PV Quote 12.3KW

Screwdriva

That simply can't be accurate. I've been involved with dozens of installations with optimizers and none have experienced failure (yet). Mine have been on the roof for 3.5 years now without issue.  Not saying it can't happen but it's nowhere near what's been claimed. 

Martyn1981

I've got 26 and one of them (from the 2012 install) has failed. Replaced under warranty, firm was able to access via our Velux window with safety harness.

primmer10590

ispookie666 said:

@primmer10590
I'm firmly in the Solar + Battery group 

Do you know approximately how much kWh you use from 4pm to 12am? 

We use around 7000kWh/year and from Nov to march, we were using the battery a lot more than I had factored in. I'm glad I went with 16.2kWh. 

I'm on E7 and had to do some Charging from the grid till early April.  

There is a recent thread about optimisers and microinverters on here. If you have a South facing roof with minimal shading, any of the above are just fancy, unless you are a data geek. 

I don't have the data for exact time as this is a full house refurb. But the system will be powering ASHP, DHW+Cylinder, UFH, AirCon and EV Car. So it's got a lot to cater for...

Jonboy1889

Screwdriva said:

That simply can't be accurate. I've been involved with dozens of installations with optimizers and none have experienced failure (yet). Mine have been on the roof for 3.5 years now without issue.  Not saying it can't happen but it's nowhere near what's been claimed. 

Ah apologies that was for the inverters, not the optimisers which have a 2.2% failure rate over 7 years- which is not bad. But I guess if you have 10 (or 30) of one thing one of them is more likely to go wrong than just one- altho I may be talking nonsense statistically 😂 I guess solar panels are very simple devices (hence the 25-40 year warranty), but optimisers and inverters are more complex hence more likely to have issues at some point.

ispookie666

@primmer10590
If you use more than 9KWh from 4 pm to 12 am, a bigger battery will help.  I charge the batteries from E7 during the months when the sun is low.  You might want to check the rate the batteries can charge if thinking about having more than one.  

Screwdriva

Jonboy1889 said:

I guess solar panels are very simple devices (hence the 25-40 year warranty), but optimisers and inverters are more complex hence more likely to have issues at some point.

Spot on! This is exactly why it's really important to have a long warranty (I recommend 20 years at a minimum, which SolarEdge offers) and a brand which actually honours their warranty claims. 

primmer10590 said:

I don't have the data for exact time as this is a full house refurb. But the system will be powering ASHP, DHW+Cylinder, UFH, AirCon and EV Car. So it's got a lot to cater for...

Yes, your usage profit definitely requires a large battery. 

Jonboy1889

Screwdriva said:

Jonboy1889 said:

I guess solar panels are very simple devices (hence the 25-40 year warranty), but optimisers and inverters are more complex hence more likely to have issues at some point.

Spot on! This is exactly why it's really important to have a long warranty (I recommend 20 years at a minimum, which SolarEdge offers) and a brand which actually honours their warranty claims. 

primmer10590 said:

I don't have the data for exact time as this is a full house refurb. But the system will be powering ASHP, DHW+Cylinder, UFH, AirCon and EV Car. So it's got a lot to cater for...

Yes, your usage profit definitely requires a large battery. 

I do agree they have very good warranties, so obviously believe in their product- but what their warranty doesn’t cover is the cost to actually get to the optimiser (scaffolding) which is what you just need to consider when costing it up. As has been discussed on this and the other thread, even with shading optimisers only add c2% additional output vs standard string/panel set, so must be taken into account. But I love the panel level monitoring, think that is very cool!

I know people rubbish the Chinese brands but a lot of SE is manufactured in China - along with most things these days 😂 (iPhones, TVs etc).

Thankfully solar panels are so remarkably simple that it’s very unlikely any brand you buy will have issues- hence the 25 year warranty most offer

Martyn1981

Jonboy1889 said:

Screwdriva said:

Jonboy1889 said:

I guess solar panels are very simple devices (hence the 25-40 year warranty), but optimisers and inverters are more complex hence more likely to have issues at some point.

Spot on! This is exactly why it's really important to have a long warranty (I recommend 20 years at a minimum, which SolarEdge offers) and a brand which actually honours their warranty claims. 

primmer10590 said:

I don't have the data for exact time as this is a full house refurb. But the system will be powering ASHP, DHW+Cylinder, UFH, AirCon and EV Car. So it's got a lot to cater for...

Yes, your usage profit definitely requires a large battery. 

I do agree they have very good warranties, so obviously believe in their product- but what their warranty doesn’t cover is the cost to actually get to the optimiser (scaffolding) which is what you just need to consider when costing it up. As has been discussed on this and the other thread, even with shading optimisers only add c2% additional output vs standard string/panel set, so must be taken into account. But I love the panel level monitoring, think that is very cool!

I know people rubbish the Chinese brands but a lot of SE is manufactured in China - along with most things these days 😂 (iPhones, TVs etc).

Thankfully solar panels are so remarkably simple that it’s very unlikely any brand you buy will have issues- hence the 25 year warranty most offer

Yep, famous last words, but panels do seem to be almost fit and forget.* And its been really nice to read how well the bypass diodes are operating. As I have a lot of shading issues, and less than ideal orientations, I've always been a big fan of Solaredge. It really does do what it promises, but there is a cost penalty, and as you say, more points of failure.

My biggest surprise though, is the apparent lack of degradation. Our 2011 and 2012 installs are not (yet) showing any noticeable level of drop off yet. Obviously I can't be certain about degradation, as weather each year will give ups and downs, but my gut feeling is that there is no noticeable downward trend, so losses must be, say 2% or less, to not ne noticeable.

*One small issue, and one reported in articles about cleaning panels, is that shallow pitch panels can be more prone to moss growth along their bottom edge, as dirt gets held by the frame lip. Our 30d pitch panels seem OK, but the 5 20d pitch panels do like to grow moss which needs removing every few years, but these panels are easily accessible, some on a low roof, and two acting as a back door canopy.

May be wrong, but newer panels may have a smaller frame lip?

JKenH

Jonboy1889 said:

Screwdriva said:

Jonboy1889 said:

I guess solar panels are very simple devices (hence the 25-40 year warranty), but optimisers and inverters are more complex hence more likely to have issues at some point.

Spot on! This is exactly why it's really important to have a long warranty (I recommend 20 years at a minimum, which SolarEdge offers) and a brand which actually honours their warranty claims. 

primmer10590 said:

I don't have the data for exact time as this is a full house refurb. But the system will be powering ASHP, DHW+Cylinder, UFH, AirCon and EV Car. So it's got a lot to cater for...

Yes, your usage profit definitely requires a large battery. 

I do agree they have very good warranties, so obviously believe in their product- but what their warranty doesn’t cover is the cost to actually get to the optimiser (scaffolding) which is what you just need to consider when costing it up. As has been discussed on this and the other thread, even with shading optimisers only add c2% additional output vs standard string/panel set, so must be taken into account. But I love the panel level monitoring, think that is very cool!

I know people rubbish the Chinese brands but a lot of SE is manufactured in China - along with most things these days 😂 (iPhones, TVs etc).

Thankfully solar panels are so remarkably simple that it’s very unlikely any brand you buy will have issues- hence the 25 year warranty most offer

That would be nice but at least 2 of us on here have posted about issues with reduced output of solar panels. I now wish I had Solar Edge monitoring as I would at least be able to see which of my panels are underperforming. One string of 6 panels on my East roof is producing 25% less than the identical other string and on my West roof the difference between identical strings, each of 7 panels, is around 12- 15%. This has not been a sudden failure but a gradual deterioration. (I have swapped the strings round on the inverters and it is definitely the panels). 

I have given up pursuing the manufacturers for a warranty claim as the cost of scaffolding and an engineers time will far outweigh the value of the panel covered under warranty. My manufacturer was Italian, so perhaps easier to deal with than a Chinese one, but even so I was expected to supply a lot of information that could only be provided by erecting a scaffold for an engineer to access the panels on both roofs. I have already provided open circuit voltage figures for the strings but the manufacturer wants individual readings for the panels (only accessible by lifting up the panels to get access to the connectors) together with serial numbers. The manufacturer then wants the opportunity to speak to the engineer on the roof to answer any supplementary queries. I can understand why they would want this information but then when the engineer confirms to their satisfaction it is a warranty problem, what happens? Do they magically produce a replacement panel for him to replace while up there or does he have to come back a few weeks later? It is cheaper simply for me to get on and replace the panel(s).

I suspect panel manufacturers can supply a 25 year warranty because they know the cost of scaffold and labour will put off all but the most bloody minded of claimants.

Screwdriva

JKenH said:

I suspect panel manufacturers can supply a 25 year warranty because they know the cost of scaffold and labour will put off all but the most bloody minded of claimants.

We had a SolarEdge inverter fail on a family member's home in Bromley, 24 hours after commissioning. At the time, SolarEdge had a national order backlog of 600+ inverters. Only when our installer visited the site, checked each panel and optimizer over video call (to their credit), did SolarEdge agree to a warranty replacement, which was installed 4 weeks later.

SolarEdge paid the installer a reduced fee for their visit. We paid nothing. Had SolarEdge refused this service, I would have used our home insurance policy's legal cover to pursue a resolution. Fortunately, going with the brand has provided a degree of peace of mind, which I rate as high as our panel level monitoring.