Lodger Licence Fee Increase - Your Opinion Requested

Ryan_Holden

sourpuss2021 said:

It’s odd that you call it license fee, rather than rent.   I understand that as a lodger he will have a license, not a tenancy.  But still, it’s rent that he pays you.

It's the way lodging works, the lodger has a licence to occupy and a written licence agreement. It's not a tenancy which comes with a whole different set of rights. It might sound odd but it's the just the way it works for most lodging these days.

I definitely wouldn't describe him as problematic and when he's out of his room he's a lovely young guy, he's just costing me more money than I anticipated (and is set to cost me even more) which I'm looking to partially offset. Truthfully I quite like that we still have our own space, but if I've painted him as some sort of social recluse devil man then I've definitely given you the wrong impression   

saajan_12, thanks for your input. I think from yours and other opinions here it's worth a frank conversation about how much the AC will cost, that maybe we run it for a set period of time and monitor it with the smart meter and make an approximation of its cost and then figure out an amount that suits us both.

Retsol, thanks again for your input too. You're right, the shift in circumstances has definitely tilted the balance. It's now then about finding a balance that still works for us and making sure that if I'm not the right fit for him with what I need to keep me sane, that he knows he has options.

Ryan_Holden

ArbitraryRandom said:

From what you're saying, you have a good relationship and it could well be he's spending so much time in his room because he doesn't want to feel in the way (not being used to being home all the time). 

If I were you I'd be doing as others have suggested and proposing a rate 'which can be reviewed in 6 months' that you think will cover the increased costs. 

I wouldn't personally discuss his habits or usage in relation to the increase, but rather use the reasonable justification of energy prices, mortgage rates and general inflation. If you suggest you have faced an increase in costs then, assuming he views your relationship the same way, he would hopefully think it reasonable to help out. 

If he says he can't afford the increase (which unemployed he might struggle) then have you considered a rent decrease with energy bills not being included (split them 50/50)?

I hadn't considered the model of splitting bills and reducing the rent at all. That is a very interesting take, however he has demonstrated absolutely no interest in being energy efficient so far but again, maybe that's because he hasn't had to.

But if he still didn't care, it would free him up to just run his AC and PC and bump my bills up because I am very energy and water conscious.

One to consider, thank you.

theartfullodger

Just evict in line with his lodger agreement (do tell us what it says).

Then get some examples of lodger agreements to review & choose the one taht suits.

Then, go looking for another lucky punter.

RetSol

Retsol, thanks again for your input too. You're right, the shift in circumstances has definitely tilted the balance. It's now then about finding a balance that still works for us and making sure that if I'm not the right fit for him with what I need to keep me sane, that he knows he has options.

We live and learn, @Ryan_Holden! 

propertyrental

Ryan_Holden said:

Gosh, thank you again for all these replies. The breadth of opinion is exactly what I wanted to get.

stuhse, .......

I also don't view the rental income as profit. It subsidises my mortgage and I only took the lodger on after my relationship failed and I was left with the house. I want him to be comfortable and happy here and not feel like a cash cow, but equally I don't want to keep paying more and more for his presence.

propertyrental, he is now in a 1 month rolling contract after a 6 month licence agreement. And you're right, I like the guy so I would prefer him not to leave but equally that is his right.

Whatever you use it for (mortgage subsidy, utility bills subsidy, drinks down the pub) is irrelevant. It's rent.
And assessed as such by HMRC irrespective of how you spend it. Sure, if it falls within the Rent-A-Room scheme allowance there's no tax to pay, but in assessing whether it does or does not fall within the scheme allowance, HMRC would not care that you use it towards your mortgage!

My strong advice for the future would be to not tie yourself to a lodger for6months. Yes, gives you some security of income and lodger security of housing, but we've seen enough examples on the forum here where the landlord is stuck with the lodger from hell (or in your case, the lodger who uses unreasonable utilities...).

As you are aware, this is not a tenancy - the key difference being it's your home. That not only has legal implications, but also practical ones. And being able to easily and quickly rid yourself of an unwelcome lodger is paramount.. So next time

* no fixed term contract
* rolling from the start
* I'd suggest weekly, with weekly rent

That way if things turn sour, a week's notice and you are free to find a replacement. Of course, if things work well, the arrangement can continue ad infinitum.

I agree with saajan_12:

I wouldn't really worry about a fair use clause - a lodger rents part of your house which is presumably not on a separate meter, you can't really calculate their usage, let alone define what is excessive. So that clause would be unenforceable. Instead, you could 
- keep a short enough notice period and increase the rent if you think usage is high

If you feel the need to increase the rent, for whatever reason, increase it. Lodger can agree, negotiate, or leave. No need for complicated clauses. You can never include clauses to cover every potential scenario!

It's the way lodging works, the lodger has a licence to occupy and a written licence agreement.
Correct
It's not a tenancy which comes with a whole different set of rights.
Correct
It might sound odd but it's the just the way it works for most lodging these days.

But it's still 'rent' whether the contract describes it as such or as a 'licence fee'.. Certainly in the view of HMRC (and quite possible the DWP though I'm no expert and don't know if you have to declare the income if you are claiming benefits.....)

Ryan_Holden

Thanks all for your input. 

To give you some context, here's the smart meter data for the last week. The usage for the entire house (so that's the American Fridge Freezer, another standalone freezer, the lizard vivarium, kettle over the day, laptop charger for 2 charges, my TV and PS4 in the evening, exterior house light and vacuum on charge all day, is all typically around 6 kWh.

He was in for half the day on 31st March as he left for his weekend away, and when he came back after 3 days (at 4pm) and we hit almost 11 kWh. It doesn't seem reasonable to me.



And here's the data for the month, you can see I've highlighted the time he was away which is a true representation of my average usage, against his usage which varies wildly basically depending on how long he's awake, peaking at 16 kWh somedays.

housebuyer143

Ryan_Holden said:

Thanks all for your input. 

To give you some context, here's the smart meter data for the last week. The usage for the entire house (so that's the American Fridge Freezer, another freezer, the lizard vivarium, kettle over the day, laptop charger for 2 charges, my TV in the evening and PS4 is all typically around 6 kWh.

He was in for half the day on 31st March as he left for his weekend away, and when he came back after 3 days (at 4pm) and we hit almost 11 kWh. It doesn't seem reasonable to me.



And here's the data for the month, you can see I've highlighted the time he was away which is a true representation of my average usage, against his usage which varies wildly basically depending on how long he's awake, peaking at 16 kWh somedays.

They problem is when people are not physically paying the bill they just don't care. He should not be able to use that much electric and not cover a portion of it. 
I would simply tell him that since he's been home all the time the electric bill has doubled and you need to pass on this additional cost and also then bring up the potential cost of the air con also.
If he's not happy to pay the increase and what you suggested seems low tbh based on this, then I would any him to leave. 

Grumpy_chap

housebuyer143 said:

Ryan_Holden said:

Thanks all for your input. 

To give you some context, here's the smart meter data for the last week. The usage for the entire house (so that's the American Fridge Freezer, another freezer, the lizard vivarium, kettle over the day, laptop charger for 2 charges, my TV in the evening and PS4 is all typically around 6 kWh.

He was in for half the day on 31st March as he left for his weekend away, and when he came back after 3 days (at 4pm) and we hit almost 11 kWh. It doesn't seem reasonable to me.



And here's the data for the month, you can see I've highlighted the time he was away which is a true representation of my average usage, against his usage which varies wildly basically depending on how long he's awake, peaking at 16 kWh somedays.

They problem is when people are not physically paying the bill they just don't care. He should not be able to use that much electric and not cover a portion of it. 
I would simply tell him that since he's been home all the time the electric bill has doubled and you need to pass on this additional cost and also then bring up the potential cost of the air con also.
If he's not happy to pay the increase and what you suggested seems low tbh based on this, then I would any him to leave. 

If the OP links a change in rent to the lodger being home a lot, is there a possibility that the lodger will expect the rent to fall when they get another job?

Rather than link to energy and being home, which all makes it complicated, a simple discussion that the rent is increasing might be easier.  The lodger can always move on if they choose ( may be to the detriment of the OP,)

sourpuss2021

Dependent on the area it may be that there are 100 other people who would love to rent this room, and would not sit at home all day playing games and overusing electricity!

Ryan_Holden

Grumpy_chap, It's a good point, the rent needs to go up anyway. We've lost the EBSS like everyone else, the council tax has gone up, our water usage has gone up dramatically (more so than any other lodger), the water rate has increased, and I buy all the household supplies (even tho I'm not required to) and they've gone up a lot with inflation. I just wanted to offset his electricity a little without looking like I'm just money grabbing. 

But at least with the charts you can see why it's starting to grate on me.