Probate : 16 weeks and counting

ArGee68

This issue has driven me to join the forum and finally make my first post after years of reading but not contributing.

OP - I urge you to phone the probate office and chase your application ASAP for the following reasons:

Unfortunately our family have had to make 2 separate probate applications within 3 months (both filed online).   The second application was filed in January for a straightforward excepted estate.  We sent the will the day after application and probate was approved just 4 working days later.  In total it took just 7 days!

However, the first application was submitted in November for an estate that is below IHT after transfer of the spouse allowance but the will is a long document due to the number of legacies and we feared it may raise some queries.    Therefore we were not unduly concerned when we heard nothing from probate until our second application was processed so quickly.   We reached 16 weeks last week so I was finally able to chase the application and found out the following from an exasperated employee:

1. Emails to acknowledge receipt of the will are no longer being sent and the staff have been asking that the website is updated to remove this as it is misleading.  I see that some people have received a receipt of will email but it is no longer the norm.
   
The person I spoke to confirmed the will in our case was scanned in 2 days after the RM delivery date.

2. The account that is created on the Gov website when you make an application is not updated.  Our second application that was approved in January still states that we need to submit the will.

3. Applications are not being dealt with in date receipt order.  Therefore more recent applications such as our second one are being dealt with quickly to get the backlog down (and improve their statistics).  Meanwhile those filed in Oct/Nov/Dec are being ignored.

I was told last week that we haven't heard anything about our November application because it hasn't even been looked at yet.  She escalated our case but told me to chase again in 3 weeks.  

Therefore anyone waiting more that 16 weeks should chase as soon as possible or you could be waiting indefinitely.

We rushed to file our first application in November because of the 16 week time scale as we foolishly believed applications would be dealt with on a first come, first served basis.  With hindsight, if we had waited until after Christmas probate would probably be granted by now.

lisyloo

Thankyou ArGee68, that's a very helpful contribution.
Sorry to hear you are dealing with two (we are also).

We received one email yesterday "HMCTS Probate has received the documents you sent".
I would not be suprised if one goes through quick and the other one doesn't.

waiting4probate

lisyloo said:

waiting4probate said:

If you sent it signed for then you should be able to use the tracking number and check on royal mails website as to whether it arrived at HMCTS.

Checked it and it was signed for 15 November

waiting4probate

We rushed to file our first application in November because of the 16 week time scale as we foolishly believed applications would be dealt with on a first come, first served basis.  With hindsight, if we had waited until after Christmas probate would probably be granted by now.

I wonder if they have targets, and if an application has missed it's target it get deprioritised....

waiting4probate

I "spoke" to someone on the web chat and the case has been escalated now. No problems with the application, it's just clearly not being processed for some bureaucratic reason.

ArGee68

I think you'll find the bureaucratic reason is "they can't be bothered".  Probate staff are busy dealing with recent applications so that the statistics improve whilst those unfortunate to have fallen into the October/November black hole are being ignored. 

I would understand if queries had been raised about our application, but to find out that no one has even looked at it after 16 weeks is unacceptable IMHO.   

lisyloo

Yep agree, It's unacceptable that there appears to be no tracking, no recourse, no explanations.
We are waiting for 2 estates so this is going to be interesting.
The second death has most of the cash, but we need both the sell the house.
I can only suggest getting your MP involved.

Jowwie

Might also be possible to raise a complaint?
https://www.gov.uk/government/organisations/hm-courts-and-tribunals-service/about/complaints-procedure
Maybe even to sue MoJ for compensation but that could be expensive for an individual.
Mike Freer is the parliamentary undersecretary of state. I think HMCTS falls under his jurisdiction. Perhaps he needs a few letters from the public.

Sarahspangles

I’m (still) not defending HMCTS but if you follow the ‘What to do when someone dies’ on gov.uk it says

You should not make any financial plans or put property on the market until you’ve got probate.

And

You’ll usually get probate within 16 weeks of submitting your application. It can take longer if you need to provide additional information.

We did put the property on the market after applying, but before receiving probate.  We received a good offer almost straight away, but were open that we’d only applied for probate three weeks earlier and while there was nothing complex about the application, we were aware of the guidance about sixteen weeks.  

The estate agent was relatively relaxed about this as they say the expected timescale from listing to completing on a sale is 20 weeks.

I expect this is the stuff we could have paid a solicitor to tell us and then we’d be moaning about the slowness of the solicitor!

Bolt1234

Could I join please.  Just put in an application last week via solicitor.  Are the delays because there are errors in the form and then effectively the time starts again or (and I speak from experience of working for government depts) that they feel if there are errors then care wasnt taken to do the forms properly and actually having to get hold of the applicant is a faff and time consuming so they  put it to the bottom of their workload?

I would hope there are not any errors on ours.  We dont have a house to sell thank goodness but there are shares and AIM's shares but the rule around Business Relief has been around for years so its not as though its a new relief for the staff to get to grips with.