

Tea_biscuits said:

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head said:

tightauldgit said:

The only possible complication I can see is that if the doors were never delivered to you then I'm not sure if the contract has completed and you have actually taken legal ownership of them. In which case you'd have to pursue the person you had a contract with for breach of contract potentially. 

I believe this is still governed by the Sale of Goods Act and title for specific goods passes when the contract is formed if the goods are in a deliverable state.

Presumable OP would have been free to take them at any point so they were in a deliverable state. 

The only thing I'm unsure of here, OP are these doors sitting in the middle of a showroom or actually installed into the building (sorry if it's a obvious question)  

They are still installed within the building and in full use by the new tenant daily. 

Was they like that at the time? 

If so it may be that title didn't pass but we kind of go back to professional advice to see exactly where you stand as what "deliverable state" actually means could be questionable beyond what any of us here know other than by guessing  

Yes they are the display doors I have purchased that were and still are fitted at the front of the unit. 

sheramber

Do you have proof that these particular doors are the doors you have paid for?

Tea_biscuits

sheramber said:

Do you have proof that these particular doors are the doors you have paid for?

I have a receipt that says  "EX DISPLAY. 5 PART BI FOLD DOORS. FITTED IN SHOWROOM"

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head

In this exact situation I think it's hard to say OP.

Either you had title to the doors and the landlord needs to allow you to collect them

Or you don't have title to the doors and you need to chase the person you paid (which sadly would be pointless if it was an LTD that has no assets and is going to be dissolved). 

I think you need to determine whether you had title but I'm not sure we are qualified to say unless someone has case law to post which supports one way or the other.

You can search case law:

https://www.bailii.org/form/search_cases.html

There are a bunch of cases with the exact term "deliverable state" but you'd have to read through and see if any relate to a situation similar to this  

Alderbank

There are property law issues here.

Fixtures and fittings installed by the tenant become the property of the landlord because the principle of property law is that the owner of the land (the person registered in the land registry) owns the land and any permanent buildings and their fixtures and fittings regardless of who might have paid for them.

Where a tenant has carried out works which improve the rental value of the property he can in some circumstances claim compensation from the landlord when he quits the property but that requires knowledge of the Landlord & Tenant Act 1927, specifically sections 1, 2 and 3, Compensations and Alterations.

tl:dr When the doors were fitted to the premises they became the landlord's property.

Grumpy_chap

Alderbank said:

There are property law issues here.

Fixtures and fittings installed by the tenant become the property of the landlord

tl:dr When the doors were fitted to the premises they became the landlord's property.

I am not sure that the doors count as fixtures and fittings in this case, even if fitted to a display wall.

The doors would be F&F if installed in a functional way in the building.

However, AIUI, there is a display space with several "false" walls into which different types of doors and windows are fitted.  Other than displaying the goods (doors and windows) these false walls serve no purpose.