Does Consumer Rights Act 2015 pass on to a second-hand owner?

Anteater23

Im looking to buy a used MacBook that was originally purchased new from Amazon in 2021. As long as I get the original receipt, am I ‘covered’ under the CRA 6 year period? Or does that ‘coverage’ only exist between Amazon and the original purchaser?

user1977

The latter. Though a manufacturer's guarantee might be enforceable depending on its terms.

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head

Hello OP

As long as the (second hand) goods aren't purchased at a public auction where you can attend in person then the CRA would cover the transaction*.

Thinks like as described in terms of model, colour, condition are fairly straightforward, in terms of there being a technical problem down the line, which is durability, this determined by 

(a)any description of the goods,

(b)the price or other consideration for the goods (if relevant), 

So a second hand item may not be expected to last as long as a new item, in-between the two something like a refurbished model should last longer than second hand but perhaps not quite as long as new (although that could be debatable for refurbished).

Ultimately you aren't automatically guaranteed 6 years for everything you buy and how long is reasonable for a second hand MacBook is again probably debatable. 

*Worth noting the CRA only applies to contracts between traders and consumers, if the seller is a private individual selling their own MacBook you'd have to look to the Sale of Goods Act for the more limited cover it offers for such transactions.   

Alderbank

user1977 said:

The latter. Though a manufacturer's guarantee might be enforceable depending on its terms.

Indeed.
Lenovo for example specifically state that their warranty can be transferred to any subsequent owners provided they complete the warranty registration after purchase.

Apple do allow transfer but only with the co-operation of old and new owners, presumably so you couldn't claim warranty for a stolen device.
https://macreports.com/yes-you-can-transfer-applecare-to-a-new-owner/

Remember that manufacturer's warranty is with Apple, not Amazon, and warranties are completely independent of your consumer rights which are explained by @the_lunatic_is_in_my_head  

RefluentBeans

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head said:

Hello OP

As long as the (second hand) goods aren't purchased at a public auction where you can attend in person then the CRA would cover the transaction*.

Thinks like as described in terms of model, colour, condition are fairly straightforward, in terms of there being a technical problem down the line, which is durability, this determined by 

(a)any description of the goods,

(b)the price or other consideration for the goods (if relevant), 

So a second hand item may not be expected to last as long as a new item, in-between the two something like a refurbished model should last longer than second hand but perhaps not quite as long as new (although that could be debatable for refurbished).

Ultimately you aren't automatically guaranteed 6 years for everything you buy and how long is reasonable for a second hand MacBook is again probably debatable. 

*Worth noting the CRA only applies to contracts between traders and consumers, if the seller is a private individual selling their own MacBook you'd have to look to the Sale of Goods Act for the more limited cover it offers for such transactions.  

To clarify - I think the OP is asking if the CRA transfers from the original seller (Amazon). 

What you’ve described is a new set of Consumer Rights from the new seller (not Amazon) to the new buyer (the OP). 

I assume that if the OP is buying item from a business, this is a business to consumer sale, and so new consumer rights are established. But the sale between Amazon and the seller would be considered B2B and not have any consumer rights. 

I think the OP is buying from a consumer (consumer to consumer) so I think the question is whether Amazon (being the original B2C seller) has to honour the CRA when purchased by a subsequent buyer. My gut tells me no, but happy to be corrected. 

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head

RefluentBeans said:

To clarify - I think the OP is asking if the CRA transfers from the original seller (Amazon). 

Thanks, missed that  

I don't think there are any third party rights with the original retailer passed along when you sell your unwanted items  as the new purchaser wasn't intended to benefit from the original contract, in which case @Anteater23 unless you know this person and (rights and wrongs aside) they are willing to deal with Amazon on your behalf as if they'd never sold the item (which is probably unlikely, even if it's a friend getting a resolve for these things isn't always straightforward so they might agree to now and then not) you aren't going to be able to go back to Amazon for a remedy under the CRA. 

Alderbank

RefluentBeans said:

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head said:

Hello OP

As long as the (second hand) goods aren't purchased at a public auction where you can attend in person then the CRA would cover the transaction*.

Thinks like as described in terms of model, colour, condition are fairly straightforward, in terms of there being a technical problem down the line, which is durability, this determined by 

(a)any description of the goods,

(b)the price or other consideration for the goods (if relevant), 

So a second hand item may not be expected to last as long as a new item, in-between the two something like a refurbished model should last longer than second hand but perhaps not quite as long as new (although that could be debatable for refurbished).

Ultimately you aren't automatically guaranteed 6 years for everything you buy and how long is reasonable for a second hand MacBook is again probably debatable. 

*Worth noting the CRA only applies to contracts between traders and consumers, if the seller is a private individual selling their own MacBook you'd have to look to the Sale of Goods Act for the more limited cover it offers for such transactions.  

I think the OP is buying from a consumer (consumer to consumer) so I think the question is whether Amazon (being the original B2C seller) has to honour the CRA when purchased by a subsequent buyer. My gut tells me no, but happy to be corrected. 

There is no contractual relationship between Amazon and the subsequent buyer so there can be no consumer legislation liability between them. Consumer legislation deals specifically with the contract for goods or services directly between trader and consumer.

However if the consumer sells the goods on, I don't see that his rights against the original trader are changed in any way. If he has sold the laptop, car, washing machine, etc. to a friend or family member I can't see any legal or moral reason why he (not the new owner) can't claim against the trader if the goods turn out to be faulty. There doesn't seem to be any requirement to prove continuing and current ownership, just original purchase.

But also happy to be corrected.

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head

Alderbank said:

There is no contractual relationship between Amazon and the subsequent buyer so there can be no consumer legislation liability between them. Consumer legislation deals specifically with the contract for goods or services directly between trader and consumer.

However if the consumer sells the goods on, I don't see that his rights against the original trader are changed in any way. If he has sold the laptop, car, washing machine, etc. to a friend or family member I can't see any legal or moral reason why he (not the new owner) can't claim against the trader if the goods turn out to be faulty. There doesn't seem to be any requirement to prove continuing and current ownership, just original purchase.

But also happy to be corrected.

My understanding it that this kind of thing is governed by Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 and it's a question of who was intended to benefit from the contract.

If for example you ordered a tea pot from Amazon as a gift for your aunty then your aunty would have third party rights to seek a remedy in the event the goods did not conform. It would however have to be clear the contract had a third party who would benefit, i.e was for a gift, presumably that means clear to both parties at the time the contract was formed so on Amazon that could mean marking the order as a gift during Checkout. I believe the contract can however exclude third party rights.

Not piece of legislation I know that much about other than the above but I don't believe it gives a new purchaser of second hand goods rights to a remedy, although same as yourself, happy to be corrected  

Anteater23

Thanks for help so far. I do not know the seller so they wouldn’t be claiming on my behalf. I would like to know if I could ever make a CRA claim against Amazon provided I have the original proof of purchase from them (albeit I don’t have access to the original purchasers Amazon account).

RefluentBeans

Anteater23 said:

Thanks for help so far. I do not know the seller so they wouldn’t be claiming on my behalf. I would like to know if I could ever make a CRA claim against Amazon provided I have the original proof of purchase from them (albeit I don’t have access to the original purchasers Amazon account).

The simple answer is no. You’re a third party to the original contract. If you look at the link below it’ll explain it better than legal documents can. Basically, you have no contract with Amazon so Amazon can refuse to deal with you. They may deal with you, and warranties may (but may not) transfer - this depends on the terms. 

https://www.moneysavingexpert.com/reclaim/consumer-rights-refunds-exchange/

Alderbank

No.

Amazon made a contract of sale with the original purchaser.  They have no contractual relationship with you.

The 'proof of purchase' you have is evidence that they only had a contract with the original purchaser and not with you.