Air Traffic Control Failure - Rights?

clicka

Hello All - does anybody have any advice for travellers who are out of pocket due to the NATS system failure where the holiday accommodation was booked separately to the flights (i.e.: a non package holiday)

We had our flights cancelled (Stanstead to Kefalonia) by Jet2 after being delayed for 7 hours as we were boarding the plane.  Luckily we only live an hour from the airport so we were able to drive home so no additional expenses (although lots of other people will have).  However, we have expenses where we have paid for car parking, car hire, car insurance excess cover, and accommodation (booked through Booking.com) to the tune of nearly £2k.
We have been refunded the flights, but importantly we were not asked if we wanted a refund or if we would prefer they try and get us to our destination - which I believe is aviation law.  We have unsuccessfully managed to get any money back from the individual companies where the non-flight parts of our holiday was booked.  Our insurance company won’t cover us as they deem the computer glitch as “extraordinary circumstances”.  The same reason why compensation is unlikely from the airline, although I do feel they should have at least attempted (or asked) to get us to destination. So we may have been able to use the accommodation if even for half of the time booked.

Listening to the news it does sound like the issue occurred due to human error yet nobody seems to be accountable.

None of the news channels or media outlets seem to be covering this angle of of incident so there is no advice being given to us or other holiday makers in the same scenario.

We did pay for everything on credit card. What would our chances be of claiming back from the credit card company since we have paid for something not used?  I’m guessing none as no fraud or damaged goods has occurred.

if anybody has any advice please share.  Or if their is a journalist reading this please get this scenario covered in the national press.

Thanks

Mark

smyluk

Sorry to hear you could not take your family on holiday but I think this is a very difficult one as it is equally not the hotels, car parking agents etc fault you could not attend or use their service. Whilst you could attempt to claim the money back via your credit card, I am not sure this will be successful.

I am surprised to hear that your travel insurance wont cover you. I'm interested in hearing others opinions on this as I thought cancellation of a flight was one of the main reasons to take out cover.

la531983

Must be a cheap policy that doesnt cover much.

As an aside, you wont get anything for "crying / upset children", so I wouldnt include that in any correspondence with an airline or insurer.

clicka

Thanks for quick replies.  The insurance company consider the fault to be in the same category as extreme weather, terrorist attack - i.e.: and I quote “extraordinary circumstances”. Maybe it’s worth following up with them again.

Agree about the crying / upset children, it’s irrelevant, and unfortunate that personal feelings and mental health are not a consideration - but I get that.  It’s just a great big emotional mess!

clicka

With regards to the travel insurance comments.  It’s not a cheap policy, it’s through a well known reputable company underwritten by Lloyds of London.  However, as a result of the comments I have re-read the policy document and can’t see anything in there that would suggest I am not covered under the current circumstance/scenario so will defo be back on the phone to them.  So thanks again for the comments.  

Alan_Bowen

Once you agree to a full refund for the flights, the airline has no obligation to offer alternative flights, which could have been on a different airline, although being realistic it may have been very difficult to find seats this week as most flights are completely full. Your only real hope now is for your insurance policy, read it very carefully and if they continue to deny cover, it may be worth complaining to the Financial Ombudsman scheme.

I don't believe you have any claims against a credit card as all the other suppliers were ready and willing to provide the service you have paid for and therefore there is no breach of contract on which to base a claim. Sorry to say, this shows the benefit of booking a package holiday as the organiser would have refunded the cost of the whole holiday but even then you needed cover for the car hire costs and airport parking costs that would have been lost. When you buy an insurance  policy you have 14 days to check through it and make sure it covers all the risks you want and if it doesn't cancel and look elsewhere

sheramber

All UK airports were affected.

Since priority was given to flights due to land already being in the air , with some of these flights being diverted to  other airports in Europe, it is unlikely there were any alternative flights  available

ShelterfromtheStirm

We have top level insurance with Admiral. I spoke to their claims team on the phone, and they said under normal circumstances our insurance would not cover this event as the small print excludes technical breakdown, cyber incidents, etc, in the same way that terrorism and acts of god are excluded. However, they suggested applying for the delayed flight, to a maximum of £250 (£25 for each 12 hour delay) and they will review on a case by case basis. 

If anyone can recommend an insurance underwriter that does cover such situations, if there is such a thing! 

We are stuck in Northern Europe but have a flight home tomorrow, 72 hours delay but have been put up on a very nice hotel with 3 good meals a day, and appreciate we have been more fortunate than many. 

It’s also worth noting that our insurance would not cover the price differential of rebooking an earlier flight home ourselves, and given the profiteering (looking at you, Eurostar!) it would cost us over £1000 to get home any earlier. 

I know a lot of this doesn’t apply to the original poster’s situation but may be of interest to those stuck overseas. 

Grumpy_chap

clicka said:

Our insurance company won’t cover us as they deem the computer glitch as “extraordinary circumstances”. 

clicka said:

The insurance company consider the fault to be in the same category as extreme weather, terrorist attack - i.e.: and I quote “extraordinary circumstances”. Maybe it’s worth following up with them again.

The airline have fully refunded you so there would seem to be nothing further to claim there.

The other service providers were able to provide the service and it is not your fault that no use could be made of the services.  There would seem to be nothing further to claim there.

One thing you could request, assuming refund request is refused, is a change of date.  If the hotel was over-sold on the date you should have been there, they suffered genuine loss.  If however, the hotel was at less than 100% sold occupancy, they did not really lose out by your non-arrival and may be willing to offer accommodation (or a discount) on another date that is also at less than 100% occupancy.  Hotels often work on the basis of selling the room as low as possible and generating value when you buy extras such as meals, drinks, excursions and such like.
I can't see that you mentioned whether the accommodation was a hotel, where this type of request may gain some ground, or villa where this type of request would have less traction.

If you could get the accommodation re-dated and the flights were refunded anyway, the losses are substantially reduced (car parking, car hire) and the pain may be more bearable.

The real people that should be resolving this for you are your travel insurance and I think it is worth contacting them again, or simply submit the claim through their claims process.  Then be ready to counter any rejection if required by your own substantiation as to where the policy covers the event, or the exclusion is invalid.
Read the policy in absolute detail, including all the parts of what extra clauses are included or excluded from your cover level before contacting them again.

Arguably, every claim is down to extraordinary circumstances.  What exactly does the "extraordinary circumstances" clause in the policy say?
You mentioned two examples:

• extreme weather - this event was entirely unrelated
• terrorist attack - this event was entirely unrelated.  It is possible that the call-centre operative you spoke with had been guided to refer to this if it was thought to be a cyber attack and if that is covered under the definition of terrorist attack (or act of war).  It seems to have been confirmed that the computer system failure was not a cyber attack so this possible defence of the insurer fails to stand any longer (if indeed it ever did stand).

What other parameters are listed in the policy under "extraordinary circumstances"?

ShelterfromtheStirm

My insurance schedule excludes flight delays ‘caused by technical issues such as computer system failure’. 

sheramber

clicka said:

Hello All - does anybody have any advice for travellers who are out of pocket due to the NATS system failure where the holiday accommodation was booked separately to the flights (i.e.: a non package holiday)

We had our flights cancelled (Stanstead to Kefalonia) by Jet2 after being delayed for 7 hours as we were boarding the plane.  Luckily we only live an hour from the airport so we were able to drive home so no additional expenses (although lots of other people will have).  However, we have expenses where we have paid for car parking, car hire, car insurance excess cover, and accommodation (booked through Booking.com) to the tune of nearly £2k.
We have been refunded the flights, but importantly we were not asked if we wanted a refund or if we would prefer they try and get us to our destination - which I believe is aviation law.  We have unsuccessfully managed to get any money back from the individual companies where the non-flight parts of our holiday was booked.  Our insurance company won’t cover us as they deem the computer glitch as “extraordinary circumstances”.  The same reason why compensation is unlikely from the airline, although I do feel they should have at least attempted (or asked) to get us to destination. So we may have been able to use the accommodation if even for half of the time booked.

Listening to the news it does sound like the issue occurred due to human error yet nobody seems to be accountable.

None of the news channels or media outlets seem to be covering this angle of of incident so there is no advice being given to us or other holiday makers in the same scenario.

We did pay for everything on credit card. What would our chances be of claiming back from the credit card company since we have paid for something not used?  I’m guessing none as no fraud or damaged goods has occurred.

if anybody has any advice please share.  Or if their is a journalist reading this please get this scenario covered in the national press.

Thanks

Mark

Several papers and the BBC have covered the story but all confirm that no compensation is due.

Accommodation and alternative flights  or, if no suitsble alternative  flight ,  a refund and reasonable alternative travel costs (  ferry, train etc) to get home  can be claimed.