7.0% actually 3.69%?

AmityNeon

How interest is calculated daily is not effectively communicated, let alone fully understood by account holders. Some product T&Cs may provide precise examples to illustrate, but the average person will likely either not read them, not understand them, or forget about them.

The ITV game show, The 1% Club (assuming it's representative of the general UK populace), demonstrates how even the simplest of questions based purely on logic (no lateral thinking required) will trip some people up. E.g. If a value is reduced by 20%, by what percentage must the reduced value be increased to match the original value? Some say 20%, and some just give up on answering.

eskbanker

AmityNeon said:

If a value is reduced by 20%, by what percentage must the reduced value be increased to match the original value? Some say 20%, and some just give up on answering.

See also many threads on the pensions board about how tax relief works!

Malthusian

flaneurs_lobster said:

It's quite telling that in a group of casual acquaintances it seems acceptable to admit being "no good a maths" while a similar admittance of poor reading skills would be shameful. 

I don't think that's totally true. In the majority of social groups there is no longer a stigma about saying "I have dyslexia". In most blue collar settings you would be considered eccentric at best if you started reading a book. 
Reading does however seem to be viewed with less suspicion than maths. Possibly because you can have reading material targeted at people with poor reading skills (gossip magazines, political pamphlets, misery lit) but not calculators that tell you that 2 + 2 = 5.

RG2015 said:

Curiously her response was almost apologetic when she said, "Sorry, but I have checked twice and you have the correct change".

Makes you proud to be British.
There is a social taboo about telling someone they are wrong when they are wrong, especially if they are in a position of superiority (as a customer generally is to a shopgirl or even a shopkeeper).
This may have something to do with why people who are good at maths are viewed with suspicion. "Eppur è un twenty."

RG2015

Despite incredulity at the length of this thread, I am unashamedly adding to it. I believe that it is of genuine interest and doubt the deviation from topic would be frowned upon.

Is the 7% headline rate intended to deceive? I doubt it as it is quite clearly highlighted in the summary boxes. Indeed if it was marketed as a 3.69% rate of interest that would be a complete nonsense, as nobody at all would understand.

However my concern is the ease with which some people could (and indeed do) intentionally manipulate the truth. Even worse is that so many people are willing to believe the most outrageous claims if cleverly presented.

The lack of number acuity is clearly evidence of a poor education system. However the lack of any desire or ability to enquire, research and question is the saddest indictment of all.

Band7

phillw said:

 Savings accounts should be taught in school.

That's a good idea. All we need now are the teachers who can teach it.

RG2015

Malthusian said:

flaneurs_lobster said:

It's quite telling that in a group of casual acquaintances it seems acceptable to admit being "no good a maths" while a similar admittance of poor reading skills would be shameful. 

I don't think that's totally true. In the majority of social groups there is no longer a stigma about saying "I have dyslexia". In most blue collar settings you would be considered eccentric at best if you started reading a book. 
Reading does however seem to be viewed with less suspicion than maths. Possibly because you can have reading material targeted at people with poor reading skills (gossip magazines, political pamphlets, misery lit) but not calculators that tell you that 2 + 2 = 5.

RG2015 said:

Curiously her response was almost apologetic when she said, "Sorry, but I have checked twice and you have the correct change".

Makes you proud to be British.
There is a social taboo about telling someone they are wrong when they are wrong, especially if they are in a position of superiority (as a customer generally is to a shopgirl or even a shopkeeper).
This may have something to do with why people who are good at maths are viewed with suspicion. "Eppur è un twenty."

I wonder if there is a subtle difference between the underlying reasons for dyslexia and dyscalculia. Arithmetic is relatively simple but when it morphs into (more advanced) maths I can see how people might zone out. You can be fine with percentages without having the complications of algebra, geometry and flipping Pythagoras!

Hell, I have an A Level in maths but often scream at the complexities within basic O Level maths. Maybe we should stick with the basic of the three Rs before loading on extras.

Millyonare

The UK should really make all pupils 14-16yo do a GCSE in Arithmetic -- and not leave school until they achieve grade 4 / C or better.

For the vast majority of employees and employers, simple arithmetic is all the maths they will mostly ever need to use in work or home or for personal finances.

Mandatory GCSE Arithmetic would noticeably improve UK productivity.

Beddie

Millyonare said:

The UK should really make all pupils 14-16yo do a GCSE in Arithmetic -- and not leave school until they achieve grade 4 / C or better.

For the vast majority of employees and employers, simple arithmetic is all the maths they will mostly ever need to use in work or home or for personal finances.

Mandatory GCSE Arithmetic would noticeably improve UK productivity.

I get your point, but not everyone is capable of being good at arithmetic. In the same way I cannot draw or paint, others cannot work with numbers. And just forcing them will put them off for life. There should be plenty of encouraging, yes, and also schools should do realistic scenarios e.g. wages, tax, renting, buying a house etc. instead of the "dry" maths mostly taught. Have it as a project, not just a lesson.

zagfles

Malthusian said:

flaneurs_lobster said:

It's quite telling that in a group of casual acquaintances it seems acceptable to admit being "no good a maths" while a similar admittance of poor reading skills would be shameful. 

I don't think that's totally true. In the majority of social groups there is no longer a stigma about saying "I have dyslexia". In most blue collar settings you would be considered eccentric at best if you started reading a book. 
Reading does however seem to be viewed with less suspicion than maths. Possibly because you can have reading material targeted at people with poor reading skills (gossip magazines, political pamphlets, misery lit) but not calculators that tell you that 2 + 2 = 5.

But you do get calculators telling you 1 + 2 x 3 = 9 when the correct answer is 7. Try the Windows calculator in standard mode, then try it in scientific mode.

Makes you proud to be British.
There is a social taboo about telling someone they are wrong when they are wrong, especially if they are in a position of superiority (as a customer generally is to a shopgirl or even a shopkeeper).
This may have something to do with why people who are good at maths are viewed with suspicion. "Eppur è un twenty."

Or inferiority. As I found when a supposed financial expert was giving a large group of us a talk on how tax and national insurance work and I corrected him...

zagfles

Beddie said:

Millyonare said:

The UK should really make all pupils 14-16yo do a GCSE in Arithmetic -- and not leave school until they achieve grade 4 / C or better.

For the vast majority of employees and employers, simple arithmetic is all the maths they will mostly ever need to use in work or home or for personal finances.

Mandatory GCSE Arithmetic would noticeably improve UK productivity.

I get your point, but not everyone is capable of being good at arithmetic. In the same way I cannot draw or paint, others cannot work with numbers. And just forcing them will put them off for life. There should be plenty of encouraging, yes, and also schools should do realistic scenarios e.g. wages, tax, renting, buying a house etc. instead of the "dry" maths mostly taught. Have it as a project, not just a lesson.

Yes, stuff like algebra is a good example. It can be used for all sorts of useful things, I've just used it to work out how much I should be spending on my Barclaycard to get best value from the balance transfer I've just done. But most people just learn it at school then forget about it because they don't see the practical use for it, because it was never taught in the context of real life scenarios.