Advice - Parents and care fees... options?

elsien

 I was at my grandmothers once when the carer came. Paid for 1/2 hour call and she was there for 15 minutes at the most. It’s because carers are expected to do too many calls without travel time being taken into account. 

lisyloo

As I say you need to provide advocacy both to get them the services they need and make sure those services are doing what they should. That applies to the local authority, nursing home, hospital, social services and home carers.

Malthusian

elsien said:

 I was at my grandmothers once when the carer came. Paid for 1/2 hour call and she was there for 15 minutes at the most. It’s because carers are expected to do too many calls without travel time being taken into account. 

Plus, if the carer didn't actually need to hang around for another 15 minutes chatting or twiddling her thumbs (you didn't mention anything left undone) I'm not surprised she went off early in order to catch up on her backlog or just give herself some breathing space. There was no need for her to hang around just to provide social contact, as the client's grandkid was there.

lisyloo said:

I have my doubts as to whether the house could be passed on to other beneficiaries and bypass your mother if she is a "dependent adult" but I'm not a lawyer.

Definitely one for a solicitor, but the default position is that, as sole owner, he is free to leave his house to anyone he wishes. If he disinherited her completely, then (assuming this is England or Wales) she could certainly challenge the Will, but equally she would be free not to. 
He could also leave the Will to a life interest trust that gave her the right to live rent-free in the house for her lifetime but with the capital passing to the children on her death. That would be far less open to challenge. 

RetSol

lisyloo said:

As I say you need to provide advocacy both to get them the services they need and make sure those services are doing what they should. That applies to the local authority, nursing home, hospital, social services and home carers.

Absolutely correct, in my experience. 

RetSol

If you are not familiar with care act processes, it may be a good idea to start looking at that now, as that would identify your mother's support needs and how they would be met.
She would be eligible for one now, as would you dad as her carer, if that has not happened.

I suggest asking social services for an assessment of the parents' needs now as there does not seem to be much doubt that they are eligible. 

elsien

@Malthusian, it was a regular occurrence according to grandparent. And people should be getting the calls that they are assessed for regardless of how they are being funded and who else is present unless the client tells them they are not needed. 

lisyloo

Malthusian said:

elsien said:

 I was at my grandmothers once when the carer came. Paid for 1/2 hour call and she was there for 15 minutes at the most. It’s because carers are expected to do too many calls without travel time being taken into account. 

Plus, if the carer didn't actually need to hang around for another 15 minutes chatting or twiddling her thumbs (you didn't mention anything left undone) I'm not surprised she went off early in order to catch up on her backlog or just give herself some breathing space. There was no need for her to hang around just to provide social contact, as the client's grandkid was there.

lisyloo said:

I have my doubts as to whether the house could be passed on to other beneficiaries and bypass your mother if she is a "dependent adult" but I'm not a lawyer.

Definitely one for a solicitor, but the default position is that, as sole owner, he is free to leave his house to anyone he wishes. If he disinherited her completely, then (assuming this is England or Wales) she could certainly challenge the Will, but equally she would be free not to. 
He could also leave the Will to a life interest trust that gave her the right to live rent-free in the house for her lifetime but with the capital passing to the children on her death. That would be far less open to challenge. 

The local authority might have an interest too, if she qualifies as a "dependent" and needs personal care.
(I am not saying the beneficiaries wouldn't do what's in her best interests anyway).

Malthusian

elsien said:

@Malthusian, it was a regular occurrence according to grandparent. And people should be getting the calls that they are assessed for regardless of how they are being funded and who else is present unless the client tells them they are not needed. 

I overlooked that your post did say that your grandmother "paid for a half hour call" (or you did), in which case leaving 15 minutes early without the customer's explicit consent is not on. I was thinking more in terms of carers (or GPs) who are paid by the state and are just trying to get through the day's appointments.

lisyloo

Malthusian said:

elsien said:

@Malthusian, it was a regular occurrence according to grandparent. And people should be getting the calls that they are assessed for regardless of how they are being funded and who else is present unless the client tells them they are not needed. 

I overlooked that your post did say that your grandmother "paid for a half hour call" (or you did), in which case leaving 15 minutes early without the customer's explicit consent is not on. I was thinking more in terms of carers (or GPs) who are paid by the state and are just trying to get through the day's appointments.

As far as I know these appointments are not to "spent x time with", they are to provide food/drink/tablets/cream/shower etc. and once the job is done then it's done.
It's not uncommon for an older person to decline a shower.
Many clients have capacity and are entitled to make their own decisions.
The 30 minute appointment would have been made to cater for the tasks not for the purpose of just spending 30 mins there.

If the tasks weren't adequately carried out then there is cause for complaint.
If the tasks were completed in less time than estimated or the client declined a shower (or other services) and the job got done quicker then there isn't really any cause for complaint.

elsien

I disagree. For some people, the care calls are the only visitors they have. Support is for well-being, not just the practical tasks of medication etc, well-being being the primary factor underlying the Care Act. So if the tasks are done and someone wants to spend 10 minutes, having a chat with the remainder of their half an hour call they should be fully entitled to do that. 

With apologies to the OP for digressing from their query.