Pay or not?

izobel

Hi all, apologises if I am repeating what has already been asked by others on this forum but I am a student who has received two parking fines from Countrywide Parking for parking at my student flat. I have breached their contract by not displaying a permit in the window of my vehicle. In January I received 3 fines from Countrywide parking for “parking in the wrong bag” my parking is gravel and did not have bays, so I successfully appealed this and the fines were dropped. I then got one for not displaying my permit, £60. I appealed, was unsuccessful. Appealed further through an independent appeals process, which was denied by a solicitor. They now have demanded I pay £100. I ignored it and they haven’t chased because I stated I was a student and couldn’t afford it. Many others at the address have received numerous fines for £100 and countrywide have added £70 on due to late payment. I haven’t had this yet. Others have been contact by Trace Recovery agents (I have read the reviews that they’re a scam company). However, I have recently received another because my permit fell off due to the sun and I now owe them another £60 but they have forgotten about my £100. My first question is can they bring up the £100 one again and get trace on me? Should I pay the £60 before it turns into £100 and then £170 to avoid constant harassment from trace recovery agents? As you can imagine I’m a student and cannot afford these fines, they’re completely unreasonable and it’s causing me and my family at my home address a lot of stress about the risks of being in debt, having a CCJ and being black listed for credit cards etc. Will these companies actually take me to court for my outstanding fines? Have I broken their contract so I wouldn’t succeed in court? Should I just pay all my outstanding fines with them? Or should I continue to ignore them all because they’re all a load of scam artists?
Apologies for the amount of detail and questions in this post, I just have no idea how to deal with this and I haven’t been driving long and I’m a student. Any advice would be greatly appreciated:) thank you!

B789

Without even having read the whole of your post, yet, this immediately jumped out at me:

"I have breached their contract by not displaying a permit in the window of my vehicle."

Are you admitting guilt at this stage?

You haven't been "fined" by anyone. You have received a speculative invoice for an alleged breach of contract from an unregulated private parking company.

Pleading poverty will not mitigate anything for you from these scammers. Get your mind into gear, have a good read of the Newbies/FAQ thread and decide whether you are going to fight this or cave in and pay up. You cannot get a CCJ just because some scammer PPC or even more scamming debt collectors threaten it.

Do you have a lease or tenancy agreement for the flat? You should have a read of that and tell us exactly what it says about parking. What it doesn't say is equally important.

You are about to embark on a learning experience that will hold you in good stead for the rest of your life if you follow the advice and guidance you get on here.

Half_way

Do you have a lease or tenancy agreement for the flat? You should have a read of that and tell us exactly what it says about parking. What it doesn't say is equally important.

As above, this is important.

If this is your space granted to you by the lease/tenancy/rental etc then a third party ( the parking company) can not take this away.

 You would already have the right to use the space , a third party ( ie parking company) can not offer you a contract for something that you already have .

 Now ask yourself this question - if its your space then how much are the parking company/management  paying you for sub letting it out ?  They seem to think its worth between £60-£100 a day,taking the lower figure of £60, and going by the fact we are on Day 165 of the year then at the moment if it is  your space then they owe you £9,900 so far

Coupon-mad

Pay or not?

Of course not!  You don't owe anything.  It's not a fine and there is no appeal worth trying with IPC firms.  They are all the same.

Same advice as this matching thread where they were dithering but easily got the landowner to cancel it (as anyone would) within the same day:
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6453050/first-ever-pcn-should-i-pay-it/p1

...and on this G24 one (happily IGNORING):
https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/comment/80111295/#Comment_80111295

Your case is no different. No-one would pay.

izobel

B789 said:

Without even having read the whole of your post, yet, this immediately jumped out at me:

"I have breached their contract by not displaying a permit in the window of my vehicle."

Are you admitting guilt at this stage?

You haven't been "fined" by anyone. You have received a speculative invoice for an alleged breach of contract from an unregulated private parking company.

Pleading poverty will not mitigate anything for you from these scammers. Get your mind into gear, have a good read of the Newbies/FAQ thread and decide whether you are going to fight this or cave in and pay up. You cannot get a CCJ just because some scammer PPC or even more scamming debt collectors threaten it.

Do you have a lease or tenancy agreement for the flat? You should have a read of that and tell us exactly what it says about parking. What it doesn't say is equally important.

You are about to embark on a learning experience that will hold you in good stead for the rest of your life if you follow the advice and guidance you get on here.

I appreciate your response. My wording was incorrect and rushed, I understand that these types of “fines” are indeed just invoices with no enforcement. I will be appealing the fine following the guidance on the newbies thread. 

My tenancy agreement has no clause about parking at the address. The day I moved in I was posted a permit with no information surrounding parking at the address. I have spoken to my estate agents who lease the property about these “fines” and they suggested that I shouldn’t have been fined but refused to clarify anymore detail. 

Fruitcake

Please stop using the word fine! 

What your tenancy agreement doesn't say is just as important as what it does say. If there is no requirement to display a permit, if there is no clause in your tenancy agreement about unregulated private parking companies, no clause about parking charge notices, no clause about paying parking charge notices nor about court claims, then your tenancy agreement takes precedence over anything the PPC says on their bits of rusty metal around the site, you have no obligation to pay anything to anyone.
It is called primacy of contract. Your right to live there has primacy over parking companies referred to as rogues, scammers, and bloodsuckers by UK MPs across all parties in open parliamentary debate.

You should complain to the landowner and managing agent and whoever rented the place to you because you have been deceived. You should also complain to your MP.

Mouse007

Please read this

https://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/discussion/6357887/case-won-student-accommodation-with-free-parking/p1

take your time, read it again

Mouse007

izobel said:

...I have breached their contract...

and that is the bit which I will help you out of - their contract is not YOUR contract. Stay tuned, stay close and don't go away.

Umkomaas

I understand that these types of “fines” are indeed just invoices with no enforcement.

Only half correct. The invoices can be enforced by a court. The action the PPC is currently undertaking is their attempt to enforce.  Whether the PPC will issue proceedings remains to be seen. 

B789

How bout giving me your address and I will come round and put up a sign that warns drivers that if their car is any colour except black, they will be liable for a "fine" of £100. What makes you think that an unregulated parking company can do anything similar when you are parking at your property?

Mouse007

Will this be another vanishing angel? Why do so many post the panic and then disappear?

Twas it not a panic? Don’t you care? Perhaps you can afford it after all.

You’re a student, my son was a student. We won and we didn’t even have to present an argument in court.

The regulars here know this stuff inside out. Please come back because it ain't going away if you go into ignore mode.

https://youtu.be/TvWzteUWYA0