Transfer from Aviva to II

dunstonh

Pat38493 said:

Pipthecat said:

Pat38493 said:

Pipthecat said:

I transferred a previous work pension from Aviva to Vanguard.  I went on the Vanguard site, initiated the transfer, selected my funds and about six weeks later the transfer happened.  No contact with Aviva during the transfer.  Only thing I did not expect was to lose access to my online Aviva account in about week four.  I had to call them for a list of my previous years contributions.  Good job on both sides

So you didn't even have to tell Aviva to sell the funds to cash?  Was it an in specie transfer or a cash transfer?

Zero instruction from me to Avia.  Looking at the correspondence I'd imagine it was cashed and remained in cash for around a week (few days either side) before the destination funds were purchased.  Had the same experience with a small Nest pension also.

Interesting because I have just raised a transfer request and it is telling me I have to get a "discharge form" from Aviva - whatever that is.

Aviva doesn't require discharge forms on any of the retail pensions they offer.    A discharge form is required only if a professional administration company is used. e.g. Mercer, Capita etc or which is usually occupational pensions (not including group PPPs or group SHPs or master trust schemes).   In those scenarios, you get the forms from the administrator. i.e. Mercer.

Pat38493

dunstonh said:

Pat38493 said:

Pipthecat said:

Pat38493 said:

Pipthecat said:

I transferred a previous work pension from Aviva to Vanguard.  I went on the Vanguard site, initiated the transfer, selected my funds and about six weeks later the transfer happened.  No contact with Aviva during the transfer.  Only thing I did not expect was to lose access to my online Aviva account in about week four.  I had to call them for a list of my previous years contributions.  Good job on both sides

So you didn't even have to tell Aviva to sell the funds to cash?  Was it an in specie transfer or a cash transfer?

Zero instruction from me to Avia.  Looking at the correspondence I'd imagine it was cashed and remained in cash for around a week (few days either side) before the destination funds were purchased.  Had the same experience with a small Nest pension also.

Interesting because I have just raised a transfer request and it is telling me I have to get a "discharge form" from Aviva - whatever that is.

Aviva doesn't require discharge forms on any of the retail pensions they offer.    A discharge form is required only if a professional administration company is used. e.g. Mercer, Capita etc or which is usually occupational pensions (not including group PPPs or group SHPs or master trust schemes).   In those scenarios, you get the forms from the administrator. i.e. Mercer.

This is, or at least it was in the past, an occupational DC pension, but it doesn't receive any contributions anymore as stated above.  Mercer is somehow involved in the process because the email address says mercer.platform@aviva.com .

I have finally managed to speak to someone at Aviva (who seem to keep changing their phone lines for departments) who told me that he can get me a discharge form and email it to me - not sure how long that normally takes.  The guy I spoke to told me that they can email me a discharge form and they will then take care of everything directly with II.  

Even though the email address says Mercer, the people on the phone line announce themselves as Aviva.

Apparently they have different phone lines depending on policy numbers - my policy starts with an F so I kept getting through to different wrong departments.

I generally take a pessimistic view of these kind of topics so I'm not holding my breath that it will go totally smoothly from now but let's see....

dunstonh

I have finally managed to speak to someone at Aviva (who seem to keep changing their phone lines for departments) who told me that he can get me a discharge form and email it to me - not sure how long that normally takes.  The guy I spoke to told me that they can email me a discharge form and they will then take care of everything directly with II.  

In most cases where a professional administrator is used, the insurer forwards the request to the administrator to handle.   Depending on the commercial relationship (i.e. how much they outsource or deal internally), it would mean a team within the insurer or externally at the administrator.

Apparently they have different phone lines depending on policy numbers - my policy starts with an F so I kept getting through to different wrong departments.

Does it start with an F and then have a / in the middle.  e.g. F1234/123?
Those were Friends Provident NGP plans and normally do not need discharge forms to transfer.  (I have done several recently)

Pat38493

dunstonh said:

I have finally managed to speak to someone at Aviva (who seem to keep changing their phone lines for departments) who told me that he can get me a discharge form and email it to me - not sure how long that normally takes.  The guy I spoke to told me that they can email me a discharge form and they will then take care of everything directly with II.  

In most cases where a professional administrator is used, the insurer forwards the request to the administrator to handle.   Depending on the commercial relationship (i.e. how much they outsource or deal internally), it would mean a team within the insurer or externally at the administrator.

Apparently they have different phone lines depending on policy numbers - my policy starts with an F so I kept getting through to different wrong departments.

Does it start with an F and then have a / in the middle.  e.g. F1234/123?
Those were Friends Provident NGP plans and normally do not need discharge forms to transfer.  (I have done several recently)

It's in the format F12345/67

I don't ever have any letters or documents that mentions Friends Provident but it might have been branded with my company or Mercer in the past.

The guy I spoke to did not state that discharge forms are not needed but I'll see what they come back with.  If I don't hear anything maybe I'll message II to tell them that I suspect no discharge form is needed.

(by the way what is a discharge form - is it a form from Aviva that confirms that they are prepared to transfer out the pension)?

dunstonh

It's in the format F12345/67

I haven't needed a discharge form on those plans previously (well, not since the days when they all needed discharge forms).  

I don't ever have any letters or documents that mentions Friends Provident but it might have been branded with my company or Mercer in the past.

Anything out of Salisbury is ex Friends Provident.  

The guy I spoke to did not state that discharge forms are not needed but I'll see what they come back with.  If I don't hear anything maybe I'll message II to tell them that I suspect no discharge form is needed.

If you request them, they will give them but it doesn't necessarily mean you need them.    If Aviva have asked for discharge forms to be completed then they will need to be completed.  If the receiving scheme has told you to get them it doesn't actually mean they are needed.

(by the way what is a discharge form - is it a form from Aviva that confirms that they are prepared to transfer out the pension)?

Discharge from used to be needed to give permission for the transfer to take place and for the ceding/receiving schemes to share information between them.      Most providers stopped filling them in about 20 years ago and only asked the policyholder to sign the declaration (with providers sharing the information in their own information sheets).   And about 10 years ago, most providers stopped needing discharge forms altogether.    You don't need them when both sides use Origo, for example.

Professional administrators are a bit like the public sector.    "this is way we have always done it".  Whilst most providers are looking for cheaper and quicker ways to do things.

Pat38493

dunstonh said:

It's in the format F12345/67

I haven't needed a discharge form on those plans previously (well, not since the days when they all needed discharge forms).  

I don't ever have any letters or documents that mentions Friends Provident but it might have been branded with my company or Mercer in the past.

Anything out of Salisbury is ex Friends Provident.  

The guy I spoke to did not state that discharge forms are not needed but I'll see what they come back with.  If I don't hear anything maybe I'll message II to tell them that I suspect no discharge form is needed.

If you request them, they will give them but it doesn't necessarily mean you need them.    If Aviva have asked for discharge forms to be completed then they will need to be completed.  If the receiving scheme has told you to get them it doesn't actually mean they are needed.

(by the way what is a discharge form - is it a form from Aviva that confirms that they are prepared to transfer out the pension)?

Discharge from used to be needed to give permission for the transfer to take place and for the ceding/receiving schemes to share information between them.      Most providers stopped filling them in about 20 years ago and only asked the policyholder to sign the declaration (with providers sharing the information in their own information sheets).   And about 10 years ago, most providers stopped needing discharge forms altogether.    You don't need them when both sides use Origo, for example.

Professional administrators are a bit like the public sector.    "this is way we have always done it".  Whilst most providers are looking for cheaper and quicker ways to do things.

Cheers.  Last question I hope.  Is a discharge form something that’s easy to produce and only takes a couple of minutes or should I expect it to take a long time if one is needed?  In the meantime I will also message II and tell them that I don’t believe a discharge form is needed in any case.

dunstonh

 Is a discharge form something that’s easy to produce and only takes a couple of minutes or should I expect it to take a long time if one is needed?

Most of the time, they are partly personalised and it take a week or three to arrive.    

 In the meantime I will also message II and tell them that I don’t believe a discharge form is needed in any case.

I would get the process started as it is unlikely a discharge form is needed.   I believe II use origo and Aviva do, Aviva will tell II the same day whether it has been accepted or not or requires something.

Pat38493

dunstonh said:

 Is a discharge form something that’s easy to produce and only takes a couple of minutes or should I expect it to take a long time if one is needed?

Most of the time, they are partly personalised and it take a week or three to arrive.    

 In the meantime I will also message II and tell them that I don’t believe a discharge form is needed in any case.

I would get the process started as it is unlikely a discharge form is needed.   I believe II use origo and Aviva do, Aviva will tell II the same day whether it has been accepted or not or requires something.

I have messaged them stating that I believe a discharge form is not needed and I might have clicked the wrong type of pension on the request.  

I don't suppose it could also be because you are an IFA that they don't require a discharge form and as I'm a DIY investor they will want one?

dunstonh

Pat38493 said:

dunstonh said:

 Is a discharge form something that’s easy to produce and only takes a couple of minutes or should I expect it to take a long time if one is needed?

Most of the time, they are partly personalised and it take a week or three to arrive.    

 In the meantime I will also message II and tell them that I don’t believe a discharge form is needed in any case.

I would get the process started as it is unlikely a discharge form is needed.   I believe II use origo and Aviva do, Aviva will tell II the same day whether it has been accepted or not or requires something.

I have messaged them stating that I believe a discharge form is not needed and I might have clicked the wrong type of pension on the request.  

I don't suppose it could also be because you are an IFA that they don't require a discharge form and as I'm a DIY investor they will want one?

Discharge forms are not advice/non advice specific.    

Pat38493

dunstonh said:

Pat38493 said:

dunstonh said:

 Is a discharge form something that’s easy to produce and only takes a couple of minutes or should I expect it to take a long time if one is needed?

Most of the time, they are partly personalised and it take a week or three to arrive.    

 In the meantime I will also message II and tell them that I don’t believe a discharge form is needed in any case.

I would get the process started as it is unlikely a discharge form is needed.   I believe II use origo and Aviva do, Aviva will tell II the same day whether it has been accepted or not or requires something.

I have messaged them stating that I believe a discharge form is not needed and I might have clicked the wrong type of pension on the request.  

I don't suppose it could also be because you are an IFA that they don't require a discharge form and as I'm a DIY investor they will want one?

Discharge forms are not advice/non advice specific.    

II have replied to my message saying that my transfer form needs to be amended to cash only - I think I clicked cash and investments before on the logic that they would have to tell Aviva to sell the investments, otherwise they would be transferring zero cash.

There doesn’t seem to be any option to amend the form on their website so I now have to ask them to clarify whether they want me to resubmit the transfer request and sign it again.  Not sure why they need a signed scanned copy as they have secure messaging on the website and I’m not convinced that a scanned copy of a form sent by secure message carries any more legal weight than the secure message itself.