Drainage/guttering cemented-over

FreeBear

stuart45 said:

I'd tell him to rip out that mess anyway, it's such a bad job, as well as staining some of the pavers.

And the longer it is left, the harder the concrete will become.

I hope the "landscaper" isn't charging for slapping that concrete down...

housebuyer143

That concrete job doesn't look good at all, it's terribly messy...

ThisIsWeird

Tiiia said:

Thanks for your concise reply there - so, according to my brother whose room it affected most downstairs - there was an improvement, less rising damp and the such as he saw it.

 I spoke to the landscaper earlier and apparently the water wasn't soaking away properly, kind of settling in the gravel when he examined the drainage system and was against the wall, hence why he concreted over it as in the pic. He's left the vertical drain uncovered though (circled). 

But you've given me some points to think about there, I will probs need to contact the prior drainage experts to ask. Thanks again

Ok, so the French (gravel) drain did seem to work, tho' possibly not 100%?

A few further points that need clarifying, please:

1) Where is the DPC in relation to that path level - and now the concrete level? Has the new concreting covered it over at all? If it has, then the concrete needs to come out, and the landscaper will need to do this work without any further charge (and not bill for putting it in in the first place). Thou shalt not bridge the DPC.

2) Where does the circled drain run off to? I presume it does drain to some suitable point? If it does, then there's your answer - the French drain should feed into that too.

3) There is a gutter downpipe feeding into that drain gulley to the right of the circle. So why doesn't the French drain also do so? Does that drain 'work'?!

It would appear that there were easy and obvious solutions available here, and any rain water still sitting in the gravel trench could have been disposed of quite simply by using the existing drain shown.

On a different note, the quality of work is simply hellish, and is unacceptable even on that basis.

It won't be pleasant, but I'd be insisting that all that concrete comes out right away, and any charge made for it refunded. Unless I have got something wrong here, this was a mistake, an error, an incorrect move, ill-informed, and it not only looks hellish, but will almost certainly cause damp issues. Your mum isn't liable for this even tho' she agreed to it - as a layperson, she took the advice of a supposed professional.

If some water was sitting in the French drain, then it could all have been cleared out, possibly deepened if needed, and a good drainage path cleared out to the existing DP drain. It would then be partially filled back up with clean coarse gravel, perhaps to 2 or 3 inches below path level; it'll still do its job as before, but this should reduce splashback a little further. It should certainly be at below DPC level.

Tiiia

FreeBear said:

stuart45 said:

I'd tell him to rip out that mess anyway, it's such a bad job, as well as staining some of the pavers.

And the longer it is left, the harder the concrete will become.

I hope the "landscaper" isn't charging for slapping that concrete down...

Hi, yes I will have to have a word. Though its a catch-22 situation as he's adamant it needed to be done! Thanks for your response 👍 

Tiiia

housebuyer143 said:

That concrete job doesn't look good at all, it's terribly messy...

I was afraid of that! I'll have to ask my brother, as stuck in the middle or I hope there's more to it! 

Tiiia

ThisIsWeird said:

Tiiia said:

Thanks for your concise reply there - so, according to my brother whose room it affected most downstairs - there was an improvement, less rising damp and the such as he saw it.

 I spoke to the landscaper earlier and apparently the water wasn't soaking away properly, kind of settling in the gravel when he examined the drainage system and was against the wall, hence why he concreted over it as in the pic. He's left the vertical drain uncovered though (circled). 

But you've given me some points to think about there, I will probs need to contact the prior drainage experts to ask. Thanks again

Ok, so the French (gravel) drain did seem to work, tho' possibly not 100%?

A few further points that need clarifying, please:

1) Where is the DPC in relation to that path level - and now the concrete level? Has the new concreting covered it over at all? If it has, then the concrete needs to come out, and the landscaper will need to do this work without any further charge (and not bill for putting it in in the first place). Thou shalt not bridge the DPC.

2) Where does the circled drain run off to? I presume it does drain to some suitable point? If it does, then there's your answer - the French drain should feed into that too.

3) There is a gutter downpipe feeding into that drain gulley to the right of the circle. So why doesn't the French drain also do so? Does that drain 'work'?!

It would appear that there were easy and obvious solutions available here, and any rain water still sitting in the gravel trench could have been disposed of quite simply by using the existing drain shown.

On a different note, the quality of work is simply hellish, and is unacceptable even on that basis.

It won't be pleasant, but I'd be insisting that all that concrete comes out right away, and any charge made for it refunded. Unless I have got something wrong here, this was a mistake, an error, an incorrect move, ill-informed, and it not only looks hellish, but will almost certainly cause damp issues. Your mum isn't liable for this even tho' she agreed to it - as a layperson, she took the advice of a supposed professional.

If some water was sitting in the French drain, then it could all have been cleared out, possibly deepened if needed, and a good drainage path cleared out to the existing DP drain. It would then be partially filled back up with clean coarse gravel, perhaps to 2 or 3 inches below path level; it'll still do its job as before, but this should reduce splashback a little further. It should certainly be at below DPC level.

Hey, so - yes the gravel did work, but perhaps in later months it got slightly waterlogged and the concern arose from water resting against the brick. I've texted my brother waiting for a response to some of your comments - we do have a street drain just outside which is where I assume all flows off to. 

From memory, the DPC is X dimensions below the gutter, i can't remember the exact measurements, 1.5-something seems to ring a bell, though i will need to clarify - and yes, the new concreting has covered it over. That drainpipe you see is from the bathroom/ kitchen, so that drain does indeed work.

He's given a guarantee that he's done that a lot to houses and it's for the best esp for old brickwork, so it seems like he has exp'ce in such older houses.

I will bear the comments in mind esp about being charged and whatnot - you've alleviated some of my suspicions/worries, so thanks !

stuart45

Tiiia said:

He's given a guarantee that he's done that a lot to houses and it's for the best esp for old brickwork, so it seems like he has exp'ce in such older houses.

I'd say he doesn't have much experience in concrete finishing, and even less in damp problems in older houses.

ThisIsWeird

Tiiia said:

Hey, so - yes the gravel did work, but perhaps in later months it got slightly waterlogged and the concern arose from water resting against the brick. I've texted my brother waiting for a response to some of your comments - we do have a street drain just outside which is where I assume all flows off to. 

From memory, the DPC is X dimensions below the gutter, i can't remember the exact measurements, 1.5-something seems to ring a bell, though i will need to clarify - and yes, the new concreting has covered it over. That drainpipe you see is from the bathroom/ kitchen, so that drain does indeed work.

He's given a guarantee that he's done that a lot to houses and it's for the best esp for old brickwork, so it seems like he has exp'ce in such older houses.

I will bear the comments in mind esp about being charged and whatnot - you've alleviated some of my suspicions/worries, so thanks !

Given the position of the DPC, it would appear that the block path was originally laid too high, and the solution to it encroaching on the DPC - to try and keep it the required 150mm below it - was the French drain. This appears to have largely worked, but it isn't unusual for such drains to require occasional cleaning out as they will build up with dust, dirt and silt being washed off the path. Once this builds up an unhealthy layer along the drain bottom, it won't function properly. And, the drain also needs somewhere to drain away to - only a small amount will seep directly into the ground.
So, you seemingly had a functioning Fdrain, and it also appears to have either been able to empty via a proper drain, or had close access to one. Without fully removing and lowering that whole path by a good ~150mm or so, you seemingly did have the best solution already there. No longer; it is now as tho' the path were laid fully across, and at above DPC height, which is very very wrong.
You can try a google on topics like "can I cover over my DPC", or "how to build a French drain" or "height of path beside our house" to get some further info, so you are not just relying on one source. Please let us know what you find.
The quality of the cement work is a separate, tho' connected, issue. At a glance, I'd be concerned about the competence of that fellow. Would you like to see my 'cementing' of the exact same situation, carried out - as a layman - a couple of weeks ago? Your guy's work is simply dreadful - no other word. It is hard to understand why it is so bad - it just demonstrates a complete lack of care, or ability, or both.
I really hope that his lack of care went as far as him not even removing the gravel first, because that will at least make it easier for him to remove the concrete 'crust'. But the affected path bricks will remain looking hellish. If they cannot be cleaned up or replaced, perhaps a solution could be to paint both path outer rows a contrasting colour, say charcoal?
Do you know any general builders, one who could pop in to or from a job to have a look? I think, once you explain where the now-hidden DPC lies, you'll get an opinion in 5 seconds.
Does your mum have Legal Protection in her house insurance?

stuart45

Apart from being laid too high, the path.was laid with a crown. This is a good method on a path running down the centre of a garden, but not when it sends half the water against the house walls and down into the foundations.
External groundworks should send water away from the house.

ThisIsWeird

Tiiia said:

 That drainpipe you see is from the bathroom/ kitchen, so that drain does indeed work.

The 'drainpipe' ("gutter downpipe") I was referring to is the black-painted grey pipe, and that is a rainwater downpipe, surely? In which case, your house has been set up to allow the roof gutter rainfall to discharge vis the shown drain (rightly or wrongly!)

So, the contents of the French Drain could also empty via that drain - and good chance it already is (was...)

So there is NO excuse - that French Drain was the best solution under the circumstances, and the gravel level inside it could have been reduced by a couple of inches to make it slightly more effective at reducing splashback. If water was settling in the drain, then that specific issue should have been addressed, and I suspect it would not have been difficult.

This is a bad move on a number of levels, and very poorly executed to boot.

Please 'surf' - I don't think you appreciate just how bad and wrong this job is. His 'guarantee' is meaningless.