Energy Support scheme & care home residents

MsMoon

matt_drummer said:

MsMoon said:

matt_drummer said:

Spoonie_Turtle said:

People with multiple homes can get it for each home, no reason why a care home resident can't get it at their actual residential address as well as the property they own but don't live in.
https://www.gov.uk/apply-energy-bill-support-if-not-automatic 

I can't see anywhere there that says you can get it for multiple homes. It says you can claim for your main home if you haven't already received it automatically.

It also says that you cannot apply if you have already received the EBSS payments.

Why should a person get it twice?

I haven't applied yet, just posing the question and I won't apply until I'm sure it is allowed. But if there is a loophole that allows it, then there's a loophole that allows it and you should ask Rishi why it exists.

Loopholes don't have to be used.

Maybe be satisfied with all the help your relative has already received.

It is not Rishi Sunak's money, it comes from tax payers like me and maybe you.

Oh dear, just because the article or comment says it is "immoral" does not mean it is illegal to use it. Anyway, I wanted black and white factual answers not a debate on whether the particular policy is "moral" or not - there are many rules & policies we don't agree with, but if they exist, then there is nothing we can do about it, until another law or policy takes its place. Also the care home would not receive the money, it goes to the individual applying. Nice chatting, but I think we are going to go round in circles if we continue.

MsMoon

matt_drummer said:

MsMoon said:

I haven't applied yet, just posing the question and I won't apply until I'm sure it is allowed. But if there is a loophole that allows it, then there's a loophole that allows it and you should ask Rishi why it exists.

There isn't a loophole, it is for your main residence only.

Calm down dear.

matt_drummer

MsMoon said:

Oh dear, just because the article or comment says it is "immoral" does not mean it is illegal to use it. Anyway, I wanted black and white factual answers not a debate on whether the particular policy is "moral" or not - there are many rules & policies we don't agree with, but if they exist, then there is nothing we can do about it, until another law or policy takes it's place. Nice chatting, but I think we are going to go round in circles if we continue.

The government website is clear, you can claim it once, for your main residence.

I wasn't just talking about the morality of it, I was explaining why some people may get it more than once because they have multiple properties with multiple electricity accounts. They get it automatically, to claim again would be fraud. There is something you could do about loopholes that exist that you don't agree with, and that is to not use them.

I have given you the answer you are looking for, to claim again on a second residence that had not received the EBSS automatically would be a fraudulent claim as you are only allowed to claim once if you have not already received the EBSS and it is for your main residence.

Your relative has already received the EBSS and therefore cannot claim to receive it a second time.

Spoonie_Turtle

matt_drummer said:

Spoonie_Turtle said:

People with multiple homes can get it for each home, no reason why a care home resident can't get it at their actual residential address as well as the property they own but don't live in.
https://www.gov.uk/apply-energy-bill-support-if-not-automatic 

I can't see anywhere there that says you can get it for multiple homes. It says you can claim for your main home if you haven't already received it automatically.

It also says that you cannot apply if you have already received the EBSS payments.

Why should a person get it twice?

People did automatically, which is why I commented as I did, and a care home resident's main residence would logically be the care home.

But this is just reasoning based on some of the existing facts, not any official guidance or qualifying criteria because I can't find any.

TheMilkmansDad

wasn't there another thread on this a few weeks ago? Seem to recall it being started (or at least a poster in the thread) by someone in the care home sector?

matt_drummer

Spoonie_Turtle said:

matt_drummer said:

Spoonie_Turtle said:

People with multiple homes can get it for each home, no reason why a care home resident can't get it at their actual residential address as well as the property they own but don't live in.
https://www.gov.uk/apply-energy-bill-support-if-not-automatic 

I can't see anywhere there that says you can get it for multiple homes. It says you can claim for your main home if you haven't already received it automatically.

It also says that you cannot apply if you have already received the EBSS payments.

Why should a person get it twice?

People did automatically, which is why I commented as I did, and a care home resident's main residence would logically be the care home.

But this is just reasoning based on some of the existing facts, not any official guidance or qualifying criteria because I can't find any.

Based on the government website you linked to it is very clear.

You can claim it if you haven't already received it. The claim can only be for your main residence, even if it is a care home.

But this person has already received the EBSS so they cannot claim for a second amount of £400 even though it is for their main residence that happens to be a care home.

matt_drummer

From the government website

Apply for energy bill support if you do not get it automatically

Most households in England, Scotland and Wales get a £400 discount on their energy bills automatically. In some cases, you do not get the discount automatically, for example if you:

• pay for energy through a landlord, housing manager or site owner
• live in a park home, houseboat or off the electricity grid

Use this service to apply for the discount if you do not get it automatically. You can only make one application per household.

The OP's relative received the discount automatically through the energy account of their house.

MWT

matt_drummer said:

The OP's relative received the discount automatically through the energy account of their house.

.. but is that their 'household' if they no longer live there... ?

elsien

TheMilkmansDad said:

wasn't there another thread on this a few weeks ago? Seem to recall it being started (or at least a poster in the thread) by someone in the care home sector?

There was, but I think that was just about claiming it for the care home I don’t think the person had claimed it for another property. That debate was more around the care home demanding that the £400 was handed over to them.
The outcome of that was that it had been referred  back to the local authority commissioning team as the resident was part LA funded. 

This guidance was what was linked to but again there’s no reference to claiming more than once. Or not.
https://www.careengland.org.uk/energy-bill-support-scheme-for-local-authority-and-self-funded-residents/

I wonder if it’s worth the OP phoning any help lines such as AGEUK to see if they can shed any more light on whether the government has clarified this or not.

matt_drummer

MWT said:

matt_drummer said:

The OP's relative received the discount automatically through the energy account of their house.

.. but is that their 'household' if they no longer live there... ?

I think that the `household' refers to the bill payer. The person in this case has already received the EBSS even though they no longer live in the property. The government website says that you cannot claim EBSS if you have already received it.

I read it and come to the conclusion that the intention is you only get it once.

Like many schemes of this nature, there are flaws. People with more than one energy account have probably had multiple EBSS payments.

The difference though is that those people received EBSS automatically and have not gone back to claim it when they know they have already had it.

My opinion is that it would be fraudulent to make a claim for something you have already had, the website even says that you can only claim if you have not already received it automatically.

It makes sense as the EBSS was to assist with the rising cost of energy.

Your energy can only have risen where you actually live, at your main residence.