Halved my bills

Irdoyle

I live in a 1-bed, purpose built, flat and have always paid in excess of £100 pm for my energy use. My dd was set at £171pm when the costs started soaring, and this got me thinking about efficiency. A 15 year old combi boiler was running my heating and hot water and this involved a 20m run from the boiler to the bathroom, for shower and sink. 20m of pipe is roughly 8 litres of water. Every time I shower, or use the sink, I heat up 8 litres of water that then goes cold in the pipe until the next use. Poor central heating control also meant that I heat every room, rather than only heating the room(s) that I need. 20th March I had the gas meter removed, along with all of the radiators and pipework, and replaced with a point of use heater in both the kitchen and bathroom. The radiators have been swapped out for high mounted infra-red heating panels. 22nd March I had a smart meter installed, replacing my old meter. So March to August last year my running costs were £171 pm (I used around £700 of gas and electricity)
Since 22nd March this year I have used only £321 of electricity. I was hoping for around 30-35% savings but this has been surpassed to around a 50% saving. I believe my improvements will pay for themselves in 18-20 months. 
I feel that we need to look at ALL alternatives to current systems, rather than relying on the 'boffins' who are sometimes sponsored for their research.
The heat pumps being bandied about would not be practical in my property as I live on the 1st floor and would have access issues. The cost would be crippling.
I feel that more research needs to be undertaken before the country can go forward with a cost effective plan, that could save more people more money.
I am now saving money and have freed up valuable space in my home, without breaking the bank! Being disabled and on benefits, this is the difference between living and destitution. Anyone else had similar luck with saving money?

GingerTim

While I appreciate the apparent savings being made in the here and now, I have a couple of reservations about this.

First, I think it will only be running this new set up in the winter, and as a result over a full twelve months, that will give a real sense of how much cheaper it is (or not, as I'm almost certain it won't be). And second, by ripping out the central heating system and removing the gas connection, I fear you may have significantly devalued your property/made it less attractive to buyers.

matt_drummer

I couldn't agree more with @GingerTim

You will only be able to compare your annual costs once you have lived with your new set up for a full year.

I fear you are either going to be poorer or colder.

QrizB

I fear that you may have made a terrible mistake.

Irdoyle said:

 My dd was set at £171pm when the costs started soaring,...

So March to August last year my running costs were £171 pm (I used around £700 of gas and electricity)
Since 22nd March this year I have used only £321 of electricity.

Last year, your monthly DD was £171. However this does not mean that you were using £171-worth of energy each month.

It's quite possible that, over the warmer spring and summer months, the cost of your energy was less than half the value of your monthly DD.

So, if you paid £700 over that period, your energy costs might have been £300 or so.

Can you check your bills and see exactly how many kWh of gas and electricity you used over the period during 2022, and what they will actually have cost you?

Krakkkers

Electricity is currently 4 times the price of gas per kwh.

MattMattMattUK

Irdoyle said:

I live in a 1-bed, purpose built, flat and have always paid in excess of £100 pm for my energy use. My dd was set at £171pm when the costs started soaring, and this got me thinking about efficiency. A 15 year old combi boiler was running my heating and hot water and this involved a 20m run from the boiler to the bathroom, for shower and sink. 20m of pipe is roughly 8 litres of water. Every time I shower, or use the sink, I heat up 8 litres of water that then goes cold in the pipe until the next use.

That is what a circulator pump and the secondary return are for on your hot water tank, if you want that plumbed in as a circuit, together with well insulated pipes. 

Irdoyle said:

Poor central heating control also meant that I heat every room, rather than only heating the room(s) that I need. 20th March I had the gas meter removed, along with all of the radiators and pipework, and replaced with a point of use heater in both the kitchen and bathroom. The radiators have been swapped out for high mounted infra-red heating panels. 22nd March I had a smart meter installed, replacing my old meter. So March to August last year my running costs were £171 pm (I used around £700 of gas and electricity)
Since 22nd March this year I have used only £321 of electricity. I was hoping for around 30-35% savings but this has been surpassed to around a 50% saving. I believe my improvements will pay for themselves in 18-20 months. 

You will not have been using heating during the summer, so a drop in monthly usage vs 1/12th of annual usage is hardly surprising, indeed it would be worrying if that was not the case. However the issue will be winter, when you use the heating and your costs soar.
For 1kWh of useful heat in the home
Electric IR heating panel 100% efficient, so to output 1kWh of heat requires 1kWh of electricity at 28.9p.
For gas central heating, a combi boiler that was 15 years old would be around 94-96% efficient, so to output 1kWh of heat requires around 7.3p of gas.
Your "improvements" would pay to themselves in 18-20 months if we had 18-20 months of summer, unfortunately with colder weather you will find that they start costing you a considerable amount more.

Irdoyle said:

I feel that we need to look at ALL alternatives to current systems, rather than relying on the 'boffins' who are sometimes sponsored for their research.

We need to look at options, however to do that properly one needs to be able to evaluate them correctly. The research is available for all to review who have the capacity to do so.

Irdoyle said:

The heat pumps being bandied about would not be practical in my property as I live on the 1st floor and would have access issues. The cost would be crippling.

If you already have a wet heating system the cost of installing a heat pump would be around £7-8,000, the government grant would cover £5,000 of that, so a total £2-3,000 cost. The COP of an air source heat pump should be around 3.8-4.0, which means you get 3.8-4.0 kWh of useful heat from each kWh of electricity you input, at current prices that would mean the average household would break even in around a year. 

Irdoyle said:

I feel that more research needs to be undertaken before the country can go forward with a cost effective plan, that could save more people more money.

There is plenty of research, what is needed is the capacity for people to understand it. 

Irdoyle said:

I am now saving money and have freed up valuable space in my home, without breaking the bank! Being disabled and on benefits, this is the difference between living and destitution. Anyone else had similar luck with saving money?

Unfortunately you are unlikely to save money over a twelve month period, in all likelihood you have significantly increased your costs.

LosingWill2Live

Hi, I would like to chip in here.  I have applied for a government grant with two of these ECO-4 funding agencies, the first one informed me that I qualified for a full grant for a heat pump but then I heard nothing more from them.  I gave up asking and tried a new application with a different agency and, while they said that I should qualify in principle, I have heard nothing more from them either.  I gather, having done a bit of asking around. that they are only giving these grants to people with a property 'E' rated or lower.  My small 3 bed house is 'D' rated and I live in a rural area using only wall panel heaters for heating.  

Robin9

Irdoyle said:

...................... 20th March I had the gas meter removed,.... ............

There have been several discussions re the removal of gas meters and standing charges. Has the gas meter been physically removed and the pipe capped?  or just turned off at the adjacent valve ?   Or has the pipe been cut and capped outside your property ?   What were you charged for this ?

In calculating your savings have you included the costs of the plumber in removing the boiler/pipes/radiators ?

Like the other replies I fear you have jumped the wrong way.

Have you the actual consumption figures in kWh for the equivalent period in 2022 ?

(A DD of £171 for a 1 bed flat does sound rather high to me and suggests you were quite a high user.

LosingWill2Live

Irdoyle said:

I live in a 1-bed, purpose built, flat and have always paid in excess of £100 pm for my energy use. My dd was set at £171pm when the costs started soaring, and this got me thinking about efficiency. A 15 year old combi boiler was running my heating and hot water and this involved a 20m run from the boiler to the bathroom, for shower and sink. 20m of pipe is roughly 8 litres of water. Every time I shower, or use the sink, I heat up 8 litres of water that then goes cold in the pipe until the next use. Poor central heating control also meant that I heat every room, rather than only heating the room(s) that I need. 20th March I had the gas meter removed, along with all of the radiators and pipework, and replaced with a point of use heater in both the kitchen and bathroom. The radiators have been swapped out for high mounted infra-red heating panels. 22nd March I had a smart meter installed, replacing my old meter. So March to August last year my running costs were £171 pm (I used around £700 of gas and electricity)
Since 22nd March this year I have used only £321 of electricity. I was hoping for around 30-35% savings but this has been surpassed to around a 50% saving. I believe my improvements will pay for themselves in 18-20 months. 
I feel that we need to look at ALL alternatives to current systems, rather than relying on the 'boffins' who are sometimes sponsored for their research.
The heat pumps being bandied about would not be practical in my property as I live on the 1st floor and would have access issues. The cost would be crippling.
I feel that more research needs to be undertaken before the country can go forward with a cost effective plan, that could save more people more money.
I am now saving money and have freed up valuable space in my home, without breaking the bank! Being disabled and on benefits, this is the difference between living and destitution. Anyone else had similar luck with saving money?

I would like to hear how you get on.  I have heard that the point of infra red heaters is that they heat the objects in the room and then these objects warm the air.  Quite frankly, at this point I'm ready to try anything.  So glad I don't live in New Mexico or Canada where you will probably boil or freeze to death in the next 12 months when the government starts switching off your aircon/heating.

matelodave

As others have said, most people don't use all that much gas or leccy between April and October, probably only about 35% of their annual consumption, but use 65-70% of their energy, mainly gas in the five winter months.  

I fear that you are going to be pretty horrified at the cost of your energy between now and next March, especially as said above, leccy is four time the cost of gas for the same amount of heat.

You could end up being either be cold or skint especially if its a cold winter. My guess is that if you've used around £321 since 22nd March (less than six months)  then you can at least double or treble that between now and next March, giving you an annual cost of close to what you spent last year because your electric heating could cost you 3-4 times the cost of the gas you used last winter

Don't forget that there wont be silly money chucked at you from the government this winter, so it would be a really good idea to put some extra money away for when the winter bills come in.

We'll look forward to your economy report when you have a whole year's worth of energy consumption and costs to compare with the same period last year. 

markin

The cost would be crippling, If you have got this wrong. Rerun all your calculations using KWH not DD payments.

Being a 1-bed, purpose built and only 15 years old may just save you from costing more over winter, but it also means you were never heating a 3 bed house and are now only heating 1 room, So you may just break even if your lucky.

I hope you aren't on a E7 tariff as well?