Section 75 Declined

ScottCooper

Hi There,

I am currently in a very long line for the ombudsman but wanted to try giving it 'one more go' with my credit card provider. 

Keeping it as short as possible I was the victim of a well planned and elaborate fraud. I and roughly 300 other couples (not known at the time) after completing a lengthy due diligence paid a company a deposit of £15000 towardsan extension whose total cost was £76000. The contract listed the deposit, and several stages of the build as check points for where payments were to be taken.

After a merry dance with the builder in question it became clear that something was wrong, and that we weren't alone. Our last update was that the perpatrator has been arrested and interviewed for the offense(s). I had paid £100.00 on credit card, £4900 on debit and £10000 via bank transfer. My bank has refunded £10K as per their APP scam process but has done absolutely nothing with regards to the debit card payment, as its been nearly 9 months now even if they were to attempt a chargeback the account would be empty.

I have attempted a Section 75, on the basis that my 'claim' is for the £5,000 I have lost and that the £76,000 was split into different items i.e. deposit, stage 1, stage 2 etc. but the bank concerned have declined this, It's frustrating that some of the other victims have had full refunds from their credit card provider(s) but mine is being different.

I'm just wondering if anyone has experienced anything similar or would be able to cite similar examples that maybe known of, to help get somewhere.

Thank you in advance.

MattMattMattUK

ScottCooper said:

Hi There,

I am currently in a very long line for the ombudsman but wanted to try giving it 'one more go' with my credit card provider. 

Keeping it as short as possible I was the victim of a well planned and elaborate fraud. I and roughly 300 other couples (not known at the time) after completing a lengthy due diligence paid a company a deposit of £15000 towardsan extension whose total cost was £76000. The contract listed the deposit, and several stages of the build as check points for where payments were to be taken.

After a merry dance with the builder in question it became clear that something was wrong, and that we weren't alone. Our last update was that the perpatrator has been arrested and interviewed for the offense(s). I had paid £100.00 on credit card, £4900 on debit and £10000 via bank transfer. My bank has refunded £10K as per their APP scam process but has done absolutely nothing with regards to the debit card payment, as its been nearly 9 months now even if they were to attempt a chargeback the account would be empty.

I have attempted a Section 75, on the basis that my 'claim' is for the £5,000 I have lost and that the £76,000 was split into different items i.e. deposit, stage 1, stage 2 etc. but the bank concerned have declined this, It's frustrating that some of the other victims have had full refunds from their credit card provider(s) but mine is being different.

I'm just wondering if anyone has experienced anything similar or would be able to cite similar examples that maybe known of, to help get somewhere.

Thank you in advance.

Firstly S75 will be declined automatically for a debit card as it does not exist for debit cards, only credit cards. Secondly S75 is not valid as the value of the goods/service is over £30,000, it does not matter how the payment structure was split down (deposit and staging). I really cannot see how you can deem them liable based on S75. 

HillStreetBlues

I agree with Matt.

Contract was for £76k  so no S75

DullGreyGuy

ScottCooper said:
as its been nearly 9 months now even if they were to attempt a chargeback the account would be empty.

Empty account doesnt matter, the monies are paid initially from their merchant services provider and its then their problem to get it back from their client. Thats why you can still do a chargeback against an insolvent company. You should have processed this as a chargeback from the get go assuming you knew within 120 days of paying.

On the S75 front I would agree with others, you were buying an extension for more than £30k so outside of the scope of S75. The chunking it into phases/stages doesnt impact anything. 

lr1277

I don't know your timescales, but there is a 120 day limit on chargebacks, as I found out when a hotel booking went wrong.

Taken from Google when I seached on the phrase: UK 120 day limit on chargeback":

You should make a claim as soon as you identify the problem or are concerned about a transaction. This is because your card provider usually needs to start the chargeback process within 120 days from when you made the transaction or when you were due to receive the goods or services.

Apparently this text was from this site:

https://www.ukfinance.org.uk/our-expertise/cards/chargeback-and-section-75

Tried to the link icon above, but the appropriate window would appear and then disappear immediately.

lr1277

Here is some context for my previous post.

In late 2018/early 2019 I booke a hotel using an agent. I know now, but didn't then.The booking was for September 2019.

Then in July 2019, the agent went bust. On contacting the hotel, they said the booking had never been confirmed as the agent had not paid them the money for the booking.

So I went to my card provider which was the previous John Lewis card, supplied by HSBC. Initially they said I should do a chargeback, but then I found out about the 120 day rule. So I agreed with them to do a S75 claim.

I did this and got my money back about 6 weeks later.

Should chargeback have worked? Maybe. But the agency were not contactable. I have no idea about the state of their bank account.

Also when talking to John Lewis, I had not read the text I had posted above, so did not know chargeback was possbile till the service was provided. But I was worried if the agency had gone belly up, there would have been no money in the account to pay me back.

To be honest there were a few conversations some saying one thing and others saying another. Also when told about the 120 day rule, I did not think it applied because the money was taken from my card back in January even though the stay was not till September.

Should the card provider agreed to my S75 claim even though it was through a 3rd party? When I mentioned this situation before on these boards, I was told I was lucky to get the money back. But the agency's only role was to secure the booking which they did not do, so from one point of view, they did not provide the service for which they had been contracted.

Sorry if this was a bit garbled, but I am trying to remember as many facts as I can.

born_again

Only way chargeback would work is if you have a date when work was due to start in the future, or in the last 120 days) & that is within 540 days from the date of the debit.