Shall I buy a house with retrospective planning recently refused?

jonnydeppiwish!

Op, if you’re buying this property then you need to revalue it according to how much it will cost to correct the issues. The owner is unlikely to budge, so move on to the next.

Section62

CSI_Yorkshire said:

Section62 said:

utc25 said:

That retrospective application took 8 months from submitted to refused. If owner does appeal how long the process will take? Longer than that?

What were the reasons for refusal?  Councils typically don't refuse a retrospective application unless there is a good reason for doing so.

The length of time for an appeal depends on the type of application, what the issues are, and the process used for dealing with the appeal.  You could guess at somewhere between 20 and 60 weeks, possibly much longer (based on May 2023 cases concluded)

Height of the extension, plus volume? and tile pattern of the loft conversion (although says that was PD) - if I interpret the OP correctly.

I'm hoping the OP will clarify exactly what the issues were, and perhaps quote from any reasoned justifications the council have given exactly which policies the issues related to (e.g. Local Plan, Town/Parish Plan, Design Guidance, Character Statement etc).

The final paragraph of the OP's first post suggests the refusal is only because the tiles don't match other properties on the street, and that the windows aren't matching.

Although there's a general idea of development being 'in keeping' with the surrounding area, this doesn't usually mean all properties have to look identical.  Refusal of a retrospective application purely over the materials used seems a bit thin... unless there is something special in the local planning policies relating to the character of the area.

AIUI the height of the extension was only an issue for permitted development, but again it would be useful if the OP could clarify.

user1977

jonnydeppiwish! said:

Op, if you’re buying this property then you need to revalue it according to how much it will cost to correct the issues. The owner is unlikely to budge, so move on to the next.

And that would need to be a revaluation to a level which would allow it to be a cash purchase…

ThisIsWeird

user1977 said:

ThisIsWeird said:

Will Planning discuss this matter with someone who isn't the owner? If not, then I guess you just give the owner the ultimatum - get written confirmation from Planning of everything that is required to comply, and then work out the cost of this. Deduct.

How does that get past the mortgage problem?

Good point!

I guess the days of a friendly chat with a mortgage advisor who'll accept a guarantee to put the matters right are over. 

Would the LTV have any bearing on this?

BungalowBel

jbainbridge said:

When was the work completed?

After a certain amount of time (a year?) there’s not much the council can do .. unless it’s unsafe.

It's four years....but only if there are no issues reported to start with.  This one is already flagged up, so it is within the four years.  It is irrelevant how long it takes to sort out, it's an ongoing problem.

And yes, there is a  chance the Council might say it all has to be removed.

To the OP, get your bargepole out and make sure it is a long one.  

user1977

ThisIsWeird said:

user1977 said:

ThisIsWeird said:

Will Planning discuss this matter with someone who isn't the owner? If not, then I guess you just give the owner the ultimatum - get written confirmation from Planning of everything that is required to comply, and then work out the cost of this. Deduct.

How does that get past the mortgage problem?

Would the LTV have any bearing on this?

Only if it were a much more minor risk. I can't see any mainstream lender touching something with potentially imminent planning enforcement hanging over it. Don't know whether any non-standard lenders would take a punt, but I suspect the costs would be prohibitive.

utc25

theoretica said:

If it was just the roof tiles it seems strange to me that it would be a flat refusal - rather than something more conditional or clear guidance.  Maybe planning just doesn't work that way.  DO you have a solicitor yet?  What do they say about the refusal letter?

Well, for the technical bit Council said it is contrary to section 12 of the NPPF (2021): Achieving well-designed places, and the local urban design policies. The development is said to be unsympathetic and inappropriate for the house and the street scene. The exterior appearance is of detriment to the character of the area.

For a simple example, I think I read somewhere about a street with brick front wall, then someone built a 2m wooden fence. Council asked it to be torn down.

No, I don't have solicitor yet, the damage so far is only £3 for buying property title.

utc25

stuhse said:

From what has been written,  planning was refused on two issues, none matching tiles and none matching windows.  I'd suggest as others , the house will not get a mortgage as is.  Planning should be granted once the two issues have been put right. I'd suggest the seller is going to have to do this, then resubmit planning.

But could you do that resubmit a retrospective planning?

A further research I found a house just across the road from this one has been refused planning twice, but gets third time lucky. Another one refused first for being too big overshadowing neighbour, then refused for the second time for not providing water neutrality. These two are still in planning phase, nothing built yet.

In the same area, a non-profit organization got retrospective turned down and ordered to demolish.

On recent news about Captain Tom spa, Central Bedfordshire Council refused the retrospective application from his daughter  last year and now ordering demolition. The Council said the planning is now on appeal to the Planning Inspectorate.

Checking the last sold price, the current owner would make about 200k difference if someone buys it and inherit the problem. Maybe a cash buyer. Me, looking for a bargepole or a magnifying glass.

theoretica

utc25 said:

theoretica said:

If it was just the roof tiles it seems strange to me that it would be a flat refusal - rather than something more conditional or clear guidance.  Maybe planning just doesn't work that way.  DO you have a solicitor yet?  What do they say about the refusal letter?

Well, for the technical bit Council said it is contrary to section 12 of the NPPF (2021): Achieving well-designed places, and the local urban design policies. The development is said to be unsympathetic and inappropriate for the house and the street scene. The exterior appearance is of detriment to the character of the area.

For a simple example, I think I read somewhere about a street with brick front wall, then someone built a 2m wooden fence. Council asked it to be torn down.

No, I don't have solicitor yet, the damage so far is only £3 for buying property title.

Hmm - that doesn't read to me as though they are saying clearly what needs to be done in order for them to be happy.  Might be worth asking the seller if there was other communication and they think they can make alterations and get PP and on what timescale...  But then you have the issue of work being done just to sell the property and will quality of the work be prioritised?

pinkshoes

How much would it cost to put the entire thing right so that it DOES meet permitted development?

Providing you can find a mortgage lender that would be happy to lend, I would only then offer what it was worth less the cost of rectifying all the issues. 

At this point you need to assume that the council will chase it and at some point you will then be asked to remove the extensions. If you own the house this will be at your own expense.

You said that the EA said it had planning permission, but upon you doing some digging you found out it doesn't. What does the EA say about this? I would also be putting it in writing to the EA that you have been made aware that the extension and loft conversion have been refused planning permission, so could you see some documentation showing it has since been approved.