Wholesale energy down up to 85%; Retail energy down 10-15%?

matelodave

Probably a pointless thread

MattMattMattUK

goldConsidered said:

Matt_drummer - price cap is not what consumers end up paying. One has to look at the standing and unit tariffs. People know they are paying multiples of what they were paying merely 2 years ago. And yet wholesale prices are around the level they were August 2021…

This is a massive scandal, that some people are attempting to cover up!

It is not a "massive scandal", the issue is you do not understand the energy market, nothing more. 

QrizB

goldConsidered said:

Matt_drummer - price cap is not what consumers end up paying.

The price cap is, quite literally, what consumers end up paying.

goldConsidered said:

One has to look at the standing and unit tariffs.

The cap is a cap on standing charges and unit prices.

You should read this thread where the price cap, how it's calculated and how it works, is discussed. There's a link to that thread in my signature at the bottom of every one of my posts.

goldConsidered said:

This is a massive scandal, that some people are attempting to cover up!

Still not a scandal.

MultiFuelBurner

goldConsidered said:

Real figures to back my assertion regarding wholesale energy prices (these are irrefutable open market prices):

GAS:

December 2022: 380p / thm

29 September 2023: 107p / thm

A FALL OF 72%

ELECTRICITY:

September 2022: £580 / MWh

29 September 2023: £87 / MWh

A FALL OF 85%

I can see how you might wrongly come to that conclusion. However, if you read the responses to your post there is a chance to educate yourself on wholesale energy prices, price caps, government subsidies and why the prices are what they are now.

double_dutchy

There is also a time lag which affects the price cap. Today's price cap was calculated based on wholesale prices from mid Feb to mid May. The new price cap (from 1st October) was calculated based on wholesale prices from mid May to Mid August.

When wholesale prices are falling that time lag will keep the price cap generally higher than the current wholesale prices, when wholesale prices are rising the opposite will be true.

matt_drummer

goldConsidered said:

Matt_drummer - price cap is not what consumers end up paying. One has to look at the standing and unit tariffs. People know they are paying multiples of what they were paying merely 2 years ago. And yet wholesale prices are around the level they were August 2021…

This is a massive scandal, that some people are attempting to cover up!

No, the price cap is not what consumers end up paying.

It is the most they can be charged on a standard variable tariff.

Some standard variable tariffs are below the price cap.

As others have pointed out, you don't understand how energy prices and the price caps are derived.

You have also failed to take account of government support from the energy price guarantee.

Prices have fallen in the last nine months by more than half.

The reason they haven't fallen as much as wholesale prices has been explained to you.

There is no scandal which is why nobody is talking about it.

goldConsidered

There seems a CONcerted effort to cover up this scandal.

Consumers, like myself, know exactly how much more they have to pay now compared to 2 / 6 even 18 years ago, no matter how much some people try to hoodwink us.

Another actual statistic: Wholesale gas prices are roughly the same as they were in 2005, 18 years ago! Wholesale electricity prices are roughly the same as they were early 2017! How much are retail prices now compared to 2005 and 2017?

This is a massive scandal that some people are trying to cover up!

GingerTim

What is it they say about a little knowledge being a dangerous thing?

Netexporter

goldConsidered said:

There seems a CONcerted effort to cover up this scandal.

Consumers, like myself, know exactly how much more they have to pay now compared to 2 / 6 even 18 years ago, no matter how much some people try to hoodwink us.

Another actual statistic: Wholesale gas prices are roughly the same as they were in 2005, 18 years ago! Wholesale electricity prices are roughly the same as they were early 2017! How much are retail prices now compared to 2005 and 2017?

This is a massive scandal that some people are trying to cover up!

As I said, if you want to pay less then go on Agile, or other wholesale tracking tariffs, then as long as you use energy only at the cheapest times you'll be quids in. If you want to be able to use energy at any time then you will pay a premium.

goldConsidered

Netexporter - most people don’t have the luxury nor the capacity to avail cheaper energy.

Another very startling statistic - the smoking gun. Energy company profits have soared to record territory this year. British Gas alone made profits of almost £1 billion just during the first 6 months of 2023!

This is a massive scandal that some people are still trying to cover up!