OVO Estimated Bill Woes

Gromit07

Hi all!

I'm having some terrible issues with OVO. They reckon that I haven't given them a meter reading in well over a year, and because of that, all the bills they have sent me were estimates. So even though I always paid those bills (By Cheque) they have now, after I recently gave them a meter reading, recalculated those bills added a hefty amount on top to the tune of what they say is £1,643.04

Now there are a few points I'd like to query after this, but I believe that solely based on the numbers something is wrong. Looking at their last estimate, and the meter reading I gave them I've worked this out:

Estimated CLOSING meter readings for, 27th of May 2023

PEAK: 69005.770 (Est)

OFF-PEAK: 4411.830 (Est)

 

Actual meter reading given on 5th of June 2023

PEAK: 72100 (Actual)

OFF-PEAK: 04854 (Actual)

 

Difference

Peak: 3,095

Off-peak: 443

At CURRENT rates that difference equates to peak £1056.32 (@34.13p) and off-peak £96.71 (@21.83p) Total: £1,153.03

However the Bill April 28th to May 2023 27th closing balance £1,455.02 . This means I'm indebted by £300 more than estimated? 

And when I dug a bit deeper into previous bills, and ran the numbers myself to work out the last year or so's energy usage I got this:

Reading from 31st of March 2022:

Peak: 68007

Off-Peak: 01921

Reading from June 5th 2023:

Peak: 72100

Off-Peak: 04854

Difference

Peak: 4093

Off-Peak: 2933

At CURRENT rates that equates to peak £1396.94 (@34.13p) and off-peak £640.27 (@21.83p) Total: £2,037.21 which is over 431 days so we add the current standing charge per day (@53.36), giving us £229.98, and a grand total of £2,267.19 making that £5.2603 a day.

 

Figures used for the next bit:

Reading difference and standing charge from 31st of March 2022 to June 5th 2023: £2,267.19

Total payments from 30th April 2022 to 12th June 2023: £1,772.61

28th July 2022 to 27th August 2022 bill shows a closing balance of £258.50 in debt.

 

2,267.19 - 1,772.61 + 258 = £752.58

So, while the 28 May – 27 Jun 2023 bill shows a closing debt of £1,438.17 we should be much closer to £752.58??? I do understand that this is at current rates, and energy prices have been higher historically, but using the highest rates I could find on any of my bills (Which I was only on for about a month, then they dipped down again) for the whole year the above works out to:

Bill 28 Sep – 27 Oct 2022 shows the highest rates of:

Peak: £42.90p

Off-Peak: £21.91p

grand total of: £2,628.5 Taking that number of £2,628.5, we minus the payments of £1,772.61, and add the debt of £258 bringing the worst case total debt to £1,113.89 which is still lower than the 28 May – 27 Jun 2023 bill's closing debt of £1,438.17. 

So, as I initially said, to me these numbers don't look right at all!? Though perhaps you can spot something I haven't - after spending hours looking at them I'm a bit frazzled.

And now, on top of all that I could've sworn that I gave meter readings more recently, over the phone. Unfortunately, I have no record of it so can't prove that; BUT I do have an ace up my sleeve here as a meter reading man visited last year just after Christmas. He was from Ovo and had a uniform and all but no reading was logged after his visit, or not one that I can see in my account at least. This makes me worry that the other meter readings I gave over the phone weren't logged into their system either, which is what caused this issue. Ergo, this is their (Ovo's) fault and at least some of the debt should be forgiven because they've lost my meter readings and that is what led to this situation.

On top of that! I've had no reminders to give a meter reading and no communication about this debt at any point. Not even so much as a bill since June. The (Awful) support agent I spoke to said there have been bills since then, but they never arrived in the post and the Agent refused to re-send them. The agent said my only option was to go online, however, when I checked online there were no bills there either. The agent then said the new bills were only available on "Their Database" and may not be on my end yet because they're "experiencing glitches". They promised to send an email containing the bills but that never arrived - So I can't even get them after putting in a great effort to!

After several weeks of waiting their complaints department has finally got in touch, and I'm going to give them much of the same information as above, but also wondered if there are any specific Ofgem rules I should mention or can use against them? Backbilling is a term I've seen mentioned on the forums but have yet to fully understand.

I'm also semi-aware of the Ombudsman, though unsure of exactly what their role is and if I should try to get them involved. Any advice on Ofgem/Ombudsman/Other more technical ways I could fight this would be greatly appreciated.

Finally, it's at this point I'll add that while I've written this whole post in the first person, the person who's actually having this issue is my Aunty and I'm just trying to help her out with it as she likes to avoid computers and anything technical at all costs!

Thank you so much for reading!

molerat

Have you given them readings in the past year ?

They have simply recalculated your use based on the differences between the previous and latest actual readings as they are allowed to do.  You have not used all that under billed amount at the current cheaper rates.

[Deleted User]

Your post is too long to digest in one go.

Check that peak and non peak are being recorded on the correct meter indexes.

Suppliers only have to obtain a meter reading once every 12 months: this can be from the customer; via a meter reader or from a smart meter. A meter reading by a data collector may not appear on your bill; however, on the bill following the meter reading the estimate will be based on that reading.

Trying to blame the supplier when you clearly have not been providing regular meter readings, or checking the estimated readings on your statement against the readings on your meter is a fools errand. You could have nipped this in the bud had you carried out the most basic of checks.

Backbilling is not designed to penalise suppliers. It is designed to prevent billshock. Without looking at your bills, no one can say whether BackBilling would apply. If it did, the supplier would write off all charges from the 21 Sep 22 to the last accurate bill. HOWEVER, if the write off in charges amounted to £1000 and you had paid the supplier £800 during the write off period, you would only benefit by £200.

The Energy Ombudsman is a private arbitration company contracted by Ofgem to look at supplier and consumer complaints. It reviews the supplier’s case file and your written submission. Its DECISION is binding on the supplier but not the complainant. Decisions can and do go against the complainant. If so, the supplier can use the Decision, whether you accept it or not, in support of any Court claim.

Gerry1

Welcome to the forum.

Why is she choosing to pay by cheque when it's significantly more expensive?

Why is she on a two-rate tariff when her off-peak usage is so low?  Again, it's likely to work out significantly more expensive.

Does she qualify for the Priority Services Register?

ArbitraryRandom

Backbilling applies (very simply) when a company is seeking to charge you for use more than 12 months ago and you have done nothing to cause the problem. It's not as simple as the debt is cancelled, so it might not be the silver bullet you think: 

If you used £20 of energy every month for 2 years, but paid estimated bills at £10 a month, then you paid £240 and 'owe' £240. If back billing applies then 12 months of the debt can't be enforced... but that would only reduce the debt to £120 (as the debt cancelled is the difference between what you paid and what you should have paid). It's certainly worth asking about. 

The other issue I can see with your working is the rates you are using. I think you're taking the energy you used and allocating it evenly over the period - but the 'average' use is weighted towards winter (80% of gas is used in winter) and the supplier won't be calculating it at a flat rate. If you have been with OVO more than a year then you might want to look at your pattern of use last year, then check your rates for those months. 

Last question about the calculations - are your/their figures before or after VAT? (it's 5% on both usage and the standing charges). As that might account for some of the difference. 

Re the ombudsman, at the moment you have a problem, but not necessarily grounds for complaint - you have no proof you submitted readings and no proof of what those readings were. You are currently questioning your supplier's methodology working out the bill, but there's not enough info to say if something is actually wrong/that it won't be addressed quickly and easily.  

If at some point you decide to complain about the issue, 8 weeks later (if it's not resolved) you can escalate it to the ombudsman. They will consider the evidence you and the supplier present (they will not investigate) and make a ruling as to if you are entitled to a remedy (compensation or similar). If there's no evidence you gave readings which were not used then that will likely be limited to how the supplier is handing your questions/the customer service and if back billing applies or not. 

And, chucking this in there just because... if you have smart meters then they store (I think) 18 months worth of usage date - so even if they stop sending readings for some reason the data can be recovered for billing purposes. Plus Gerry is right, direct debit is the cheaper way to pay. 

[Deleted User]

then they store (I think) 18 months worth of usage date

Smart meters store 13 month’s worth of import usage and 3 month’s worth of export usage. 

ArbitraryRandom

[Deleted User] said:

then they store (I think) 18 months worth of usage date

Smart meters store 13 month’s worth of import usage and 3 month’s worth of export usage. 

Thank you - I knew it was more than a year (apparently just!) 

Gromit07

Thank you all for your replies, they've all been very helpful! ArbitraryRandom particularly for the explanations - I do appreciate your kind tone.

Dolor's comment of "A meter reading by a data collector may not appear on your bill; however, on the bill following the meter reading the estimate will be based on that reading." especially piqued my interest, and it's something I'll look into if necessary.

I doubt she's eligible for the priority service register - however, give it a few years and that may change! 

I don't know why she's on a two-rate tariff, though it might have something to do with all the storage heaters she has installed. Would a single-rate tariff typically be cheaper? As we'll be switching providers in the not-to-distant future and that could be an option.

She likes to pay by cheque as her cash flow is a bit erratic, and there are no banks near her, nor does she do online banking which makes keeping track of how much money is in her account quite hard. With some luck, I'll get her doing online banking soon, but we're taking it one hurdle at a time for now! That said, why is paying by cheque any more expensive? We all pay for KWh used + standing rate and so on. So why should payment method affect the amount her bills come to, or is it more that tariffs allowing cheque payments typically have higher rates?

Now for an actual update on the situation --- We've finally heard from Ovo's complaints department. Initially, we just asked them to keep the ticket open and give us a moment to compose an email to them, in this time (A week or so) they must've reviewed the account as today when we went to check some numbers for the aforementioned email the debt was only showing as £846.88 - Which is about £100 more than I estimated, however as I was using lower rates that difference seems about right. Factoring everything in this new (£846.88) figure is much more in line with what we expected the debt to be, and far more reasonable. We've now emailed back asking them to confirm, and set in stone that figure to prevent them from deciding to double it back to the near £2000s, and also address the issues around not receiving paper bills or having access to online bills in our Ovo account. Fingers crossed they'll confirm the new debt figure, and sort everything else out too.

I should also mention that In relation to (I think?) back billing, we have just received a letter in the post stating Ovo was giving us £250 ish credit to cover power that was used over a year ago. I'm not sure if this was out of kindness (I'm not convinced they have any) or a legal obligation. But either way, we're happy to take it.

Thank you all again!

[Deleted User]

BackBilling is a Supply Licence obligation not an act of kindness. Whilst charges may be written off, payments are not. Suppliers are allowed to offset the written off charges with payments made during the write off period.

All companies are allowed to take into account the cost of handing payments. As the transaction cost for DD payments is lower than that for cash; cheques etc this is often reflected in the tariff offered.

QrizB

Gromit07 said:

I don't know why she's on a two-rate tariff, though it might have something to do with all the storage heaters she has installed. Would a single-rate tariff typically be cheaper?

Storage heaters usually benefit from a two-rate tariff.

However, by your own figures ,from March 2022 to June 2023 she has used over 4000kWh of peak electricity and under 3000kWh of off-peak electricity. That is quite an odd ratio for someone with storage heaters.

She's used more peak electricity than the average household (without storage heaters) uses in total, but her off-peak use is only a quarter of the heating demand of an average household.

This makes me wonder if she's not making good use of the cheap-rate storage heaters, but is instead using peak-rate electricity to run a fan heater, oil-filled radiator (or something like that) instead in the mistaken belief that it will be cheaper.

ArbitraryRandom

I'm glad to read you have had a positive outcome. 

As QuizB has suggested, a two rate tariff can save you money IF the majority of your use is at the lower rate (the exact tipping point depends on your rates, but around 40/60% of usage at high/low rate). Night storage heaters are generally the easiest way to achieve this (or electric vehicles), so it might be worth checking your aunt isn't using the instant heat/boost functions frequently/that the timer is set to the correct hours (old storage heaters can have a mechanical timer which can 'drift', meaning they can come on/turn off outside of the low use hours).

I remember seeing a thread on here last winter talking about the settings to balance the input and output (how much heat is stored and when it's released so it's not cold in the evenings) so if you want some advice about that I'm sure there's people here who can help if you can tell us the model/make. 

If it's just that storage heaters are not working out well for her, then it might be worth looking into single rate as the 'average' rate she'd be paying over the year would be lower. Also, if she's older, there might be grants available which could install a more economical system?

RE paying by cheque vs direct debit - it might be worth checking with your supplier. It varies, but the exact same tariff paid by something other than dd (card, check or at the post office) tends to be around 6-9% more expensive.