Neighbour building a drive onto private road

ThisIsWeird

Hi Numpty.

A quick Google indicates it's surprisingly hard to deal with trespassers in this country. But this one should hopefully be sortable.

Act with the agreement of as many of your neighb's as possible, tho' you can do this unilaterally - what you do won't affect them, but it'll obviously be much better to have their support.

1) Put up a couple of very clear signs either side of the entrance to the road where they cannot be missed. Check out best wording, but I guess along the lines of 'Private road for No's A to D only - no unauthorised access'. Whether to add anything else like 'no access to unauthorised persons' or 'enforcement action could be...', I don't know. I personally think it won't be needed - it shouldn't be needed. But you need to make it unchallengeable that you've indicated unambiguously this is a private road for you 4 folk only.

2) Write that note to your neighbour. Keep it matter of fact. Ideally get your LP to form the wording, but I guess it should just make clear - perhaps by including the relevant paragraph and plan in your deeds that indicate the four entitled properties - that the road is private, and for the use of the 4 stated properties only. Add that they are trespassing as they have no right to access this private land without permission, and that permission has been comprehensively refused to them; they should no longer come on to that road. Ask your fellow neighb's to sign it; emphasise to them the risk in allowing Z to have access to your private road. Emphasise the aggressiveness that Z has demonstrated when challenged over this. Emphasise the potential problems they could/ almost certainly will have when they come to sell up, should they not tackle this now. Make sure the letter's delivery is recorded in some way.

3) Put up CCTV to cover that area. Was it CCTV that took that shot? Even so, I'd be tempted to install a second camera, possibly a discrete one (I'd go discrete if possible, as the idea is to catch their behaviour as it crosses into 'criminal'), somewhere near your existing back fence so that it captures a second, closer, image and also sound - this could be very important. Keep the angle low enough to capture the road and neighbour's fence, but not go above it should it encroach on their land behind. Inform your 3 neighbs you have done this, but not the miscreant. You do not need signs, as this is your private land.

4) When you can, place some features along there to act as a physical barrier, something that they cannot cross without interfering with it or damaging it. This could be a few posts right in front of that far fence, ensuring it's clearly on your side, with one or two horizontal rails if needed. Or, just drop in place an instant feature like a couple of long troughs (raised, so that folk in cars can easily see them) with flowers and shrubs - beautify that far fence! Make the end of your land pikturskew. You could even plant shrubs, flowerbeds or bushes directly into the ground there.

It doesn't have to be a strong physical barrier, and I think there are good reasons for it not to be; a timber barrier would not only be a hassle to install, but also clearly be a forced reaction to their behaviour and an indication that you have few other options against them - why should you have to go to the expense and hassle for something that is so functional, and directly caused by this neighb? So I personally prefer the idea of just shrubs or similar for a number of reasons; it would look nicer. It would be more 'matter of fact' about the ownership of that road - 'I quite fancy planting some flowers on my land'. You could even claim it was deliberately chosen to be less 'antagonistic' ( ) to Z, as you are that thoughtful a person. And there's a good chance it could 'entice' them into causing damage to them, by stepping on them as they come out their van, driving over it or whatever, things they'd be less likely to do to timber posts - and that's why you have CCTV - to catch criminal behaviour like 'criminal property damage'. I certainly wouldn't give Z the luxury of a second fence as this could hide what he's doing behind it, and he could even remove his own fence and gain a few inches of your land - as he continues to build a driveway... It just needs to be something 'physical' that he cannot walk or drive over without causing damage to it - it should be there as a deterrent, because you are making it clear you don't trust this person and they need to be deterred by a physical line. Imagine - thwarted by a bunch of flowers :-)

5) Be matter-of-fact and calmly assertive when dealing with Z. You are in the right, they are in the wrong - simple. Don't avoid them, don't give them an easy life, don't let them think for a second you are backing off. If you see them, you should challenge them about the parked van every time, "When are you going to remove your trespassing van?" With all your comments to him, try and ASK rather than say. Ie, not things like "You need to move that van!" or "You are trespassing on our land!" - these sorts of things can be fobbed off dismissively by folk like this. Instead, Qs, Qs, Qs. Eg, "Whose road is this?". Wait for their answer. "Do you have any rights to be on here?" "Yes?! Explain how!" "What part of the deeds map that I gave you are you struggling to understand?" "You do know this is trespass, don't you?" Etc etc - don't get drawn into an argument or be deviated sideways from these very simple and pertinent points. REPEAT them if they don't answer! "Whose road is this? Sorry?! WHOSE road is this!" And you'll hopefully be recording everything they say.

6) Keep completely calm. As soon as they show any aggression, swear, make any threat towards your 'boundary feature', or make any statement suggesting they'll continue to park there and use your road, then - bingo! - they'll have very likely crossed the fine line from 'civil' to 'criminal' as it now becomes 'aggravated trespass', and you can now call the local police. If they actually trample on your plants, then it's 'trespass with criminal property damage'. You will hopefully have all this recorded - important. Consider having your phone recording too, during any approach. The police will not become involved in the background issue, but will/should tell the neighbour to 'behave', C&D, and that if they truly believe they have a right of access to this road, to sort it out legally like a good boy. You can show them the letter you've given the neighbour with the contents of your deeds, and they'll likely inform the neighb that 'it all looks pretty clear to us'. Show the police the recording, if it contains clear 'aggravated' behaviour. Any actual threats, insist the police give at least a verbal C&D. Any actual damage, and they'll be told to C&D, and you'd be able to make a claim for this if you felt it was worth it.

In essence, make it provably clear that this neighb has been informed of the true ownership of the drive, and who is, and specifically not, allowed to use it. And then put in place a system that they cannot physically breach without causing damage. As soon as they do, nobble them.

7) That looks like a work van? Is he self-employed or part of a local business? If the latter, then consider informing the company he works for, telling them he's parking their work vehicle on your and your neighb's private land, and is aggressive when challenged - "it all reflects very badly on their company to have such an inconsiderate & aggressive employee".

If the above doesn't work, then it's entrance barrier time 😕

Sea_Shell

Any progress/developments @Numpty22

Have you got your other neighbours on side? 

Numpty22

Sea_Shell said:

Any progress/developments @Numpty22

Have you got your other neighbours on side? 

Hi!

I have just returned from a week away and said van is still there, however there seems to have been no progress at all on either gate or drive. My neighbour next door said she spoke to him and asked if he was going ahead- response was very rude but along the lines of “we’re waiting on materials/ none of your business”. Optimistic that actually they have realised they can’t go ahead without issues, and that the leaving of the van is more to prove a point than anything. 

My next door but one neighbour is also currently converting their back garden/driveway into a garage which would make neighbour Z’s turning circle very tight indeed if they went ahead, so perhaps they have changed their mind.

Myself and neighbours have decided to install either a low fence or some flower beds as soon as we see any work progressing, as any communication becomes hostile so is a no go.

We did consider taking a legal route, however discovered that any official disputes have to be stated when selling a home in future and could affect said sale so we decided against this. 

Thanks for all your advice! I certainly shall not be backing down to bullies any time soon

MultiFuelBurner

You should still all club together and get some legal advice. You don't have to declare that but then you will know what the law says, your recourse as neighbours and the process involved and the cost.

Sometimes a strongly worded solicitors letter is all that is required rather than weeks and months of angst and curtain twitching.

jonnydeppiwish!

Numpty22 said:

Sea_Shell said:

Any progress/developments @Numpty22

Have you got your other neighbours on side? 

Hi!

I have just returned from a week away and said van is still there, however there seems to have been no progress at all on either gate or drive. My neighbour next door said she spoke to him and asked if he was going ahead- response was very rude but along the lines of “we’re waiting on materials/ none of your business”. Optimistic that actually they have realised they can’t go ahead without issues, and that the leaving of the van is more to prove a point than anything. 

My next door but one neighbour is also currently converting their back garden/driveway into a garage which would make neighbour Z’s turning circle very tight indeed if they went ahead, so perhaps they have changed their mind.

Myself and neighbours have decided to install either a low fence or some flower beds as soon as we see any work progressing, as any communication becomes hostile so is a no go.

We did consider taking a legal route, however discovered that any official disputes have to be stated when selling a home in future and could affect said sale so we decided against this. 

Thanks for all your advice! I certainly shall not be backing down to bullies any time soon

You already have a dispute that you have to declare, doesn’t matter if it’s legal or not.  Sort it out legally now and it will be a lite less hassle than later down the line.

kipsterno1

Is the van part of his company or a company vehicle supplied by his employer? If its the latter I would contact the company and inform them that it has been abandoned on private land for x number of days. Hopefully they will see sense and have some influence on getting it moved.

ThisIsWeird

Numpty22 said:

Sea_Shell said:

Any progress/developments @Numpty22

Have you got your other neighbours on side? 

Hi!

I have just returned from a week away and said van is still there, however there seems to have been no progress at all on either gate or drive. My neighbour next door said she spoke to him and asked if he was going ahead- response was very rude but along the lines of “we’re waiting on materials/ none of your business”. Optimistic that actually they have realised they can’t go ahead without issues, and that the leaving of the van is more to prove a point than anything. 

My next door but one neighbour is also currently converting their back garden/driveway into a garage which would make neighbour Z’s turning circle very tight indeed if they went ahead, so perhaps they have changed their mind.

Myself and neighbours have decided to install either a low fence or some flower beds as soon as we see any work progressing, as any communication becomes hostile so is a no go.

We did consider taking a legal route, however discovered that any official disputes have to be stated when selling a home in future and could affect said sale so we decided against this. 

Thanks for all your advice! I certainly shall not be backing down to bullies any time soon

So, you are not going to put up 'private road' signs? And you are not going to do anything about him parking his van on your private road, narrowing the available space to the 4 rightful owners? And you are going to give up challenging him because he's rude?

From what you describe, this entitled 'ole shouldn't even be coming ON to YOUR land. 'None of your business' ma botty.

Do you have Leg Prot on your house insurance?

I have suggested what you should do. In essence, you lay the groundwork for them to trip up and land in a very deep hole (that is all metaphor, by the way) and give this chancer enough rope to tie themselves up in a legal, criminal knot. Then you can call the police, and jobbie should be done. (Untie them first, of course - that wasn't a meta)

1) Make it 100% unambiguous and unquestionable that this road belongs to you 4 residents only and that the miscreant knows this - put up the signs, and record you telling him.

2) Make it ditto that you have repeatedly asked the miscreant to depart, to stop trespassing, and to stop restricting the driveway. Stick to a mantra or two, such as, "I have asked you repeatedly to stop trespassing on our land and to leave - when are you going to do so?" "Why are you refusing to leave?" (Note, try and end them with simple Qs, and wait for them to answer. Repeat ad nauseam.) The latter Q should elicit an interesting and possibly useful response - what can the guy say?! Claim he has the 'right'? If so, you hand over a copy of that section of the deeds, and you repeat the Q. And again.

3) Record all your interactions, and challenge them on their trespass every time you see them. Even leave a note on their windscreen - and record the almost-certain subsequent littering of your property :-) .

They will almost certainly soon cross the delicate line from 'trespass' (a 'civil' matter, and an absolute pain to handle) into 'aggravated' trespass, and that would be a criminal offence. NB: they have almost certainly already done this by swearing, by telling the rightful owners it's 'none of their business', and by intimating they are going to continue with their trespassing and restricting the driveway (I'm not legally qualified, but it seems pretty certain). But you currently don't have any evidence of this, so will struggle to engage the police. Until you have this evidence, the police will most likely try to dismiss it as a civil matter - so don't bother.

ThisIsWeird

Aggravated Trespass

Aggravated trespass is a criminal offence, so you can be arrested for it.

You must be doing two things to commit aggravated trespass:

1. Trespassing
2. Intentionally obstructing, disrupting, or intimidating others from carrying out ‘lawful activities’.

Further to this, a senior police officer has the power to order any person believed to be involved in aggravated trespass to leave the land; if they refuse to leave after being ordered to by police officer, or if they return to the land in question within a period of three months, this is an additional offence.

Maximum penalty is 3 months imprisonment, or a fine of £2500, or both. First time offenders would likely get a fine of between £200 – £300.

Residing on land without consent in or with a vehicle

The PCSC Act 2022 introduced this as a new offence.

This means that it will now be a criminal offence (rather than a civil matter) for a person aged 18 or over to reside on land without the consent of the owner if they have, or intend to have, a vehicle with them, and refuse to leave and remove their property when asked. They also need to be causing, or deemed likely to cause, significant damage (including excessive noise, smells, litter or other damage to the environment), disruption (including interference with a ‘supply of water, energy or fuel’) or distress (including using words or displaying any writing that is ‘threatening, abusive or insulting’). If police believe this is happening, they may seize any ‘relevant’ property belonging to, or in the possession or control of the alleged defendant, including vehicles or any property on the land, which they may keep for up to 3 months or until the end of any criminal proceedings that result from the matter.

You cannot return to the same land for 12 months after being asked to leave.

MultiFuelBurner

I like the idea of a private road wheel clamp sign and release fee🤣🤣

Section62

ThisIsWeird said:

Residing on land without consent in or with a vehicle

The PCSC Act 2022 introduced this as a new offence.

This means that it will now be a criminal offence (rather than a civil matter) for a person aged 18 or over to reside on land without the consent of the owner if they have, or intend to have, a vehicle with them, and refuse to leave and remove their property when asked. They also need to be causing, or deemed likely to cause, significant damage (including excessive noise, smells, litter or other damage to the environment), disruption (including interference with a ‘supply of water, energy or fuel’) or distress (including using words or displaying any writing that is ‘threatening, abusive or insulting’). If police believe this is happening, they may seize any ‘relevant’ property belonging to, or in the possession or control of the alleged defendant, including vehicles or any property on the land, which they may keep for up to 3 months or until the end of any criminal proceedings that result from the matter.

You cannot return to the same land for 12 months after being asked to leave.

^The key thing here is residing in or with the vehicle on land that doesn't belong to you... it doesn't apply where the vehicle is just parked on someone else's land and you are residing elsewhere.

....unless the neighbour is living in the van where it is parked, and is 18 or over.