Is a mandatory consideration worth it?

marie91L

Today I found out I have been awarded enhanced rate mobility PIP but nothing for care. I find this strange as I was expecting nothing for mobility and something for care. I’m grateful to have something but it indicates that the assessor didn’t really understand my condition and how it affects me. I have seizures and it’s the care I need more help with. Is it worth going for a MR or should I just be pleased with what I have? 

Muttleythefrog

This is a little surprising in disparity between expectation and result. Generally speaking asking for a reconsideration usually results in no changed decision but they can and do amend decisions at this stage - there is some risk of lowering the award but low. If you were not satisfied with reconsideration outcome then you could proceed to independent appeal tribunal where success rates are very good.

However I think before taking the decision maybe a bit of analysis. If you haven't already got it I would suggest you get sent a copy of the assessor's report - it is though quite likely the decision of the DWP Decision Maker replicates that report. I would go through the activities and what descriptors you feel are applicable to you and what was actually awarded and then perhaps ask for further advice..... there's just not enough information here in order to give other than generic advice. It is unusual I would say for people to be awarded an enhanced rate of a component when they felt they should not get any award so I would be reluctant to just say go for it when there is such apparent disparity including favourable to you between expectation and actual outcome.

But realistically nobody can answer your last question without significant more information including what rate of care you expected to get and how many points you scored plus some handle on the risks of the mobility component award being undermined. You might want to consult CAB or the like. My instinct is that pursuing this likely will be the right course of action if seizures manifest in the risks associated with not being able to safely and reliably complete several of the daily living tasks. Sadly many assessors do indeed misunderstand the conditions claimants are troubled by and Decision Makers keen to simply rubber stamp the ignorance.

Alice_Holt

marie91L said:

Today I found out I have been awarded enhanced rate mobility PIP but nothing for care. I find this strange as I was expecting nothing for mobility and something for care. I’m grateful to have something but it indicates that the assessor didn’t really understand my condition and how it affects me. I have seizures and it’s the care I need more help with. Is it worth going for a MR or should I just be pleased with what I have? 

        It is odd that no Daily Living (DL) component was awarded, if:
           you have regular seizures, 
           these are without warning, and you cannot get yourself to a safe place,
           the risk to you when doing DL tasks such as washing and cooking are real and considerable.

    If you require oversight when doing these activities due to the risk of harm, then do consider a MR.

    I would suggest getting some guidance from your local advice charity first, as the whole of the award will be looked at again. So it could increase, decrease, or remain the same (most likely outcome) at the MR stage.

https://cpag.org.uk/welfare-rights/resources/article/‘safely’-personal-independence-payment

Qew

marie91L said:

Today I found out I have been awarded enhanced rate mobility PIP but nothing for care. I find this strange as I was expecting nothing for mobility and something for care. I’m grateful to have something but it indicates that the assessor didn’t really understand my condition and how it affects me. I have seizures and it’s the care I need more help with. Is it worth going for a MR or should I just be pleased with what I have? 

My wife suffers from epilepsy. She's had three ESA awards over the years and one PIP. Each time she's had to submit a mandatory reconsideration because she was initially put on ESA WRAG and PIP Enhanced Mobility only. On each MR, she's succeeded in getting the award changed to what it should have been: ESA Support Group, and PIP Standard Daily Care and Enhanced Mobility.

It helps in getting your neurology consultant/nurse or doctor to write a letter explaining why the award is lacking and that you need additional help. Any carer you have should also write in explaining why you need constant care. Be thorough when going over what was missed in the assessment. Get the assessor's report and check where they've not awarded points and respond to those. Things like cooking, eating and drinking, bathing, toilet needs, are things that helped my wife get the points to get standard care.

Epilepsy has been really overlooked by the introduction of PIP. Where you got consideration for care on DLA, PIP makes that much more harder to attain.

Good luck.

peteuk

Epilepsy falls under the safety umbrella, so as above if you are either well controlled with medication eg was having seizures but now not because of medication, or you get sufficient warning of a seizure that you can make yourself or get someone to help you me safe then you will score 0.

PIP isn’t about the disease or disability it’s about the effect it has on your life. Do you drive? Might be a dumb question but if youve had your license returned to you then you’re safe to drive, so you’re safe to cook, eat, bath etc.

Certain activities will score 0 if you’re not reporting a mental health issue. Which will further reduce your ability to score. So instead of 10 activities your now down to 7.  So when you read your report if might find that you score in some activities but now enough to to awarded PIP.

Look at each activity descriptor and then the points descriptors and realistically work out what you think you’ll score and compare it to the report.

marie91L

Thanks everyone. No I don’t drive and my seizures aren’t controlled by medication. It’s very strange but I don’t think I’ll go for a MR if there’s a risk they’ll take it all, I know I’m lucky to have anything. I just don’t understand as all of my consultant letters etc were about me needing care and monitoring. I was given 12 points on mobility for “not being able to undertake a journey without another person” how that could be true at the same as me not needing any care at all?! Anyway, thanks again for the help and advice. 

Muttleythefrog

marie91L said:

Thanks everyone. No I don’t drive and my seizures aren’t controlled by medication. It’s very strange but I don’t think I’ll go for a MR if there’s a risk they’ll take it all, I know I’m lucky to have anything. I just don’t understand as all of my consultant letters etc were about me needing care and monitoring. I was given 12 points on mobility for “not being able to undertake a journey without another person” how that could be true at the same as me not needing any care at all?! Anyway, thanks again for the help and advice. 

Do please think about it. The caveat of risk is usually low... and typically at MR the decision is unchanged. An appeal tribunal thereafter is likely to be more thorough and professional in intent.

One reason, not mentioned above, that also challenging an incorrect decision (and it is reasonable to think you could score points on DL tasks - but you are best placed to know) has merit is that in effect you're going to have to challenge it anyway when it comes to your next review by once again stating your problems in relation to the activities some of which I imagine will differ from the existing decision and assessment report. Typically they look at your award in the year before the current one runs out. 

But ultimately the decision is yours and you have the paperwork (hopefully you get hold of the assessment report even if just for future reference) and knowledge we do not.

poppy12345

The most likely outcome of the MR will be the decision doesn't change. Only about 23% of them change in the claimant favour. It's entirely your decision to make but you should give it some more thought. They tell you that you have 1 month to request the MR but with good reason you have 13 months. You will need to give a reason if you're late requesting it and if they refuse you just proceed to Tribunal.

Alice_Holt

marie91L said:

Thanks everyone. No I don’t drive and my seizures aren’t controlled by medication. It’s very strange but I don’t think I’ll go for a MR if there’s a risk they’ll take it all, I know I’m lucky to have anything. I just don’t understand as all of my consultant letters etc were about me needing care and monitoring. I was given 12 points on mobility for “not being able to undertake a journey without another person” how that could be true at the same as me not needing any care at all?! Anyway, thanks again for the help and advice. 

      

 At least get advice from your local advice charity before dismissing the idea of an appeal.

 If your seizures are without warning and you cannot get yourself to a place of safety, then the decision is inconsistent. 

Is this the case are your seizures are without warning and you cannot get yourself to a place of safety?

The very real risk of harm when bathing, cooking should have been taken into account, which would give rise to a DL award.

Did you score any DL points?

 

Have a look at the CPAG link I posted earlier.

Note that over 70% of PIP appeals to the Tribunal Service are successfully - which indicates how flawed some PIP decisions are.

As Mutley says, your first PIP decision sets the scene for subsequent awards.
If you settle for a flawed decision now, them it is likely that this will be repeated at the next review.
If you successfully appeal, then assuming your condition remains the same, it becomes very difficult for a subsequent assessment / tribunal to remove that award from you.

marie91L

Alice_Holt said:

marie91L said:

Thanks everyone. No I don’t drive and my seizures aren’t controlled by medication. It’s very strange but I don’t think I’ll go for a MR if there’s a risk they’ll take it all, I know I’m lucky to have anything. I just don’t understand as all of my consultant letters etc were about me needing care and monitoring. I was given 12 points on mobility for “not being able to undertake a journey without another person” how that could be true at the same as me not needing any care at all?! Anyway, thanks again for the help and advice. 

      

 At least get advice from your local advice charity before dismissing the idea of an appeal.

 If your seizures are without warning and you cannot get yourself to a place of safety, then the decision is inconsistent. 

Is this the case are your seizures are without warning and you cannot get yourself to a place of safety?

The very real risk of harm when bathing, cooking should have been taken into account, which would give rise to a DL award.

Did you score any DL points?

 

Have a look at the CPAG link I posted earlier.

Note that over 70% of PIP appeals to the Tribunal Service are successfully - which indicates how flawed some PIP decisions are.

As Mutley says, your first PIP decision sets the scene for subsequent awards.
If you settle for a flawed decision now, them it is likely that this will be repeated at the next review.
If you successfully appeal, then assuming your condition remains the same, it becomes very difficult for a subsequent assessment / tribunal to remove that award from you.

I got 2 points for preparing food and 2 for washing and bathing so a total of 4. My seizures are without warning and the reason I applied for PIP in the first place was because I had a seizure which resulted in a broken ankle.

On Friday I called and asked for a copy of my assessors report so I’ll wait and see what that says but I don’t hold out much hope. I’ll read it over and certainly take on board what everyone has said above in terms of setting the bar going forward. 

Qew

marie91L said:

Thanks everyone. No I don’t drive and my seizures aren’t controlled by medication. It’s very strange but I don’t think I’ll go for a MR if there’s a risk they’ll take it all, I know I’m lucky to have anything. I just don’t understand as all of my consultant letters etc were about me needing care and monitoring. I was given 12 points on mobility for “not being able to undertake a journey without another person” how that could be true at the same as me not needing any care at all?! Anyway, thanks again for the help and advice. 

Although there is a risk that the MR could be detrimental to you, it's quite unlikely. From my previous looks online about PIP and epilepsy while helping my wife fill in her PIP MR, it seems quite common for enhance mobility to be given for the condition irrespective to whether the daily care has been awarded or not. The difficulty for many is proving the need for care while doing tasks at home, etc.

My point is that it's worth challenging, not just for the very good reasons in the responses above, but also because I really think you have very little to lose by doing so, considering how common it is for the mobility component to be awarded for those with regular and uncontrolled seizures.

Naturally, it's easy for me to say that as it's you that's going to be affected either way, but seeing that your seizures are uncontrolled despite medication and come without warning (much like my wife, whose MR was successful for getting the PIP care component, and has had successful MRs for ESA Support Group), then the mobility component is very likely to still be awarded.

In the end, it's your decision, but I would urge you to really think about this a bit more. Do some online research. Check on the epilepsy help sites out there if you haven't already.