Feedback on electric boiler pl?

doodling

Hi,

FFHillbilly said:

FreeBear said:

FFHillbilly said: Now that gas is running out and is carbon producing fossil fuel, and more and more electricity is produced from wind and solar it's looking like the greener choice so there were plans to start shifting the green tax/social obligation or whatever it was called from electric to gas, off the top of my head it was 21% so in theory gas could be 21% more expensive and electric could be 21% cheaper in the near future.
this plan was put on hold, but I'm sure it will happen at some point, probably before 2030

Based on what I am currently paying for gas & electricity, a 21% shift works out at 24p (electricity) and 8.95p (gas) per KWh. So gas heating is still going to be cheaper than most forms of electric heating. But heat pumps with a COP over 2.8 start to look cost effective.

I didn't explain that right last night sorry, 
"Currently, 23% of the cost of electricity is made up of environmental and social obligation costs, with the costs of numerous decarbonisation programmes funded through the levy. However, gas costs include less than 2% of environmental and social obligation costs"

thats a quote from this article, and the 23% removed from electricity prices is just added onto gas, so based on 30p for electric and 8p for gas we are paying now, 6.9p is removed from electric and added onto gas making them 23.1p and 14.9p respectively 

That maths only works if the country consumes equal amounts of gas and electricity on a per kWh basis - is that true?

Would industrial consumers (e.g. gas power stations) also pay the same levy - if they do then I can see a flaw in that approach...

FreeBear

FFHillbilly said:

FreeBear said:

FFHillbilly said: Now that gas is running out and is carbon producing fossil fuel, and more and more electricity is produced from wind and solar it's looking like the greener choice so there were plans to start shifting the green tax/social obligation or whatever it was called from electric to gas, off the top of my head it was 21% so in theory gas could be 21% more expensive and electric could be 21% cheaper in the near future.
this plan was put on hold, but I'm sure it will happen at some point, probably before 2030

Based on what I am currently paying for gas & electricity, a 21% shift works out at 24p (electricity) and 8.95p (gas) per KWh. So gas heating is still going to be cheaper than most forms of electric heating. But heat pumps with a COP over 2.8 start to look cost effective.

I didn't explain that right last night sorry, 
"Currently, 23% of the cost of electricity is made up of environmental and social obligation costs, with the costs of numerous decarbonisation programmes funded through the levy. However, gas costs include less than 2% of environmental and social obligation costs"

thats a quote from this article, and the 23% removed from electricity prices is just added onto gas, so based on 30p for electric and 8p for gas we are paying now, 6.9p is removed from electric and added onto gas making them 23.1p and 14.9p respectively 

OK. That makes sense. Gas is still cheaper than electricity, but heat pumps, even with a low COP, start to look very attractive. If the energy price shift did take place, the cost of heat pumps should drop dramatically as more & more people get them installed.

That said, if everyone transitions from fossil fuels for heating & transportation, the electricity network is going to need some serious upgrades - The money for that is going to be added to our electricity bills and will probably negate the removal of the green levies.

FFHillbilly

doodling said:

Hi,

FFHillbilly said:

FreeBear said:

FFHillbilly said: Now that gas is running out and is carbon producing fossil fuel, and more and more electricity is produced from wind and solar it's looking like the greener choice so there were plans to start shifting the green tax/social obligation or whatever it was called from electric to gas, off the top of my head it was 21% so in theory gas could be 21% more expensive and electric could be 21% cheaper in the near future.
this plan was put on hold, but I'm sure it will happen at some point, probably before 2030

Based on what I am currently paying for gas & electricity, a 21% shift works out at 24p (electricity) and 8.95p (gas) per KWh. So gas heating is still going to be cheaper than most forms of electric heating. But heat pumps with a COP over 2.8 start to look cost effective.

I didn't explain that right last night sorry, 
"Currently, 23% of the cost of electricity is made up of environmental and social obligation costs, with the costs of numerous decarbonisation programmes funded through the levy. However, gas costs include less than 2% of environmental and social obligation costs"

thats a quote from this article, and the 23% removed from electricity prices is just added onto gas, so based on 30p for electric and 8p for gas we are paying now, 6.9p is removed from electric and added onto gas making them 23.1p and 14.9p respectively 

That maths only works if the country consumes equal amounts of gas and electricity on a per kWh basis - is that true?

No I don't think thats true, please don't take it like I'm saying "this is what will happen and it will be this much", I'm just saying that gas isn't always going to be roughly 1/4 the price of electric and it would be short sighted to base a house purchase on that idea.
the Paris agreement that we have signed upto means that in 2030 we are inn line for an £8 billion fine if carbon emissions don't change, so it just makes sense that the government is going to have to alter policy's to make electric more appealing and get us off gas. look at what's happening with road tax for petrol and diesel cars, it's going up every year while tax for EV's is zero at the minute. the proposed ban of the internal combustion engine is 2030, just 5 years before the proposed ban on gas boilers so I think exactly the same thing will happen as it gets nearer the deadline

doodling said:

Hi,

FFHillbilly said:

FreeBear said:

FFHillbilly said: Now that gas is running out and is carbon producing fossil fuel, and more and more electricity is produced from wind and solar it's looking like the greener choice so there were plans to start shifting the green tax/social obligation or whatever it was called from electric to gas, off the top of my head it was 21% so in theory gas could be 21% more expensive and electric could be 21% cheaper in the near future.
this plan was put on hold, but I'm sure it will happen at some point, probably before 2030

Based on what I am currently paying for gas & electricity, a 21% shift works out at 24p (electricity) and 8.95p (gas) per KWh. So gas heating is still going to be cheaper than most forms of electric heating. But heat pumps with a COP over 2.8 start to look cost effective.

I didn't explain that right last night sorry, 
"Currently, 23% of the cost of electricity is made up of environmental and social obligation costs, with the costs of numerous decarbonisation programmes funded through the levy. However, gas costs include less than 2% of environmental and social obligation costs"

thats a quote from this article, and the 23% removed from electricity prices is just added onto gas, so based on 30p for electric and 8p for gas we are paying now, 6.9p is removed from electric and added onto gas making them 23.1p and 14.9p respectively 

Would industrial consumers (e.g. gas power stations) also pay the same levy - if they do then I can see a flaw in that approach...

well yes to an extent, but it's not going to happen overnight. the plan in 2021 before energy costs went mad was to do it over 5 years and complete it in 2028 but it's been put on hold due to the cost of energy

FreeBear said:

FFHillbilly said:

FreeBear said:

FFHillbilly said: Now that gas is running out and is carbon producing fossil fuel, and more and more electricity is produced from wind and solar it's looking like the greener choice so there were plans to start shifting the green tax/social obligation or whatever it was called from electric to gas, off the top of my head it was 21% so in theory gas could be 21% more expensive and electric could be 21% cheaper in the near future.
this plan was put on hold, but I'm sure it will happen at some point, probably before 2030

Based on what I am currently paying for gas & electricity, a 21% shift works out at 24p (electricity) and 8.95p (gas) per KWh. So gas heating is still going to be cheaper than most forms of electric heating. But heat pumps with a COP over 2.8 start to look cost effective.

I didn't explain that right last night sorry, 
"Currently, 23% of the cost of electricity is made up of environmental and social obligation costs, with the costs of numerous decarbonisation programmes funded through the levy. However, gas costs include less than 2% of environmental and social obligation costs"

thats a quote from this article, and the 23% removed from electricity prices is just added onto gas, so based on 30p for electric and 8p for gas we are paying now, 6.9p is removed from electric and added onto gas making them 23.1p and 14.9p respectively 

That said, if everyone transitions from fossil fuels for heating & transportation, the electricity network is going to need some serious upgrades - The money for that is going to be added to our electricity bills and will probably negate the removal of the green levies.

I don't think they will be allowed to , it wouldn't really help the overall cause out if the price effectively stayed the same after their grand plan to incentivise green electric