What gearbox does a Renault Clio have ?

MouldyOldDough

I am considering obtaining a Clio 1.6E-Tech full hybrid from MOTABILITY

But is the auto gearbox a torque converter ?

facade

Hard to find out, but from what I can glean together from press releases, Renault propaganda and reviews, no.

Seems it always starts off on the electric motor and the gearbox uses "innovative technology based on formula 1 success" so basically it uses sliding dogs, no synchros, same as a motorcycle and the technology matches the engine speed to the gearbox speed before slipping the gears in so it doesn't need any friction type clutches at all, as nothing needs to slip.

So it wouldn't need a torque converter to get going.

It does have a motor generator spare, so it could power a sunwheel like toyota and get a bit of CVT action.

Reads as though it will feel like almost a conventional auto without the slip so when you lift up the revs wont drop 500rpm or so and you will hear the engine speed change as it goes up the gears on a light throttle.

I'd try and have a go in one, even if you have to do it as a passenger.

facade

Here you go

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lYjh_42t1uU

Just make sure that you don't have anything heavy within reach, as you will want to throw something at him.

He would make a good Politician, talks for ages and says nothing, and even when it would be better if he just shut up so you could hear how it drives he won't.

(Probably went to the Dan Snow school of presenting- there's another man who can take the single most interesting topic of the last hundred years and make it dull and uninteresting) 

Goudy

No.
Renault call it the Multimode. It is a clutchless "dog" gearbox.
It's very similar to a racing car's gearbox, like in F1.

As stated, there's no clutch as the car always starts (and reverses) on electric.
The gears change with the aid of "dogs" rather than syncros.

These dog gears are small gear teeth on the edge of the main cogs that mesh with collars fixed on the driven shaft.
To engage or disengage a gear the selector fork moves the collar and the dog teeth engages that gear and driven collar/shaft together.

The automatic part is the fork actuators, they will automatically operate to select the appropriate gear.

You can make out how they engage in this image.
Honda CBR600RR teardown 2015-10-19 13.44.17 - Dog clutch - Wikipedia
A fork will move the collar/dog in the centre of the pic and push those dog teeth on the collar into the side of the gear with the recesses that fit the teeth.

These types of gearbox aren't known to be smooth, in racing cars it doesn't need to be but Renault have used a secondary motor to spin the flywheel up and smooth out the changes. which does work.

It's actually pretty clever and doesn't sap the same sort of power other gearboxes are prone to.
It's also smaller and lighter than most CVT's, twin clutch and torque convertors.

When coupled with the electric motors, there is something like 15 different drive modes (15 power and gear combinations).

I've driven a few as my dealer has been trying to tempt me out of my Clio RS Line 130tce twin clutch auto and I have to say it's very good.
There is none of that electric band effect you get with CVT's and I never found it getting flustered with it's gears, it just all works without you really noticing it.

On a steady cruise it's mpg is only slightly better than my 130tce twin clutch (which hits 58mpg easy) but around town the E Tech is pretty astonishing.
On my normal commute, around town in traffic it tended to trigger the engine in very short bursts just to top up the battery and ran on that most of the time.
Regen seems really healthy and the brakes don't feel wooden or grabby as they can on the different Toyota Hybrids.

The only reason I haven't chopped my RS Line in for one is because it has another 2 or so more years warranty (they come with 5 years) and I just can't justify the price difference yet. 

The Clio is due a mid life update this year and that comes with revised front and rear ends, but I believe they are dropping all the straight petrols, so the only engine choice will be the E Tech hybrid.

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Goudy said:

<snip>

These types of gearbox aren't known to be smooth, in racing cars it doesn't need to be but Renault have used a secondary motor to spin the flywheel up and smooth out the changes. which does work.

<snip>

Thanks for this, something else to file away for future reference.

How do they manage to get the gearbox unloaded to pull the dogs out without a clutch at the input?

I suppose they do have full control over the engine speed, and they could be sneaky with the regenerative braking, or even dab the main brakes on, then maybe a spring on the shift fork so it flicks out as soon as the load relaxes.

Bigwheels1111

If it’s a MOTABILITY car, why are you worrying.
I’ve driven manual, auto, semi auto, cvt etc and every Hgv with an auto of some kind.
Not mine so not bothered how they are reliability wise.
I have an EAT6 and mate has an EAT8 auto. Both smooth and reliable.
He has 160,000 on his.

knightstyle

One thing I have just learnt (and I thought I knew everything!) about hybrids is that on a normal ICE car the computer bit is set to give a cross between acceleration and economy whereas a hybrid car is set for economy as when acceleration is required the electric comes in to boost the power.
So hybrids should be more economical than ICE models.

Bigwheels1111

knightstyle said:

One thing I have just learnt (and I thought I knew everything!) about hybrids is that on a normal ICE car the computer bit is set to give a cross between acceleration and economy whereas a hybrid car is set for economy as when acceleration is required the electric comes in to boost the power.
So hybrids should be more economical than ICE models.

I know 10 mini cab drivers that own a Toyota Prius, they get 55 mpg minimum while cabbing.
Unless things drastically change buy 2029, ie charging networks I will be opting for a Toyota Corolla sports Hybrid.

MouldyOldDough

Bigwheels1111 said:

If it’s a MOTABILITY car, why are you worrying.
I’ve driven manual, auto, semi auto, cvt etc and every Hgv with an auto of some kind.
Not mine so not bothered how they are reliability wise.
I have an EAT6 and mate has an EAT8 auto. Both smooth and reliable.
He has 160,000 on his.

Because I will.be driving it!!
I am used to TCs

Goudy

facade said:

Goudy said:

<snip>

These types of gearbox aren't known to be smooth, in racing cars it doesn't need to be but Renault have used a secondary motor to spin the flywheel up and smooth out the changes. which does work.

<snip>

Thanks for this, something else to file away for future reference.

How do they manage to get the gearbox unloaded to pull the dogs out without a clutch at the input?

I suppose they do have full control over the engine speed, and they could be sneaky with the regenerative braking, or even dab the main brakes on, then maybe a spring on the shift fork so it flicks out as soon as the load relaxes.

I would think the same motor spinning the flywheel would help unload the gears enough to disengage. As with a twin clutch, changes are measured in fractions of a second.

It's an interesting solution to problems thrown up by hybrid drive and economy while still having a positive feel to it 

Toyota have also revised their CVT.
They now use a direct first gear. The electric motor always starts motion and drives this fixed gear. When it runs out of ratio it reverts to the CVT.
This means the CVT is smaller and lighter as it doesn't have to use larger pulleys to get a low gearing, the CVT part is only handling the higher, longer gear ratios, plus it takes some of that elastic feeling out of it at lower speeds.

It's better than the older system but still has a bit of that odd feeling mid speed.

photome

OP have you tried any of the Toyotas that were discussed a few weeks ago?

If you havent you may be surprised and how good they are to drive

i vaguely recall you asking if a wheelchair/ mobility scooter would fit in the back of a Corolla if that is the case I doubt it would fit in a clio