Sense Check Please Regarding my rights

Iiyama

Hi all

I'm having a bit of a difficult situation regarding a Solar panel and battery installation and I want to check that I'm not being unreasonable or indeed to complacent!

In summary:

Solar panel and battery installation this week by a national company. Their installer (that I now understand was sub-contracted to) are 3 hrs drive away so not local to me.

On completing the install it was clear there was an issue as the battery was not charging. The installers left reassuring me that it required an over air update (or similar) that the battery company would do and all would be fine.

The next day no change the battery was still not been charged. Albeit the panels were producing the power expected and the house was drawing from it. Unfortunately excess power produced was not going to the battery but straight back to the grid. So there was clearly a problem.

During this time I was been chased for final balance payment. I objected to paying the balance as the item was not fit for purpose. They agreed to me holding 10% back and paying the bulk off which I naively did in goodwill hoping that there would be an easy fix.(over the air fix firmware)

The firmware fix made no difference.

I contacted the installation company who have said their installers have done all they can and they passed it to the battery company. The battery manufacturer cannot visit for a few weeks to inspect "And see if its an installation issue or product fault"

I "think" under consumer law I can say the products are not fit for purpose and seek return of everything and a full refund within 30 days. Of course to return solar panels, inverter and battery would be a massive job for them and leave me with holes in my roof tiles and everywhere else the install would need to be removed from. And there lies the dilemma?

Or do I wait several weeks for the battery manufacturer to inspect and then they arrange any replacement or if its an installation fault correct it? If I wait several weeks that's another dilemma as I worry it could lesson my chance of going through with a full return and refund? 

I did suggest that they bring out a new battery and inverter and see which one is at fault. Replace it and return faulty unit to manufacturer. I thought this was reasonable but they refused.

I'm concerned that:

1) I'm being unreasonable expecting them to accept a return.

2} I should be patient and let the battery manufacturer sort it out

3) I'm being to complacent.

Advice appreciated. I appear to be caught in the middle of an issue between the Solar company and their sub-contracted installers and the battery manufacturer. Is there anymore I should be doing?

born_again

I would wait & see what the battery company say. 

Alderbank

By your own admission the major part of the installation, the solar panels and the invertor, are working fine. I can't see any provision in consumer legislation which would empower you to have them removed and made good for what would be essentially a change of mind.

You are entitled to have the battery and charging circuitry installed with reasonable care and skill. They are arranging to have this part of the installation repaired or replaced by the specialist company who makes them so (up till now) that appears to be acting with reasonable care and skill.

They have to fix it within a reasonable timeframe. How that is defined depends on a number of factors such as the availability of the specialist engineers, availability of any parts required and the degree of inconvenience to you. No mains water, or no hot water, for instance, for several weeks would clearly be unacceptable but not charging your battery from solar power for some weeks is only a financial inconvenience (you are obviously not 'off grid' since the system is able to switch over and feed in to the grid) so that issue will be addressable by a compensation payment.

With holidays, specialist labour shortages and possible spare parts supply issues to consider, a court would probably accept that a few weeks wait is 'reasonable'. 

tl;dr: as @born_again says, wait & see what the battery company say. 

QrizB

You might not want to name the installer, but can you share the brand of the battery?

There was a thread on the "Green and Ethical Moneysaving" subforum where someone had a similar problem with a GivEnergy battery.

RefluentBeans

As above - wait to see what the battery manufacturer has to say. The issue with rejecting because of the fault is that the service for most of the installation is fine, and the components that are working appear to be the vast majority. Batteries are inherently consumable - they have a life span and a dead battery is not uncommon. Rejecting the product for that would likely mean that the panels and the bulk of the installation would be chargeable and returned as a change of mind situation and they can charge for their losses from that. 

I think it’s unreasonable for you to expect a refund for the whole amount based on a consumable part not working. What isn’t unreasonable is getting a working system. You can ask for that. 

Iiyama

Thank you all for the guidance.

I was thinking that the installer has responsibility due to leaving a job not properly working and that responsibility lay with them.

I don't think it was right that they left me with a partially working system.

I will keep the thread updated with the outcome. Then name the companies involved and what they did or didn't do to help resolve the situation. That may hopefully help others on the forum.

Alderbank

Correct, it wouldn't be right if they walked away and left you with a partially working system. You are entitled to get what you agreed and paid for. They do have responsibility.

However the reality is that the specialist who they contract to manufacture and supply the electronics and batteries is still sorting it out.

Iiyama

Update:

I'm making very little progress in getting this situation resolved and my battery is still not charging, sat at idle and excess energy going back into the grid.

I've discovered that the company that did the job  (sub contracted to) have a winding up order against them. Although I accept that my contract is with someone else. It just adds to my frustration.

I have spoken several times to the battery company and they will not give me a date for an engineer to do a site visit. I just keep getting told as soon as we can.

I have escalated it to the Head of Operations of the company the contract is with and he passed it onto a senior administrator to help. They are getting no where with the battery company either.

Is there anything else I can do as this is causing significant stress having paid out thousands for a system that is not working?

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head

OP can you advise please, when you were given a price for these works was the battery price itemised?

Iiyama

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head said:

OP can you advise please, when you were given a price for these works was the battery price itemised?

The original quote prior to the site visit to confirm was 21st August 2023.

The site survey to confirm was the 30th August 2023. At this point they said only 11 panels not the original estimate. And the quote was adjusted over the telephone accordingly.

The installation occurred on the 5th September 2023 where the same people that did the site survey said "OH you can fit another 2 panels on here" However, despite emails on the issue of 2 additional panels I have had zero response! I suspect the battery issue is their priority.

Regarding the works itemized. Yes, they were.

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head

Iiyama said:

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head said:

OP can you advise please, when you were given a price for these works was the battery price itemised?

Regarding the works itemized. Yes, they were.

Thank you OP

So if the price was £x000 for the battery this is a supply of goods and as you've notified of them of an issue you are now in the waiting period.

(8)The waiting period—

(a)begins with the day the consumer requests or agrees to the repair or replacement of the goods, and

(b)ends with the day on which the consumer receives goods supplied by the trader in response to the request or agreement.

As you've requested a replacement battery and are in the waiting period until they do*, you may exercise the short term right to reject (everything out for a full refund) at any point from now until:  

(a)7 days after the waiting period ends, or

(b)if later, the original time limit for exercising that right, extended by the waiting period.

*If they have said replacing the battery is too expensive compared to repairing it then a repair instead is acceptable with the exact same principle regarding the waiting time. 

If you exercise the short term right to reject and they do have to rip the whole system out and you are left with damage (such as holes in your roof), they are liability for the cost of repairs (as damages), although with the short term right to reject the burden of proof (that there is a problem with the goods) falls upon yourself.

Alternatively I would suggest, if they do not replace/repair the battery you may instead exercise the final right to reject (which for the first 6 months places the burden of proof upon the trader rather than you) and you may simply reject those goods that do not conform meaning you are entitled to just reject the battery and keep the rest of the system, this way you would only have to rip everything out if you chose to reject everything*. Within 6 months they must refund the full costs of the goods without a deduction. 

I think you need to put your position in writing with a timeframe, something along the lines of:

Dear Solar Company

In follow up to our previous communications with regards to order/job number/invoice xxxx I am sending this letter to notify you of my position.

As I advised on DATE I believe that the battery supplied did not conform to the contract upon the day of delivery due to it failing to hold charge and as such a replacement battery has been requested, as I am entitled to under Section 23 of the Consumer Rights Act.

You are obligated to provide that replacement within a reasonable time and without significant inconvenience to myself, should you not replace the battery with one that does conform to the contract within x days of the date of this letter I shall exercise the final right to reject the battery and seek a full refund of the price of the battery and additionally, as damages, the mitigated costs of; it's removal, the replacement installation, any addition in price of the replacement battery itself. 

Thank you for your prompt attention to this matter, I look forward to amicably resolving the matter without undue delay.

Sincerely,
Iiyama

 
I would send it by email and send a hard copy in the post. I think 28 days is reasonable for them to replace the battery. Their issues or communication with the battery manufacturer is nothing to do with yourself so they can't blame them for not meeting the 28 day timeframe. 

*Simply rejecting the battery if the rest of the system is OK seems sensible, however the advice above is incorrect in that you may either reject the goods that do not conform or all of the goods under the contract.

As an aside the only thing you may not do is:

Order A, B & C 
A is faulty
Reject A & B but keep C.

Hopefully you can get this resolved but please do post back for further advice if needed