State Pension - will it eventually be means tested?

SouthCoastBoy

QrizB said:

tigerspill said:

I don't think it will be any time soon.  Political suicide  for any party progressing this.

I could imagine it being tapered away at higher incomes, like HICBC.

Far from being political suicide, most people (even most pensioners) wouldn't object in the slightest.

The problem with that is the HICBC isn't particularly high anymore, the threshold hasn't moved since it was introduced 10 years ago. Slowly it eats into more and more people. If they ever introduced something similar for the state pension I imagine the threshold would suffer a similar fate.

Albermarle

QrizB said:

tigerspill said:

I don't think it will be any time soon.  Political suicide  for any party progressing this.

I could imagine it being tapered away at higher incomes, like HICBC.

Far from being political suicide, most people (even most pensioners) wouldn't object in the slightest.

The Daily Express and Daily Mail would be apoplectic with fake fury. Then again nobody under 50 reads newspapers anymore I guess. 

Pat38493

Any such changes would have to be made over an extremely long time period as people would need many years to plan for it (unless it was only targeted at ridiculously rich people in which case it wouldn't make a lot of difference in the grand scheme of things).

Pollycat

QrizB said:

tigerspill said:

I don't think it will be any time soon.  Political suicide  for any party progressing this.

Far from being political suicide, most people (even most pensioners) wouldn't object in the slightest.

Really?
Why do you think that?
I've been in receipt of my state pension for 5+ years but I would still oppose it.
Why do you think people who have paid NI for years would't object?

QrizB

Pollycat said:

QrizB said:

tigerspill said:

I don't think it will be any time soon.  Political suicide  for any party progressing this.

Far from being political suicide, most people (even most pensioners) wouldn't object in the slightest.

Really?
Why do you think that?
I've been in receipt of my state pension for 5+ years but I would still oppose it.
Why do you think people who have paid NI for years would't object?

People (in general) like to think they're taxing the rich. Partly because they don't ever expect to be rich themselves.

Tapering the state pension at eg. £1 (per week) for each £100 of income a pensioner receives over, say, £40k pa wouldn't directly affect the vast majority of voters.

Back this up with a press release or two stating that it's inequitable for "hard-working families" to pay NI just to see it given as benefits to "fat cat pensioners" with incomes exceeding the national average full-time wage, and you'll have no problems beyond the letters pages of the Mail and Express.

eastcorkram

QrizB said:

Pollycat said:

QrizB said:

tigerspill said:

I don't think it will be any time soon.  Political suicide  for any party progressing this.

Far from being political suicide, most people (even most pensioners) wouldn't object in the slightest.

Really?
Why do you think that?
I've been in receipt of my state pension for 5+ years but I would still oppose it.
Why do you think people who have paid NI for years would't object?

People (in general) like to think they're taxing the rich. Partly because they don't ever expect to be rich themselves.

Tapering the state pension at eg. £1 (per week) for each £100 of income a pensioner receives over, say, £40k pa wouldn't directly affect the vast majority of voters.

Back this up with a press release or two stating that it's inequitable for "hard-working families" to pay NI just to see it given as benefits to "fat cat pensioners" with incomes exceeding the national average full-time wage, and you'll have no problems beyond the letters pages of the Mail and Express.

Absolutely. I think it would prove very popular. Not saying it's a good thing, but I think the vast majority of people would be in favour of it, as it would only effect wealthy people.

Once in of course, it would gradually be increased, to effect more and more people, and then would become unpopular!

Flugelhorn

it is effectively means tested  - some people pay no tax on it, some pay 20% tax on all of it and some people pay 40% on it 

Silvertabby

Pat38493 said:

Any such changes would have to be made over an extremely long time period as people would need many years to plan for it (unless it was only targeted at ridiculously rich people in which case it wouldn't make a lot of difference in the grand scheme of things).

I would expect (hope?) that the seriously rich don't bother claiming their State pensions.

Universidad

Flugelhorn said:

it is effectively means tested  - some people pay no tax on it, some pay 20% tax on all of it and some people pay 40% on it 

This is a critically important point. Any means testing on previously accrued state pension that goes beyond the existing tax thresholds should be described in terms of a marginal tax rate. 

I don't expect the triple lock to survive, but I think if you're taxing pensioners at 100% the pendulum will have swung too far to be sustainable.

Doctor_Who

Flugelhorn said:

it is effectively means tested  - some people pay no tax on it, some pay 20% tax on all of it and some people pay 40% on it 

And some people pay 42% (on anything over £43,663)......