New Build Estates with Playgrounds - Are they for Residents Only?

GixerKate

propertyrental said:

There must be a document that describes who owns the land, (the residents?) who manages it and who has to pay for the management. That would probably make clear the answer, though it may not.

When you bought your property, did you not have to sign something to agree to pay your share? Dig out your conveyancing documents and have a read to remind yourself (you did read them all at the time yes?)

Yes I did read them and I got clarification around some of the unclear terminology.  As mentioned, the residents of the estate solely pay for the maintenance of the playground through the management fee that is paid annually by the home owners and monthly by the SO home owners.

GixerKate

DullGreyGuy said:

user1977 said:

I don't think there are any general principles about such things, and I've never seen signs saying "playground only for use by [x]". It's entirely up to whoever owns/manages the playground, but I assume none ever employ bouncers or other forms of access control...would you be happier if the antisocial teenagers were residents in the relevant development?

If they are being sufficiently antisocial you can of course ask the police to assist.

There are and it goes further... was a kick off in the news a few years ago because a new estate had a playground but it was only to be used by those in the regular flats, those who were in the affordable housing units were explicitly told they cannot use the playground. 

Ultimately its private land and so the owner of the land can decide who does and doesnt get to go on it (as long as its not based on a protected characteristic like race or gender).  The difficulty will be enforcing any rules... our local park when I was a kid had a "no ball games" sign on the wall which was often used for target practice with footballs/tennis balls etc

Thanks that helps.  We have formed a neighbourhood watch which includes residents that overlook the park and we will be policing it ourselves.

eddddy

DullGreyGuy said:

Ultimately its private land and so the owner of the land can decide who does and doesnt get to go on it (as long as its not based on a protected characteristic like race or gender).  

That's true if there are no planning conditions.

If there are planning conditions, they cannot be overridden by the owner of the land.

Here's a random example of a planning condition for one development:

GixerKate

eddddy said:

DullGreyGuy said:

Ultimately its private land and so the owner of the land can decide who does and doesnt get to go on it (as long as its not based on a protected characteristic like race or gender).  

That's true if there are no planning conditions.

If there are planning conditions, they cannot be overridden by the owner of the land.

Here's a random example of a planning condition for one development:

Thats really helpful thanks!! I'm going to recheck the planning info.

sourpuss2021

Emmia said:

Another approach is the gated squares option, which you see in London - these are smallish, enclosed parks with high fences and locked gates - only residents of buildings near to /surrounding the park have the keys for access.

But still, people climb the fence and sleep in them!   

ReadingTim

The playground will have been built either as a condition of, or a sweetner to getting planning permission for the estate as a whole as left to their own devices the developer would probably have stuck more houses/flats on the plot and got more money.  Yes, it's on what is technically private land, but short of fencing it in and only giving residents a key, you're not going to be able to stop non-residents accessing it.  Think of it like toilets in a shopping centre for example... 

Teenagers hanging round playgrounds acting like teenagers is a problem as old as the hills, and short of calling the police there's very little you can do, short of waiting for them to grow up (they all do, eventually) or move on to the next hangout spot

diystarter7

ReadingTim said:

The playground will have been built either as a condition of, or a sweetner to getting planning permission for the estate as a whole as left to their own devices the developer would probably have stuck more houses/flats on the plot and got more money.  Yes, it's on what is technically private land, but short of fencing it in and only giving residents a key, you're not going to be able to stop non-residents accessing it.  Think of it like toilets in a shopping centre for example... 

Teenagers hanging round playgrounds acting like teenagers is a problem as old as the hills, and short of calling the police there's very little you can do, short of waiting for them to grow up (they all do, eventually) or move on to the next hangout spot

Hi
As I read through the thread I was thinking exactly the same

Developments with things like this done to please the LA
As you said, enforcement of the rules is another thing and often, intially anyone when some dont have access, it creats resentment

Slightly different but some office conversions and noew built blocks of flats had separate entrances for the HA rentals.  The LA would only give the go ahead if x amount of retals via HA were built and some of these apartments even then cost a lot more than the average semi in greater London. I'm not sure if they have had to merge the entrances or people can use the entrance they want as many were upset.


Having a playground on an estate is looking for trouble imo as often, later in the day/night these places are often magnets for anti-social behaviour,

Thnaks

diggingdude

Don't forget to petition your MP with regards to the unfairness of paying full council tax and paying to maintain the land etc on new build estates. 

Postik

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, but around these parts those "unadopted" play areas are free for anyone to use, and as someone else pointed out the management company will have public liability insurance.  I'm afraid the unadopted green space that you have to pay extra for is just a big swizz where you pay your council tax but they shirk half of their responsibility, and as you're now finding out you have the luxury of paying for space that everyone else is allowed to use for free.

GixerKate

Thanks for taking the time to respond, a quick update for everyone.  Whilst there isn't anything specific in the plans for the intention of the play area, the management company have said that while yes we are paying for everything and will continue to do so, we can't stop the general public from using the play area.

Tbh, we haven't got a problem with younger kids using it, its the older kids being anti-social.  What we can do is police it ourselves and enforce the 'under 12 year olds' rule instead.  As its a small community here we can usually call the kids by their names and we know how old they are.

Really is disappointing though.  You'd think that as the play area is built on the private land, never to be adopted by the council and maintained solely through the residents, you'd think we would have some rights but no.