where to start for section 21?

marmaruser

Hello, I gave my 3 bedroom house for a tenant who is living there for 4 years.(total rent increased in 4 yearr is 12%) Now AST fixed term is completed and it goes in 2 month rolling contract. Last year my mortgage increased by 145% and requested the rental increse, they agreed for 3.7%. this year i told i wanted to increase the rent by 7.5% - I gave them 4 months notice for rent increase, The tenant keep saying i can't increase the rent every year and also the tone was disrespectful. they mentioned i can increase only by £25 for current tenant as per gov law, which i know is not true. one of the tenant failed the initial search with ccj, irrespective of that i gave them the house because i thought of helping them.  when the boiler had few issues, i installed new boiler within a week of issue. they even asked if i have other houses for their relatives. Luckily i did not rent to them, I am not professional landlord. suddenly they started using the word they need to consult to their solicitor for even rent increase. in last 3+ years, few months rent was in arrear, i accepted late payments many times as i thought i was to helping them. Now i am feeling they took for granted.

I would like to use my section 21 notice.

1. I did not put the deposit in deposit scheme - i can repay in couple of mins even now - so that is not an issue. i will repay before issuing section 21.
2. My EPC got expired just this month - did not know i need to give them during initial tenancy - Can i send the 1 month expired EPC now by email - will it be valid ?
3. As a backup already requested for EPC from 3rd party now - but the tenant are not anwering the call.
4. Also need to apply for gas certificate (got expired) - again need acccess from them - Already requested
5. need to send them the rent guide

What more do i need to do before giving section 21?

CSI_Yorkshire

marmaruser said:

I gave my 3 bedroom house for tenant who is living there for almost 4 years. now AST fixed term is over and it goes in 2 month rolling contract. Last year my mortgage increased by 145% and requested the rental increse, they agreed for 3.7%. this year i told i wanted to increase the rent 7.5% - i told i give them 4 months notice for rent increase, The tenant keep saying i can't increase the rent every year and also the tone was disrespectful. they mentioned i can increase only by £25 for sitting tenant as per gov law, which i know is not true. Money is not biggest thing, but i felt disrespected by tenant. one of the tenant failed the initial search with ccj, irrespective of that i gave them the house because i thought of helping them.  when the boiler had few repair initial days, i installed new boiler within a week. they even asked if i have other houses for their relatives. Luckily i did not rent to them, I am not professional landlord. suddenyl they started using the word they need to consult to their solicitor for eve rent increase. in last 3+ years, few months rent was in arrear, i accepted late payments many times as i thought i wanted to help them. Now i am feeling they are taking me granted.

Now i am thinking of using my section 21 notice.

1. I did not put the deposit in deposit scheme - i can repay in couple of mins even now - so that is not an issue. 
2. My EPC got expired just this month - did not know i need to give them during initial tenancy - Can i send the 1 month expired EPC now - will it be valid ?
3. As a backup already requested for EPC from 3rd party now - but the tenant are not anwering the call.
4. Also need to apply for gas certificate (got expired) - again need acccess from them - Already requested
5. need to send them the rent guide

What more do i need to do before giving section 21?

1. Yes it is.

marmaruser

CSI_Yorkshire said:

marmaruser said:

I gave my 3 bedroom house for tenant who is living there for almost 4 years. now AST fixed term is over and it goes in 2 month rolling contract. Last year my mortgage increased by 145% and requested the rental increse, they agreed for 3.7%. this year i told i wanted to increase the rent 7.5% - i told i give them 4 months notice for rent increase, The tenant keep saying i can't increase the rent every year and also the tone was disrespectful. they mentioned i can increase only by £25 for sitting tenant as per gov law, which i know is not true. Money is not biggest thing, but i felt disrespected by tenant. one of the tenant failed the initial search with ccj, irrespective of that i gave them the house because i thought of helping them.  when the boiler had few repair initial days, i installed new boiler within a week. they even asked if i have other houses for their relatives. Luckily i did not rent to them, I am not professional landlord. suddenyl they started using the word they need to consult to their solicitor for eve rent increase. in last 3+ years, few months rent was in arrear, i accepted late payments many times as i thought i wanted to help them. Now i am feeling they are taking me granted.

Now i am thinking of using my section 21 notice.

1. I did not put the deposit in deposit scheme - i can repay in couple of mins even now - so that is not an issue. 
2. My EPC got expired just this month - did not know i need to give them during initial tenancy - Can i send the 1 month expired EPC now - will it be valid ?
3. As a backup already requested for EPC from 3rd party now - but the tenant are not anwering the call.
4. Also need to apply for gas certificate (got expired) - again need acccess from them - Already requested
5. need to send them the rent guide

What more do i need to do before giving section 21?

1. Yes it is.

even if i returned the deposit before issuing section 21?

MEM62

marmaruser said:

I am not professional landlord. 

Yes, you are.  You are running a business and claiming to be an amateur will not protect you from your responsibilities as a landlord.  You are currently exposed to a lot of risk  

marmaruser said:

one of the tenant failed the initial search with ccj, irrespective of that i gave them the house because i thought of helping them.  

marmaruser said:

in last 3+ years, few months rent was in arrear, i accepted late payments many times as i thought i was to helping them. Now i am feeling they took for granted.

You were helping them - to realise that they can take advantage of you. You have placed your tenants in control.    

marmaruser said:

1. I did not put the deposit in deposit scheme - i can repay in couple of mins even now - so that is not an issue. i will repay before issuing section 21.
2. My EPC got expired just this month - did not know i need to give them during initial tenancy - Can i send the 1 month expired EPC now by email - will it be valid ?
3. As a backup already requested for EPC from 3rd party now - but the tenant are not anwering the call.
4. Also need to apply for gas certificate (got expired) - again need acccess from them - Already requested
5. need to send them the rent guide

What more do i need to do before giving section 21?

Points 1 - 4 should all have been taken care of at the commencement of the tenancy.  Item 1 will come back to bite you as you tenant can claim 3x the deposit amount from you for not protecting it in a prescribed scheme.  If they are taking legal advise they will be aware of this.  The tenants are not going to cooperate in allowing you to sort items 3 and 4. 

The tenancy is not regular and, as such, any S21 notice will be invalid until you have all your paperwork sorted.  To be honest, you need advice from someone experienced in this area to exercise some damage limitation.  The law already favors the tenant and your failure to follow proper processes really has given them the upper hand.                
  
  

silvercar

An epc is valid for 10 years, you only need to produce a new one when you are marketing the property for rent or sale.

I suspect that you are saying it is 10 years old, which is fine as you aren't marketing the property. 

RAS

Just checking that the house is in England?

Before you do anything else, join the NRLA and get professional help sorting out your mess. It's going to cost you a lot of money to sort this out and you might as well pay a professional to get it right than scrimp and mess up.

They may be able to get your ducks in a row and you may get really lucky when the tenant takes you to court and only get stung for £2xthe deposit. And hope they don't trash the place when they leave.

I'd suggest working out what the market rent is for the house and issue a proper formal notice for that amount. If you are lucky, the tenant will get into arrears and you might get them out on that basis, BUT you need to get all the paperwork sorted out first.

theartfullodger

It only goes into a 2 monthly rolling contract if rent is payable every 2 months (bad idea btw imho).  Did you perhaps mean landlord must give at least 2 months notice with s21?

What education have you done in rent out this substantial asset please?

propertyrental

comments in bold:

marmaruser said:

Hello, I gave my 3 bedroom house for a tenant who is living there for 4 years.(total rent increased in 4 yearr is 12% (not really relevant. How does current rent compare with the market?)
 Now AST fixed term is completed and it goes in 2 month rolling contract.
Why? Is that what the tenancy agreement says? How often is rent paid: monthly or every 2 months? I suspect you mean it goes to a monthly rolling contract, though you as LL must still give 2 months notice via S21, and tenant might have to give 2 months depending on the contract wording.
 Last year my mortgage increased by 145% (irrelevant. What are local market rents?) and requested the rental increse, they agreed for 3.7%.OK. And they paid this?
 this year i told i wanted to increase the rent by 7.5% - I gave them 4 months notice for rent increase,
'told them' how? verbal? text? email? letter?
What does your tenancy agreement say about rent increases, if anything? Please quote exactly.
If TA says nothing, did you serve a S13 notice (ad was the tenancy periodic at the time or still in fixed term?

The tenant keep saying i can't increase the rent every year
do they say why?
What does the tenancy agreement say? If the TA says rent can be increased every 2 years, they are right....
 and also the tone was disrespectful.(irrelevant) they mentioned i can increase only by £25 for current tenant as per gov law, which i know is not true.
you are right so ignore this
one of the tenant failed the initial search with ccj, irrespective of that i gave them the house because i thought of helping them. irrelevant. that's history and was your choice
 when the boiler had few issues, i installed new boiler within a week of issue.  irrelevant that's the job of a landlord
they even asked if i have other houses for their relatives. so? irrelevant Luckily i did not rent to them, I am not professional landlord. yes you are
 suddenly they started using the word they need to consult to their solicitor for even rent increase. OK. Let them consult!
 in last 3+ years, few months rent was in arrear, i accepted late payments many times as i thought i was to helping them. Now i am feeling they took for granted.
You could perhaps issue a S8 G10 if any rent now in arrears or G11 if not. See link below

I would like to use my section 21 notice.

1. I did not put the deposit in deposit scheme - i can repay in couple of mins even now - so that is not an issue. i will repay before issuing section 21. if you repay the deposit in full (or less any deductions the Ts agree) your S21 will be valid.
But they can still claim the penalty from you for failing to register. Probably hget 1 or 2 times the deposit as it's been returned.
2. My EPC got expired just this month - did not know i need to give them during initial tenancy - Can i send the 1 month expired EPC now by email - will it be valid ? if it was valid when the tenancy started, and you give it to them now, the S21 will be valid.
3. As a backup already requested for EPC from 3rd party now - but the tenant are not anwering the call. no need to update it now unless/until you sell or re-let the property
4. Also need to apply for gas certificate (got expired) - again need acccess from them - Already requested There's potentially a heavy fine. Follow the HSE guide
5. need to send them the rent guide yes do it now

S21 checklist (Is a S21 valid?)

Schedule 2 (17 S8 Grounds a LL can use)

https://www.hse.gov.uk/gas/landlords/dealing.htm

cheeseball73

It was very, very stupid of you not to protect the deposit. 

It sounds like you don't really know what you are doing in terms of ensuring you are complying with regulations designed to protect both landlord and tenant, which is bad for both parties. You either need to be really on the ball and up to date with your obligations/paperwork as a landlord or you need to pay a letting agency to do that for you. 

propertyrental

cheeseball73 said:

It was very, very stupid of you not to protect the deposit. 

It sounds like you don't really know what you are doing in terms of ensuring you are complying with regulations designed to protect both landlord and tenant, which is bad for both parties. You either need to be really on the ball and up to date with your obligations/paperwork as a landlord or you need to pay a letting agency to do that for you. 

Whilst I basically agree, it's a bit late now. OP is where he is. Once he untangles himself, if he decides to re-let, your advice will be spot on!

marmaruser

Thanks for the feedback, 

1. I can confirm gas certificate is obtained now and valid for 1 year from now. Also confirm out of last 4 years, 3 years gas certificate is available (missing period is 9 months)
2. Is it better to deposit the money now or just return full to them? if i am returning should i just send in bank transfer?
3. Fixed term is over and the tenancy goes rolling monthly with following wording in agreement  "If the Landlord allows the Tenant to remain in the Property after the Term has expired then a statutory periodic tenancy shall arise on a monthly basis "

I am trying to untangle the knots one by one.