Tenants in Common - Probate

Land_Registry

Richie7 said:

Land_Registry said:

A form A restriction can be applied for and is the entry most people look for when they state that they are TIC. But you can be TIC without it. And even if applied for circumstances can change to make you joint tenants. 

I assumed your statement that the property was owned as TIC meant that the register referred to a form A restriction but clearly not. 

Form A - No disposition by a sole proprietor of the registered estate (except a trust corporation) under which capital money arises is to be registered unless authorised by an order of the court.
If there is no form A restriction on the register you can ignore section 7 of PG 6 and simply follow section 3 

  Sorry for my late reply but thanks for your help with his.

  There is no rush for me to do anything with regards this is there? Unless of course the house was being sold for example. As trying to deal with everything else is quite enough for me at the moment.

There is no rush 

Richie7

Hi,

I'm sorry to bump my thread again, but I just need some advice again please. I thought I had it figured out, but now it's come to confirming it with legal implications of course I'm questioning myself.

Long story short I need to go to probate for my dad now for some of his investments, but I'm just a bit thrown by the terminology on the probate application.

My dad had a number of sole investments, ISA's etc, and then a joint bank account with my mum, and then they own the house as tenants in common.

There are 5 values that need to be input on the form - gross value for IHT, net value for IHT, net qualifying value, Gross probate value, and net probate value.

For ease let's say their house is worth £200,000, dad has an isa of £10,000 and their joint bank account has £10,000 in it. Their are no liabilities/debts.

Am I right in thinking that the gross value for IHT is £120,000? And the net value would also be £120,000, so the net qualifying value will be £0? As it's all going to my mum and he owns a 50% share of the property.

Then the Gross probate value would be £115,000 and the net value also £115,000? As I only include this time his share of the bank account on top of his ISA and share of the property?


Sorry for this long post, I just need to make sure I get this right.


Thank you as always.

Sarahspangles

Richie7 said:

Hi,

I'm sorry to bump my thread again, but I just need some advice again please. I thought I had it figured out, but now it's come to confirming it with legal implications of course I'm questioning myself.

Long story short I need to go to probate for my dad now for some of his investments, but I'm just a bit thrown by the terminology on the probate application.

My dad had a number of sole investments, ISA's etc, and then a joint bank account with my mum, and then they own the house as tenants in common.

There are 5 values that need to be input on the form - gross value for IHT, net value for IHT, net qualifying value, Gross probate value, and net probate value.

For ease let's say their house is worth £200,000, dad has an isa of £10,000 and their joint bank account has £10,000 in it. Their are no liabilities/debts.

Am I right in thinking that the gross value for IHT is £120,000? And the net value would also be £120,000, so the net qualifying value will be £0? As it's all going to my mum and he owns a 50% share of the property.

Then the Gross probate value would be £115,000 and the net value also £115,000? As I only include this time his share of the bank account on top of his ISA and share of the property?


Sorry for this long post, I just need to make sure I get this right.


Thank you as always.

In case you’re trying to finish this today, and nobody is around, one way to get to these numbers is to use the online Inheritance Tax checker form on gov.uk. It outputs the figures and you just put them in the boxes on the probate form. For a simple estate it’s quick to use - it doesn’t require you to input more than a few numbers.

Richie7

Sarahspangles said:

In case you’re trying to finish this today, and nobody is around, one way to get to these numbers is to use the online Inheritance Tax checker form on gov.uk. It outputs the figures and you just put them in the boxes on the probate form. For a simple estate it’s quick to use - it doesn’t require you to input more than a few numbers.

Thanks, but it's not so much the values I'm struggling with as this an excepted estate anyway. It's just differentiating between the IHT and Probate figures I'm having a wobble with. 

I kind of don't really see why the figures would ever be different, if you're only ever dealing with the share of the person who passed away.

Sarahspangles

I kind of don't really see why the figures would ever be different, if you're only ever dealing with the share of the person who passed away.

They are different though, and I can’t tell you why, I just know that that checker form made it clear for us for the two excepted estates we’ve done.

Richie7

Sarahspangles said:

They are different though, and I can’t tell you why, I just know that that checker form made it clear for us for the two excepted estates we’ve done.

I might just go and see a solicitor to be honest to make sure I get it right. Not something I can be bothered with if I get it wrong. I just wish it was more clear on how you value a jointly owned asset.

Sarahspangles

Richie7 said:

Sarahspangles said:

They are different though, and I can’t tell you why, I just know that that checker form made it clear for us for the two excepted estates we’ve done.

I might just go and see a solicitor to be honest to make sure I get it right. Not something I can be bothered with if I get it wrong. I just wish it was more clear on how you value a jointly owned asset.

You’re so close though - why not post the specific question with a different title, the boards are busier today

Richie7

Apologies for bumping my old thread, I thought it was better than starting another one.

I just wanted some final clarification and I'm hoping @Land_Registry you wouldn't mind doing so please. 

We finished at the end of last year finalising nearly all my dad's affairs with probate, and the last thing that remains is the house.

In his will he left his half of the house to myself and my sister. He arranged this in 2009 when he and my mum also became tenants in common. So I now own 25%, my sister 25%, and my mum 50%.

What form do I need to complete to notify the Land Registry of this? I want to make sure I get it right as it's all been a very stressful time and I don't want any complications. I've found some online, but not sure if one of them is the correct one.

Thanks very much.

Land_Registry

Richie7 said:

Apologies for bumping my old thread, I thought it was better than starting another one.

I just wanted some final clarification and I'm hoping @Land_Registry you wouldn't mind doing so please. 

We finished at the end of last year finalising nearly all my dad's affairs with probate, and the last thing that remains is the house.

In his will he left his half of the house to myself and my sister. He arranged this in 2009 when he and my mum also became tenants in common. So I now own 25%, my sister 25%, and my mum 50%.

What form do I need to complete to notify the Land Registry of this? I want to make sure I get it right as it's all been a very stressful time and I don't want any complications. I've found some online, but not sure if one of them is the correct one.

Thanks very much.

It’s all a Q of what you all want to do re the legal ownership. One option is do nothing as the will/TIC protects you/your sister’s beneficial ownership 
The legal ownership passed to your Mum and probate wasn’t needed for the property so IF you all decide you want to transfer it into your three names then Mum woukd transfer the whole legal ownership to herself plus you both 
https://customerhelp.landregistry.gov.uk/guide-page-external/?stepid=c48ca216-8d82-eb11-a812-000d3ad48f95&kbonly=true&setanswer=

If the arrangements made in 2009 protected the wills/trust, and for example Mum’s right to carry on living there, then you may opt to do nothing - for example if you/sister have yet to buy your first home being the legal owner now may impact on your stamp duty when you buy your own property as a ‘second home’ 
So you don’t have to notify us of anything in effect so it’s worth getting some legal/financial advice about what your collective options are and what’s ‘best’ to do, which maybe nothing. 

Richie7

Land_Registry said:

Richie7 said:

Apologies for bumping my old thread, I thought it was better than starting another one.

I just wanted some final clarification and I'm hoping @Land_Registry you wouldn't mind doing so please. 

We finished at the end of last year finalising nearly all my dad's affairs with probate, and the last thing that remains is the house.

In his will he left his half of the house to myself and my sister. He arranged this in 2009 when he and my mum also became tenants in common. So I now own 25%, my sister 25%, and my mum 50%.

What form do I need to complete to notify the Land Registry of this? I want to make sure I get it right as it's all been a very stressful time and I don't want any complications. I've found some online, but not sure if one of them is the correct one.

Thanks very much.

It’s all a Q of what you all want to do re the legal ownership. One option is do nothing as the will/TIC protects you/your sister’s beneficial ownership 
The legal ownership passed to your Mum and probate wasn’t needed for the property so IF you all decide you want to transfer it into your three names then Mum woukd transfer the whole legal ownership to herself plus you both 
https://customerhelp.landregistry.gov.uk/guide-page-external/?stepid=c48ca216-8d82-eb11-a812-000d3ad48f95&kbonly=true&setanswer=

If the arrangements made in 2009 protected the wills/trust, and for example Mum’s right to carry on living there, then you may opt to do nothing - for example if you/sister have yet to buy your first home being the legal owner now may impact on your stamp duty when you buy your own property as a ‘second home’ 
So you don’t have to notify us of anything in effect so it’s worth getting some legal/financial advice about what your collective options are and what’s ‘best’ to do, which maybe nothing. 

Thanks for the reply. As it happens the will did direct that my mum could continue living there. However she has decided she would like to move and sell the house now. So I'm guessing for that to happen we would need to have it legally in our three names before the sale? As per the will dictates?