Deposit penalties 2-6x - Legalise Letter from Landlord - Help!

Tigsy2222

propertyrental said:

Tigsy2222 said:

 @propertyrental I can't post links on the forum yet, too new, but The National Residential Landlords Association's guide to contractual and statutory periodic tenancies is where to look. 

All you need do is paste the link into your post and then add a space somewhere (eg  www. xxxx). The system will then not recognise it as a link and we just have to remove the space......

Nope, that doesn't work, I have tried it already and just again, to be sure. 

CSI_Yorkshire

Here is the extract from the NRLA guide:



https://www.nrla.org.uk/resources/creating-your-tenancy/guide-to-contractual-and-periodic-tenancies

So, they seem to be saying that when the periodic tenancy is a contractual continuation of the fixed term - with wording like "at the end of the fixed period, this will continue on a month-to-month rolling basis..." then it is all one tenancy so only one penalty.

In comparison, if there is no such wording and the tenancy just becomes statutory periodic, they state that this is legally a new tenancy so there is a second penalty.

I wonder how much of this is to push membership as they point out "All of the NRLA assured shorthold tenancy agreements create a contractual periodic tenancy that continues on from the initial fixed term.  Along with a host of other documents, these agreements are free to download for all members of the NRLA." alongside links to join.

propertyrental

Far be it from me to question the NRLA, but I'd be interested in reading some additional reliable confirmatory source for this interpretation.

And as I said earlier, I'd be interested in hearing of any actual legal case(s) where this interpretation was ruled on by a court.

Tigsy2222

Update - I wrote to LL requesting return of deposit but not accepting 'final settlement' in deposit matters. The deposit, with reductions, was returned this morning but still no info regarding the fact he ever protected it. I am going to chat to a solicitor today. I'll keep updating this as things move forward. 

Schwarzwald

More general question than only specific to this case, but can one launch a small claims case for a matter like this?

if you got parts of your deposit back, I might rather go down that path than mandating a solicitor. if he hasnt protected the deposit, he will probably shy away from fighthing this case.

just an additional thought.

OhWow

propertyrental said:

Far be it from me to question the NRLA, but I'd be interested in reading some additional reliable confirmatory source for this interpretation.

And as I said earlier, I'd be interested in hearing of any actual legal case(s) where this interpretation was ruled on by a court.

From reading your post, it took a mere few seconds to find  a case where 6 times the deposit was awarded-

"5.That said, Superstrike remains good law and the fact that a statutory periodic tenancy is deemed a new tenancy with a new deposit is important in relation to the present question. If the logic is followed, where the deposit remains unprotected, there is a breach each time a new tenancy begins.  There is case law to support this view.

6. In Akrigg v Pigeon (unreported), 25 September 2015 (County Court at Chippenham and Trowbridge), two penalties were awarded of three times the deposit, one in relation to the original tenancy and one in relation to the statutory periodic tenancy that followed."

https://becket-chambers.co.uk/2022/02/02/penalties-for-not-protecting-a-deposit/

Superstrike Ltd v  Rodrigues 

https://www.bailii.org/ew/cases/EWCA/Civ/2013/669.html

Tigsy2222

Schwarzwald said:

More general question than only specific to this case, but can one launch a small claims case for a matter like this?

if you got parts of your deposit back, I might rather go down that path than mandating a solicitor. if he hasnt protected the deposit, he will probably shy away from fighthing this case.

just an additional thought.

It's not a small claim it's actually county court that deals with non protection of deposit. In that respect the LL also has to recompense the tenant for any legal fees paid out.

@OhWow thank you for that. I have read about the Superstrike Ltd v  Rodrigues. BLA (British Landlords Association) also discuss that case and a subsequent one that wasn't won so it will be interesting to see what the solicitor comes back with. 

OhWow

Tigsy2222 said:

Schwarzwald said:

More general question than only specific to this case, but can one launch a small claims case for a matter like this?

if you got parts of your deposit back, I might rather go down that path than mandating a solicitor. if he hasnt protected the deposit, he will probably shy away from fighthing this case.

just an additional thought.

It's not a small claim it's actually county court that deals with non protection of deposit. In that respect the LL also has to recompense the tenant for any legal fees paid out.

@OhWow thank you for that. I have read about the Superstrike Ltd v  Rodrigues. BLA (British Landlords Association) also discuss that case and a subsequent one that wasn't won so it will be interesting to see what the solicitor comes back with. 

It might be worth reading all that link?

Do you qualify for Legal Aid? Shelter should have info on this.

Have you got legal protection cover on an insurance policy?

Failing that, have you checked to see if you could get pro bono for your case? Your case might interest someone.

Places such as Hackney Community Law Centre https://hclc.org.uk/CUsersSeanDownloadswetransfer-1050f9.zip

and others like it, can often give free help (if they have the room for another case).   Or look for one like it in your area?

Grizebeck

Tigsy2222 said:

Schwarzwald said:

More general question than only specific to this case, but can one launch a small claims case for a matter like this?

if you got parts of your deposit back, I might rather go down that path than mandating a solicitor. if he hasnt protected the deposit, he will probably shy away from fighthing this case.

just an additional thought.

It's not a small claim it's actually county court that deals with non protection of deposit. In that respect the LL also has to recompense the tenant for any legal fees paid out.

@OhWow thank you for that. I have read about the Superstrike Ltd v  Rodrigues. BLA (British Landlords Association) also discuss that case and a subsequent one that wasn't won so it will be interesting to see what the solicitor comes back with. 

Yes and no
A small claim is just a track within the county court, and this is a part 8 claim
You do not need a solicitor for this.
Where in the country are you ?

Grizebeck

https://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/procedure-rules/civil/rules/part08