Car accident - not at fault but being asked to claim on my own insurance

pkonline

Hello!

Any advice would be welcome.

Insured fully comp my own care, and had accident in early Jan 2023 - other driver at fault, collided into me. My car a right off, sadly!

My insurers said car right off and been trying to get other drivers insurers. I am currently in a couresy vehicle.

Have received the following email from my insurers:

"Good Afternoon

 

The third party insurers are unable to deal with your claim at this time as they aren’t the insurance company who covered the vehicle at the time of the accident, as present we are chasing them for redirection details (as to which insurance will be covering the vehicle)  

 

As the third party insurers cannot currently deal with your claim  and we are awaiting the redirection details, because you are in a credit hire vehicle, we cannot allow you to stay in hire indefinitely accruing these charges at a rate of £46.04 per day, if this claim was to reach court, which it potentially will, a judge would ask AX why we have allowed you to stay in hire accruing these charges. In turn, the judge would ask you, why when you have a fully comprehensive policy and haven’t used it in order to keep the cost of your claim to a minimum. You have a legal obligation to mitigate your losses and it would not look favourably on either of us in court if you refuse to do this.

 

We generally allow third party insurers approximately 30 days to deal with any claim, and if for any reason they can’t (as mentioned above) we would ask you to claim for your vehicle damage via your own policy. We do explain to you in a pre-recorded message at the beginning of the claim that we may have to ask you to do this.

 

By asking you to claim via your own policy does not mean we think you are at fault, neither is it you accepting any form of liability. If we believed you were at fault, we would never have provided you a vehicle in the first place. Neither does it mean we will be collecting our car, you can stay in hire vehicle while your own insurers deal with your damage.

 

Unfortunately, if you refuse to claim via your own policy, AX would have no choice but to collect our hire vehicle, as mentioned above, we cannot allow you to stay in hire when nothing is happening to your own vehicle. We would not be able to recover these charges.

 

We await confirmation your own insurers have been instructed to deal with your vehicle damages."

I genuinely don't know what to do. Am frustrated how long this is taking, and annoyed at the other party. My car was only worth 3-4K but even a similar used replacement would cost much more.

dunstonh

This is the missales/reclaim section. You are better off asking in the insurance section of the board.

DullGreyGuy

pkonline said:

My insurers said car right off and been trying to get other drivers insurers. I am currently in a couresy vehicle.

Have received the following email from my insurers:

Your insurers havent written off your car
You are not in a courtesy car 
You havent had an email from your insurers.

You have employed the services of an accident management company.
Their "independent" engineer has determined your vehicle is a total loss
You are in a credit hire vehicle as their email states

With an accident management company they provide you a hire car on credit and if the vehicle is repairable then provide the repairs on credit too. If the vehicle is beyond economic repair however they forward their engineers report to the third party insurer (TPI) and ask them to total loss you vehicle on its basis. They keep you in hire until 7 days after payment has been made and then attempt to bill the TPI for the hire charges.

They dont know who the TPI is, the details you've given them are saying they werent the insurers at the time of the accident. Your accident management company are now worried that they wont get their hire bill paid and the longer this goes on the more likely that is true. 

Hence to allow the whole thing to move forward they have given you an ultimatum... claim off your own insurance for the total loss of the vehicle in which case hire ends 7 days after payment or surrender the hire car now. Its their car and their losses if the court decide you didnt mitigate your case by claiming off your own insurance so their options are not unreasonable.

Whats best to do depends on what the car was worth to you and whats wrong with the third party insurance details... it could be its just an admin error in which case your insurer gets their money back, claim gets closed non-fault and the hire car is reimbursed. It may be the TP gave you false details and was on cloned plates in which case no one will ever get their money back and its up to you if you'd rather a payout for the car from your insurer and a fault claim or no payout from anyone (in either case the credit hire car company loses their money)

pkonline

DullGreyGuy said:

pkonline said:

My insurers said car right off and been trying to get other drivers insurers. I am currently in a couresy vehicle.

Have received the following email from my insurers:

Your insurers havent written off your car
You are not in a courtesy car 
You havent had an email from your insurers.

You have employed the services of an accident management company.
Their "independent" engineer has determined your vehicle is a total loss
You are in a credit hire vehicle as their email states

With an accident management company they provide you a hire car on credit and if the vehicle is repairable then provide the repairs on credit too. If the vehicle is beyond economic repair however they forward their engineers report to the third party insurer (TPI) and ask them to total loss you vehicle on its basis. They keep you in hire until 7 days after payment has been made and then attempt to bill the TPI for the hire charges.

They dont know who the TPI is, the details you've given them are saying they werent the insurers at the time of the accident. Your accident management company are now worried that they wont get their hire bill paid and the longer this goes on the more likely that is true. 

Hence to allow the whole thing to move forward they have given you an ultimatum... claim off your own insurance for the total loss of the vehicle in which case hire ends 7 days after payment or surrender the hire car now. Its their car and their losses if the court decide you didnt mitigate your case by claiming off your own insurance so their options are not unreasonable.

Whats best to do depends on what the car was worth to you and whats wrong with the third party insurance details... it could be its just an admin error in which case your insurer gets their money back, claim gets closed non-fault and the hire car is reimbursed. It may be the TP gave you false details and was on cloned plates in which case no one will ever get their money back and its up to you if you'd rather a payout for the car from your insurer and a fault claim or no payout from anyone (in either case the credit hire car company loses their money)

Thank you - that is very helpful!

Having emailed this credit hire firm back, they said the delay was due to the other insurers not telling them until now - delay on their side.

It's odd it's taken 5 weeks to just find this out, and seems unfair I'm either left with no car, or being told to claim on my insurance and therefore left out of pocket

DullGreyGuy

pkonline said:

DullGreyGuy said:

pkonline said:

My insurers said car right off and been trying to get other drivers insurers. I am currently in a couresy vehicle.

Have received the following email from my insurers:

Your insurers havent written off your car
You are not in a courtesy car 
You havent had an email from your insurers.

You have employed the services of an accident management company.
Their "independent" engineer has determined your vehicle is a total loss
You are in a credit hire vehicle as their email states

With an accident management company they provide you a hire car on credit and if the vehicle is repairable then provide the repairs on credit too. If the vehicle is beyond economic repair however they forward their engineers report to the third party insurer (TPI) and ask them to total loss you vehicle on its basis. They keep you in hire until 7 days after payment has been made and then attempt to bill the TPI for the hire charges.

They dont know who the TPI is, the details you've given them are saying they werent the insurers at the time of the accident. Your accident management company are now worried that they wont get their hire bill paid and the longer this goes on the more likely that is true. 

Hence to allow the whole thing to move forward they have given you an ultimatum... claim off your own insurance for the total loss of the vehicle in which case hire ends 7 days after payment or surrender the hire car now. Its their car and their losses if the court decide you didnt mitigate your case by claiming off your own insurance so their options are not unreasonable.

Whats best to do depends on what the car was worth to you and whats wrong with the third party insurance details... it could be its just an admin error in which case your insurer gets their money back, claim gets closed non-fault and the hire car is reimbursed. It may be the TP gave you false details and was on cloned plates in which case no one will ever get their money back and its up to you if you'd rather a payout for the car from your insurer and a fault claim or no payout from anyone (in either case the credit hire car company loses their money)

Thank you - that is very helpful!

Having emailed this credit hire firm back, they said the delay was due to the other insurers not telling them until now - delay on their side.

It's odd it's taken 5 weeks to just find this out, and seems unfair I'm either left with no car, or being told to claim on my insurance and therefore left out of pocket

It's not in the hire car company's interest to be on top of chasing them etc, they will send a letter to the generic head office of the insurer and sit back hoping it takes ages. The insurer then has to sort the letter, work out which office should be dealing with it, send it to that office and sit in their backlog to review. As it's a denial of involvement it's not exactly in their interest to push their response through quickly either.

If you google credit hire you will find examples of companies running up £30,000 plus oh hire charges for write offs worth less than £3,000.

How is it unfair? Most insurers offer guaranteed hire and so there is no need to be out of a vehicle if you claim off your insurance and have paid for this enhancement. It's your choice not to use the insurance you have paid for and instead rely on credit terms with accident management companies or deal with the matter yourself. The later is easy enough to do if you have genuine details but exceptionally difficult if the TP gave you false details/on cloned plates

pkonline

DullGreyGuy said:

pkonline said:

DullGreyGuy said:

pkonline said:

My insurers said car right off and been trying to get other drivers insurers. I am currently in a couresy vehicle.

Have received the following email from my insurers:

Your insurers havent written off your car
You are not in a courtesy car 
You havent had an email from your insurers.

You have employed the services of an accident management company.
Their "independent" engineer has determined your vehicle is a total loss
You are in a credit hire vehicle as their email states

With an accident management company they provide you a hire car on credit and if the vehicle is repairable then provide the repairs on credit too. If the vehicle is beyond economic repair however they forward their engineers report to the third party insurer (TPI) and ask them to total loss you vehicle on its basis. They keep you in hire until 7 days after payment has been made and then attempt to bill the TPI for the hire charges.

They dont know who the TPI is, the details you've given them are saying they werent the insurers at the time of the accident. Your accident management company are now worried that they wont get their hire bill paid and the longer this goes on the more likely that is true. 

Hence to allow the whole thing to move forward they have given you an ultimatum... claim off your own insurance for the total loss of the vehicle in which case hire ends 7 days after payment or surrender the hire car now. Its their car and their losses if the court decide you didnt mitigate your case by claiming off your own insurance so their options are not unreasonable.

Whats best to do depends on what the car was worth to you and whats wrong with the third party insurance details... it could be its just an admin error in which case your insurer gets their money back, claim gets closed non-fault and the hire car is reimbursed. It may be the TP gave you false details and was on cloned plates in which case no one will ever get their money back and its up to you if you'd rather a payout for the car from your insurer and a fault claim or no payout from anyone (in either case the credit hire car company loses their money)

Thank you - that is very helpful!

Having emailed this credit hire firm back, they said the delay was due to the other insurers not telling them until now - delay on their side.

It's odd it's taken 5 weeks to just find this out, and seems unfair I'm either left with no car, or being told to claim on my insurance and therefore left out of pocket

It's not in the hire car company's interest to be on top of chasing them etc, they will send a letter to the generic head office of the insurer and sit back hoping it takes ages. The insurer then has to sort the letter, work out which office should be dealing with it, send it to that office and sit in their backlog to review. As it's a denial of involvement it's not exactly in their interest to push their response through quickly either.

If you google credit hire you will find examples of companies running up £30,000 plus oh hire charges for write offs worth less than £3,000.

How is it unfair? Most insurers offer guaranteed hire and so there is no need to be out of a vehicle if you claim off your insurance and have paid for this enhancement. It's your choice not to use the insurance you have paid for and instead rely on credit terms with accident management companies or deal with the matter yourself. The later is easy enough to do if you have genuine details but exceptionally difficult if the TP gave you false details/on cloned plates

Thank you. When we reported the incident to our insurer, this wasn't explained to us. They gave us details of this credit car hire company. 

DullGreyGuy

pkonline said:

DullGreyGuy said:

pkonline said:

DullGreyGuy said:

pkonline said:

My insurers said car right off and been trying to get other drivers insurers. I am currently in a couresy vehicle.

Have received the following email from my insurers:

Your insurers havent written off your car
You are not in a courtesy car 
You havent had an email from your insurers.

You have employed the services of an accident management company.
Their "independent" engineer has determined your vehicle is a total loss
You are in a credit hire vehicle as their email states

With an accident management company they provide you a hire car on credit and if the vehicle is repairable then provide the repairs on credit too. If the vehicle is beyond economic repair however they forward their engineers report to the third party insurer (TPI) and ask them to total loss you vehicle on its basis. They keep you in hire until 7 days after payment has been made and then attempt to bill the TPI for the hire charges.

They dont know who the TPI is, the details you've given them are saying they werent the insurers at the time of the accident. Your accident management company are now worried that they wont get their hire bill paid and the longer this goes on the more likely that is true. 

Hence to allow the whole thing to move forward they have given you an ultimatum... claim off your own insurance for the total loss of the vehicle in which case hire ends 7 days after payment or surrender the hire car now. Its their car and their losses if the court decide you didnt mitigate your case by claiming off your own insurance so their options are not unreasonable.

Whats best to do depends on what the car was worth to you and whats wrong with the third party insurance details... it could be its just an admin error in which case your insurer gets their money back, claim gets closed non-fault and the hire car is reimbursed. It may be the TP gave you false details and was on cloned plates in which case no one will ever get their money back and its up to you if you'd rather a payout for the car from your insurer and a fault claim or no payout from anyone (in either case the credit hire car company loses their money)

Thank you - that is very helpful!

Having emailed this credit hire firm back, they said the delay was due to the other insurers not telling them until now - delay on their side.

It's odd it's taken 5 weeks to just find this out, and seems unfair I'm either left with no car, or being told to claim on my insurance and therefore left out of pocket

It's not in the hire car company's interest to be on top of chasing them etc, they will send a letter to the generic head office of the insurer and sit back hoping it takes ages. The insurer then has to sort the letter, work out which office should be dealing with it, send it to that office and sit in their backlog to review. As it's a denial of involvement it's not exactly in their interest to push their response through quickly either.

If you google credit hire you will find examples of companies running up £30,000 plus oh hire charges for write offs worth less than £3,000.

How is it unfair? Most insurers offer guaranteed hire and so there is no need to be out of a vehicle if you claim off your insurance and have paid for this enhancement. It's your choice not to use the insurance you have paid for and instead rely on credit terms with accident management companies or deal with the matter yourself. The later is easy enough to do if you have genuine details but exceptionally difficult if the TP gave you false details/on cloned plates

Thank you. When we reported the incident to our insurer, this wasn't explained to us. They gave us details of this credit car hire company. 

Credit hire / accident management companies pay very good commissions for referrals and when non-fault claims go wrong (eg TP turns out to have had cloned plates) then its them that carry the cost. Add to this the fact that many customers dont want to risk claiming on their own insurance you have something that works for the insurer and their insured.

Its most commonly done by intermediaries who to be frank have to find other revenue streams from selling Motor as commissions paid will barely cover sales costs but Admiral is the main insurer culprit of doing it. 

pkonline

DullGreyGuy said:

pkonline said:

DullGreyGuy said:

pkonline said:

DullGreyGuy said:

pkonline said:

My insurers said car right off and been trying to get other drivers insurers. I am currently in a couresy vehicle.

Have received the following email from my insurers:

Your insurers havent written off your car
You are not in a courtesy car 
You havent had an email from your insurers.

You have employed the services of an accident management company.
Their "independent" engineer has determined your vehicle is a total loss
You are in a credit hire vehicle as their email states

With an accident management company they provide you a hire car on credit and if the vehicle is repairable then provide the repairs on credit too. If the vehicle is beyond economic repair however they forward their engineers report to the third party insurer (TPI) and ask them to total loss you vehicle on its basis. They keep you in hire until 7 days after payment has been made and then attempt to bill the TPI for the hire charges.

They dont know who the TPI is, the details you've given them are saying they werent the insurers at the time of the accident. Your accident management company are now worried that they wont get their hire bill paid and the longer this goes on the more likely that is true. 

Hence to allow the whole thing to move forward they have given you an ultimatum... claim off your own insurance for the total loss of the vehicle in which case hire ends 7 days after payment or surrender the hire car now. Its their car and their losses if the court decide you didnt mitigate your case by claiming off your own insurance so their options are not unreasonable.

Whats best to do depends on what the car was worth to you and whats wrong with the third party insurance details... it could be its just an admin error in which case your insurer gets their money back, claim gets closed non-fault and the hire car is reimbursed. It may be the TP gave you false details and was on cloned plates in which case no one will ever get their money back and its up to you if you'd rather a payout for the car from your insurer and a fault claim or no payout from anyone (in either case the credit hire car company loses their money)

Thank you - that is very helpful!

Having emailed this credit hire firm back, they said the delay was due to the other insurers not telling them until now - delay on their side.

It's odd it's taken 5 weeks to just find this out, and seems unfair I'm either left with no car, or being told to claim on my insurance and therefore left out of pocket

It's not in the hire car company's interest to be on top of chasing them etc, they will send a letter to the generic head office of the insurer and sit back hoping it takes ages. The insurer then has to sort the letter, work out which office should be dealing with it, send it to that office and sit in their backlog to review. As it's a denial of involvement it's not exactly in their interest to push their response through quickly either.

If you google credit hire you will find examples of companies running up £30,000 plus oh hire charges for write offs worth less than £3,000.

How is it unfair? Most insurers offer guaranteed hire and so there is no need to be out of a vehicle if you claim off your insurance and have paid for this enhancement. It's your choice not to use the insurance you have paid for and instead rely on credit terms with accident management companies or deal with the matter yourself. The later is easy enough to do if you have genuine details but exceptionally difficult if the TP gave you false details/on cloned plates

Thank you. When we reported the incident to our insurer, this wasn't explained to us. They gave us details of this credit car hire company. 

Credit hire / accident management companies pay very good commissions for referrals and when non-fault claims go wrong (eg TP turns out to have had cloned plates) then its them that carry the cost. Add to this the fact that many customers dont want to risk claiming on their own insurance you have something that works for the insurer and their insured.

Its most commonly done by intermediaries who to be frank have to find other revenue streams from selling Motor as commissions paid will barely cover sales costs but Admiral is the main insurer culprit of doing it. 

Thank you for your advice - really appreciate it!