TUI - Manchester airport closed for 2 hours - flight delayed by 24 hours

armith

We were scheduled to fly with TUI from La Palma to Manchester on 19th January. We arrived at the airport and went through security to the departure area. We were then told the flight would be delayed because of snow at Manchester airport. We looked online and saw that the airport had been closed for just over two hours, the incoming flight had been scheduled to take off from Manchester at 06:10 but the airport closed its runways between 06:20 and 08:43. The plane did not take off from Manchester that day - all other flights did take off with short delays. Eventually at 4pm we were told to leave the departure area in La Palma and collect our luggage and TUI sent us off to a hotel. We were then up early next morning to get to the airport where the flight took off at around 11:30am. The pilot and cabin crew explained that they had been unable to get a crew to staff the plane as the delay would have taken them over hours. 

Immediately on landing all the passengers received an email saying that the delay was due to bad weather and to claim off travel insurance. Because the delay was so long it has meant paying for extra parking at the airport and losing a days work. So I filled in the online form on the TUI website with the details of the flight. Two days later they have replied saying they are very sorry they can't pay any compensation because the delay was due to the weather. But the weather incident was only two and a bit hours and the delay ended up at twenty four and a bit hours.

It looks like I am eligible for something like £50 to £70 from my travel insurance - but it doesn't feel right to do this because it seems unfair on the travel insurance company that they have to pick up the cost for what looks like a problem that TUI could have handled much better. Is it worth appealing to TUI somehow? Getting one of these companies that appear in a Google search to chase it? Or just give up and not waste my time because I'll not get anywhere?

Westin

Manchester airport closed both runways that morning due to heavy snow falls.

The delay you experienced was unfortunately weather related.  No compensation is due.  

Glad to hear that TUI however fulfilled their obligations for ‘duty of care’ by providing you with accommodation and food.

eskbanker

I suspect that it won't be difficult for TUI to make the case that at least three hours delay was caused by the weather and that their crewing issues stemmed from that, but nothing to lose by pushing them on this until you get a final response, and deciding whether to engage one of the ambulance-chasing firms from there....

armith

Hmmm, I don't think they could have just left us at the airport overnight (could they?) 

Thank-you for the answers though. I suppose it's just frustration that TUI didn't handle things particularly well. Passengers were phoning the TUI helpline from the airport because we had 6 or so hours of not knowing what was happening only to be told that the flight was leaving very soon or had already left.

Whilst it is a bit irritating to lose a days pay and have to pay extra for parking it was undoubtedly worse for the poor people coming out from Manchester to La Palma - they'd have to have been at Manchester at 4am for two consecutive nights and lost a day of their holiday. And to add insult to injury the weather took a turn for the worse in La Palma when they finally got there.

eskbanker

armith said:

Thank-you for the answers though. I suppose it's just frustration that TUI didn't handle things particularly well. Passengers were phoning the TUI helpline from the airport because we had 6 or so hours of not knowing what was happening only to be told that the flight was leaving very soon or had already left.

Whilst it is a bit irritating to lose a days pay and have to pay extra for parking it was undoubtedly worse for the poor people coming out from Manchester to La Palma - they'd have to have been at Manchester at 4am for two consecutive nights and lost a day of their holiday. And to add insult to injury the weather took a turn for the worse in La Palma when they finally got there.

Even though there probably isn't any compensation mandated by the flight regulations, that doesn't prevent you from raising a complaint about how it was all handled, if poor or misleading communication, etc, aggravated the situation.

CKhalvashi

eskbanker said:

I suspect that it won't be difficult for TUI to make the case that at least three hours delay was caused by the weather and that their crewing issues stemmed from that, but nothing to lose by pushing them on this until you get a final response, and deciding whether to engage one of the ambulance-chasing firms from there....

The reason for delay must be within the control of the airline.

TUI have no control over the weather nor do they have any control over MAG, so this isn't within their control.

The reasonable care provisions were followed with accommodation sorted by the airline (or tour operator), so there's nothing to claim there.

This will be a matter for your insurance should it cover this eventuality, not TUI.

armith said:

Hmmm, I don't think they could have just left us at the airport overnight (could they?) 

Not in Spain, but I've happily spent many a night in airports when arriving on a last wave and self-connecting to a first wave the following morning, the last one was in December (twice, in Katowice and Vienna).

They could realistically have asked you to sort your own accommodation and claim it back as many airlines do, even though this isn't within the exact wording of the legislation. If you don't wish to do this or don't have the funds to do so you do have a right to insist the airline does this for you.

eskbanker

CKhalvashi said:

eskbanker said:

I suspect that it won't be difficult for TUI to make the case that at least three hours delay was caused by the weather and that their crewing issues stemmed from that, but nothing to lose by pushing them on this until you get a final response, and deciding whether to engage one of the ambulance-chasing firms from there....

The reason for delay must be within the control of the airline.

TUI have no control over the weather nor do they have any control over MAG, so this isn't within their control.

The reasonable care provisions were followed with accommodation sorted by the airline (or tour operator), so there's nothing to claim there.

This will be a matter for your insurance should it cover this eventuality, not TUI.

OP's line of argument is that the runway closure was two hours and 23 minutes, whereas the total delay was over 24 hours - clearly the weather was a significant factor but "all other flights did take off with short delays", so it would appear that TUI's crewing issues may have differentiated them from other airlines operating out of MAN that day.  As I said above, I imagine that TUI will be able to fight their corner, but if OP is minded to pursue the matter then it might not be a complete waste of time....

Westin

Problem is whilst the runway closure might be two hours and 23 minutes there will be a back log of flights to clear. 

Weather was the main factor in play that day.  

CKhalvashi

eskbanker said:

CKhalvashi said:

eskbanker said:

I suspect that it won't be difficult for TUI to make the case that at least three hours delay was caused by the weather and that their crewing issues stemmed from that, but nothing to lose by pushing them on this until you get a final response, and deciding whether to engage one of the ambulance-chasing firms from there....

The reason for delay must be within the control of the airline.

TUI have no control over the weather nor do they have any control over MAG, so this isn't within their control.

The reasonable care provisions were followed with accommodation sorted by the airline (or tour operator), so there's nothing to claim there.

This will be a matter for your insurance should it cover this eventuality, not TUI.

OP's line of argument is that the runway closure was two hours and 23 minutes, whereas the total delay was over 24 hours - clearly the weather was a significant factor but "all other flights did take off with short delays", so it would appear that TUI's crewing issues may have differentiated them from other airlines operating out of MAN that day.  As I said above, I imagine that TUI will be able to fight their corner, but if OP is minded to pursue the matter then it might not be a complete waste of time....

Just looking at the airport charts.

There are 11 parking stands at SPC, 10 are active and of those 6 should be A321 compliant (B737 has a slightly smaller wingspan) using charts from December.

The problem that may be found in any argument is in the inter-island flights. There are quite a few that spend 90+ minutes AOG through the day that don't start until after the allocated departure slot time of your flight. I count at some points of the day 4 aircraft parked at SPC just where the next flight is TFN.

There is only so far that services can be delayed in such situations as I'd imagine that with the Madrid flight later on also needing  a larger stand there's a good chance the arrival airport couldn't accommodate you or could accommodate with a delay that would put the crew outside their duty limits.

The cancellation to me on that basis likely will be reasonable but I don't work for TUI so can't personally verify this.

As above, that doesn't stop you complaining about any service you may have received however the legal requirements have likely been met.