Amazon refusing to replace faulty item that has gone up in price

WhiskersTheWonderCat

How much do second hand ones go for on eBay? You could pick up one from there. 

eeperman

Not a bad idea Whiskers - that may be my plan if I can't persuade Amazon to budge. Twin packs have gone as low as £230 so that might work.

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head

eeperman said:

Thanks Manxman, 

I was of the impression that I had the right to repair/replacement:

Section 19(3) CRA 2015

If the goods do not conform to the contract because of a breach of any of the terms described in sections 9, 10, 11, 13 and 14, or if they do not conform to the contract under section 16, the consumer's rights (and the provisions about them and when they are available) are—

(a)the short-term right to reject (sections 20 and 22);

(b)the right to repair or replacement (section 23); and

(c)the right to a price reduction or the final right to reject (sections 20 and 24).

Section 23 CRA

Right to repair or replacement

(1)This section applies if the consumer has the right to repair or replacement (see section 19(3) and (4)).

(2)If the consumer requires the trader to repair or replace the goods, the trader must—

(a)do so within a reasonable time and without significant inconvenience to the consumer, and

(b)bear any necessary costs incurred in doing so (including in particular the cost of any labour, materials or postage).

(3)The consumer cannot require the trader to repair or replace the goods if that remedy (the repair or the replacement)—

(a)is impossible, or

(b)is disproportionate compared to the other of those remedies.

I can't see any provision that suggests that the offer of a refund trumps the requirement to repair/replace if I ask for it. The question of it being disproportionate is an interesting one, but I would argue that Amazon have the ability to go to Asus and get the item repaired and replaced by Asus so repair/replacement is neither impossible or excessively expensive.

OP you are correct that you are entitled to (in my view, your choice of) a repair or a replacement, however the issue is where the trader fails to do so within a reasonable time the next step is your final right to reject or the right to a price reduction.

It sort of boils down to being the trader's choice but only if they fail to meet their obligation to repair/replace (assuming not impossible or disproportionate).

In general the advice on the forum could be better presented as there is a possibility that reminding the trader of your rights and their obligations may see them be willing to adhere to them. 

With Amazon it is difficult as CS are very scripted, worth a try to contact 

managingdirector@amazon.co.uk

and see if they offer anything better, should they reply. 

eeperman

That is a very good point - the endgame is tricky here. If Amazon refuse to budge then my next step is to demand a refund and then they will just offer me what they have already offered. 

I’ve sent them a letter setting out my interpretation of the law so will give them some time to respond. If still no joy then some Twitter action may have to follow. Asus should also hang their heads - their warranty provision is very weak and depends on the retailers goodwill. 

Manxman_in_exile

eeperman said:

... I can't see any provision that suggests that the offer of a refund trumps the requirement to repair/replace if I ask for it. The question of it being disproportionate is an interesting one, but I would argue that Amazon have the ability to go to Asus and get the item repaired and replaced by Asus so repair/replacement is neither impossible or excessively expensive.

Hmmm.   I see your point.

I'm beginning to think that amazon offering a refund does not override your right to either a repair or a replacement...

Manxman_in_exile

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head said:

eeperman said:

Thanks Manxman, 

I was of the impression that I had the right to repair/replacement:

Section 19(3) CRA 2015

If the goods do not conform to the contract because of a breach of any of the terms described in sections 9, 10, 11, 13 and 14, or if they do not conform to the contract under section 16, the consumer's rights (and the provisions about them and when they are available) are—

(a)the short-term right to reject (sections 20 and 22);

(b)the right to repair or replacement (section 23); and

(c)the right to a price reduction or the final right to reject (sections 20 and 24).

Section 23 CRA

Right to repair or replacement

(1)This section applies if the consumer has the right to repair or replacement (see section 19(3) and (4)).

(2)If the consumer requires the trader to repair or replace the goods, the trader must—

(a)do so within a reasonable time and without significant inconvenience to the consumer, and

(b)bear any necessary costs incurred in doing so (including in particular the cost of any labour, materials or postage).

(3)The consumer cannot require the trader to repair or replace the goods if that remedy (the repair or the replacement)—

(a)is impossible, or

(b)is disproportionate compared to the other of those remedies.

I can't see any provision that suggests that the offer of a refund trumps the requirement to repair/replace if I ask for it. The question of it being disproportionate is an interesting one, but I would argue that Amazon have the ability to go to Asus and get the item repaired and replaced by Asus so repair/replacement is neither impossible or excessively expensive.

OP you are correct that you are entitled to (in my view, your choice of) a repair or a replacement, ...

Yeah.  I think you and the OP are probably correct.

As you say, the problem is persuading Amazon to repair or replace as if they won't a refund is the only remaining remedy.

Again, as you say, worth trying amazon at a higher level and pointing out that the ASUS warranty places responsibility for managing the warranty repair or replacement on amazon, but that ASUS will do the repair or provide the replacement at no cost to amazon.

tightauldgit

Manxman_in_exile said:

eeperman said:

... I can't see any provision that suggests that the offer of a refund trumps the requirement to repair/replace if I ask for it. The question of it being disproportionate is an interesting one, but I would argue that Amazon have the ability to go to Asus and get the item repaired and replaced by Asus so repair/replacement is neither impossible or excessively expensive.

Hmmm.   I see your point.

I'm beginning to think that amazon offering a refund does not override your right to either a repair or a replacement...

In practical terms its fairly impossible to force someone to repair something they don't want to repair. 

Replacement could also be an issue - are you actually entitled to a brand new replacement or can amazon say 'we don't have a 9 month old like for like replacement to give you'?

Given that they're offering a full refund i'd bite their hand off

the_lunatic_is_in_my_head

tightauldgit said:

In practical terms its fairly impossible to force someone to repair something they don't want to repair. 

Replacement could also be an issue - are you actually entitled to a brand new replacement or can amazon say 'we don't have a 9 month old like for like replacement to give you'?

The replacement should "usually" be identical to the goods as they were sold meaning it should be new had it been new to begin with (based on the explanatory notes on the CRA).

I think if a retailer offered someone a professionally refurbished item after, in this example, 9 months that would perhaps be something that would be sensible to accept. 

tightauldgit said:

Given that they're offering a full refund i'd bite their hand off

The problem for OP really is that they are possibly better off under warranty, ASUS are a big company and you'd think a retailer the size of Amazon would either have something in place to meet the warranty or have an agreement with ASUS that Amazon orders are covered without Amazon's intervention. 

The full refund offer from Amazon is certainly better than consumer rights would entitle (reduced refund with burden of proof on the OP) but OP is entitled to see that the warranty terms are fulfilled as it's legal agreement. I think it should be for ASUS to chase Amazon to do as they should as it's ASUS's warranty but OP will probably get the same scripted experience from ASUS CS.

OP one thought, it's worth checking the product on camelcamelcamel

https://uk.camelcamelcamel.com/

Amazon pricing can jump up and down a lot, it's possible the current £440 is an unusually high spike. 

Alderbank

Amazon just don't seem to do replacements, as a matter of policy.

There have been other threads on this here. My own Amazon experience on the couple of times when I've bought something which broke down or was faulty and I've asked for a replacement, has always been 'return it for a full refund and purchase it again'. 
As we saw with the John Lewis Partnership thread recently, that is marginally better for the buyer (usually) because with a new purchase any warranty is reset.

In this case the OP is unlucky that the price has changed.

Jenni_D

eeperman said:

Thanks Manxman, 

I was of the impression that I had the right to repair/replacement:

Section 19(3) CRA 2015

If the goods do not conform to the contract because of a breach of any of the terms described in sections 9, 10, 11, 13 and 14, or if they do not conform to the contract under section 16, the consumer's rights (and the provisions about them and when they are available) are—

(a)the short-term right to reject (sections 20 and 22);

(b)the right to repair or replacement (section 23); and

(c)the right to a price reduction or the final right to reject (sections 20 and 24).

Section 23 CRA

Right to repair or replacement

(1)This section applies if the consumer has the right to repair or replacement (see section 19(3) and (4)).

(2)If the consumer requires the trader to repair or replace the goods, the trader must—

(a)do so within a reasonable time and without significant inconvenience to the consumer, and

(b)bear any necessary costs incurred in doing so (including in particular the cost of any labour, materials or postage).

(3)The consumer cannot require the trader to repair or replace the goods if that remedy (the repair or the replacement)—

(a)is impossible, or

(b)is disproportionate compared to the other of those remedies.

I can't see any provision that suggests that the offer of a refund trumps the requirement to repair/replace if I ask for it. The question of it being disproportionate is an interesting one, but I would argue that Amazon have the ability to go to Asus and get the item repaired and replaced by Asus so repair/replacement is neither impossible or excessively expensive.

I've highlighted Amazon's "get out" from providing a repair or replacement.