letter from co-op bank about failed payment

OceanSound

Every month i transfer £801 to my co-op bank everyday current account as one of the conditions is that I pay in a minimum of £800 to qualify for everyday rewards offer.

On 17 April I had made the customary payment of £801 from my halifax current account to co-op everyday current account. The balance after the transfer was received was £989.29 (I know this as I checked the co-op banking app today and tapped on the transaction).

The next day (18th April 2023) I had transferred £788.29 from co-op everyday current account to Halifax bank current account (I checked Halifax bank app and it shows on there with date 18 April 2023). Usually, I transfer the money in and immediately transfer it out. However, on this occasion, i seem to recall the transfer from Halifax took its time to arrive and it seems I had not checked back until the next day.

Anyway, I received a letter from co-op bank a few days later with the following title 'There wasn't enough money in your current account to make all your recent payments'. Then it has Item name as 'FUND TRANSFER', a reference '000000 INTERN 9271', then the amount '£788.29'.

I checked the reference of the actual transfer showing on my app, and that reference has 'TFR [sortcode of destination account][account number of destination account]. Suffice to say, the last four digits of the reference on the letter does not match the TFR reference shown on the app.

I wonder what happened here? Could I have attempted to do the transfer before the money had arrived at co-op bank and that's what caused the 'failed payment' which caused the letter to be sent out? I'm pretty sure I wouldn't have done this, as I always make it a point to check if there is enough funds before initiating any transfer out/payment.

I could test the above theory I suppose by attempting another payment for say over and above my current balance? if the theory holds I should receive another letter in a few days.

Any ideas on what may have happened?

p.s. I've just logged in to co-op bank online banking. There are two messages on there about a transaction for £788.29. One message has date/time stamp 17/04/2023 18:01 and the other has 17/04/2023 18:06

Both messages start with 'Hello MR OceanSound,

You've asked us to send £788.29 to [Ocean Sound] on 18/04/23....'

BTW, can we set the correspondence preferences on co-op accounts to online or is there no option with this? Paperless available for statements only?

Bigwheels1111

Call the bank and ask what’s going on.
You have all your evidence to hand.

OceanSound

Bigwheels1111 said:

Call the bank and ask what’s going on.
You have all your evidence to hand.

Yes, I've messaged co-op bank support via online banking this morning. 

BTW, just checked Halifax bank app (and online banking) about transaction for £801 to co-op current account on 17 April. That transaction has time of transaction as: 17:46, with transaction type 'Faster Payments Outgoing (FPO)'.

From this, I have an inkling of what may have happened. 

It goes like this...I make the payment at 17:46. Check the co-op bank app immediately afterwards. Payment hasn't arrived. So I keep checking, and at 18:01 I see the transaction on the co-op bank app. However, as with some banking apps (or online banking for that matter), the available balance is not updated until we close the app and re-open it (or in the case of online banking, until we logout and log back in). As I can see the payment has arrived I attempt the transfer to my Halifax bank current account for £788.29. However, since the available balance is not updated, I receive an insufficient funds error. This generates the letter. 

I then close the app, open it again and attempt the payment again at 18:06. This time the payment is successful (as the available balance has updated by now). 

Seems plausible?

Bridlington1

OceanSound said:

Bigwheels1111 said:

Call the bank and ask what’s going on.
You have all your evidence to hand.

Yes, I've messaged co-op bank support via online banking this morning. 

BTW, just checked Halifax bank app (and online banking) about transaction for £801 to co-op current account on 17 April. That transaction has time of transaction as: 17:46, with transaction type 'Faster Payments Outgoing (FPO)'.

From this, I have an inkling of what may have happened. 

It goes like this...I make the payment at 17:46. Check the co-op bank app immediately afterwards. Payment hasn't arrived. So I keep checking, and at 18:01 I see the transaction on the co-op bank app. However, as with some banking apps (or online banking for that matter), the available balance is not updated until we close the app and re-open it (or in the case of online banking, until we logout and log back in). As I can see the payment has arrived I attempt the transfer to my Halifax bank current account for £788.29. However, since the available balance is not updated, I receive an insufficient funds error. This generates the letter. 

I then close the app, open it again and attempt the payment again at 18:06. This time the payment is successful (as the available balance has updated by now). 

Seems plausible?

That seems plausible to me. I've found with Lloyds if you receive a payment whilst logged into online banking or the app the transactions list updates but not the available balance. I've found that if you have another account with them with 1p in it and transfer the penny to one of your other accounts the available balance corrects itself and you can make payments ok (saves logging out and then back in again), so I wonder if the same could apply to Co-op?

OceanSound

Bridlington1 said:

OceanSound said:

Bigwheels1111 said:

Call the bank and ask what’s going on.
You have all your evidence to hand.

Yes, I've messaged co-op bank support via online banking this morning. 

BTW, just checked Halifax bank app (and online banking) about transaction for £801 to co-op current account on 17 April. That transaction has time of transaction as: 17:46, with transaction type 'Faster Payments Outgoing (FPO)'.

From this, I have an inkling of what may have happened. 

It goes like this...I make the payment at 17:46. Check the co-op bank app immediately afterwards. Payment hasn't arrived. So I keep checking, and at 18:01 I see the transaction on the co-op bank app. However, as with some banking apps (or online banking for that matter), the available balance is not updated until we close the app and re-open it (or in the case of online banking, until we logout and log back in). As I can see the payment has arrived I attempt the transfer to my Halifax bank current account for £788.29. However, since the available balance is not updated, I receive an insufficient funds error. This generates the letter. 

I then close the app, open it again and attempt the payment again at 18:06. This time the payment is successful (as the available balance has updated by now). 

Seems plausible?

That seems plausible to me. I've found with Lloyds if you receive a payment whilst logged into online banking or the app the transactions list updates but not the available balance. I've found that if you have another account with them with 1p in it and transfer the penny to one of your other accounts the available balance corrects itself and you can make payments ok (saves logging out and then back in again), so I wonder if the same could apply to Co-op?

I tested the transfer 1p method within Halifax bank app and it works. Transferring 1p internally from savings account to the current account updates the available balance, so no need to close app and open again before doing external payment. Halifax and Lloyds are sister banks (or at least cousins) so may have same or similar systems. That's probably how come if it works on Lloyds it will work on Halifax.

I only have a current account with co-op, so yet to try the same method. Just now opened a co-op bank online saver account for the sole purpose of trying it out. received an email saying it can take up to 5 working days to hear about outcome. 

edit: email received from co-op bank saying savings account has been opened successfully and that I should receive further details in the post. 

At the conclusion of the online application the last message appearing was that if the application is successful the account will take a few days to show up on my online accounts. As such, it's not showing up as yet. Will check tomorrow.