EV Charging Network

fred990

JKenH said:

Slow charging could be costliest option for EV drivers

Not looking good is it for those wondering about going EV....not to mention the upfront cost of a decent vehicle!

The AA said today running a petrol car is cheaper. 

Not interested in 'planning' ahead/going for a walk/shopping or a coffee or any of the other suggestions. 

Wait and see seems to be the best approach. 

Petriix

@Belenus the total cost of ownership for buying a new EV has been lower than keeping my 16 year old diesel car on the road, although the very recent depreciation on used EV prices has brought it close to cost-neutral.

@JKenH that's quite a rant which is difficult to respond to (quoting sections is problematic on a phone and I wouldn't want to quote the whole essay)...

It's not my responsibility to stand up for the charging network but statements like "They are fine if you have a second petrol car or never drive beyond the range of your car" are exactly the non-sequiturs I was referring to. Just because the network is patchy doesn't make it unusable.

I don't need my local, single charger sites to be reliable because I have no need to rapid charge anywhere near home. If I did need to set off on a long journey with a low state of charge, 25% of my battery would typically get me 50 miles so, from Norwich, I'm either passing Necton or Barton Mills which both have reliable hubs with many chargers. These are also convenient backup options on my way home from anywhere in the country if I'm falling short.

With a tiny bit of research you can plan a route with reliable charging options. That means checking on the recent comments on ZapMap and Plugshare and looking at how many chargers are at each location you think you might stop at. If you just pull up to the services expecting to charge then you're likely to encounter issues. 

Tesla drivers had issues precisely because they all set off without planning, assuming they would be able to charge at peak times in high-demand locations. I accept that long journeys in a medium range EV require flexibility so I avoid driving at peak times.

Let's be clear: I'm not advocating that everyone should switch to an EV right away. For now it's only recommended for people with reliable access to affordable home or work charging. I'm not thrilled about that situation, but I'm not going to lie to people.

If I had my way there would be a national charging service and destination chargers would be ubiquitous at every location where cars are parked - funded by the big business which profit from people driving and out of general taxation. People would pay their domestic electricity rate wherever they charge and there would be many more rapid chargers. But I'm not in control of government policy and EVs fall into the "green crap" that David Cameron so detested. 

By the time EVs are "forced on us", typical range will be far higher and charging mid-journey will be less necessary.

Yes, I have solar panels. They saved me about £33 off my charging bill in 2022. At current Octopus Go rates, 10k miles would cost anyone around £360. My total this year will be around that figure because I will do some (minimal) rapid charging.

But here's where the assumption that higher peak rates mean higher domestic usage costs is wrong: load shifting just 30% of domestic usage into the off-peak window means it breaks even with a single rate tariff. Any more and you actually save money, and I very much do - thanks in part to having solar panels. My EV tariff saved me hundreds on my home usage last year because I was fixed at 24p peak rate while everyone else was seeing prices spiralling upwards on the price cap.

EVs are not yet for everyone but many of us benefit greatly from making the switch. People need to know the reality for their own specific circumstances.

JKenH

Like most current EV drivers who can charge at home, I don’t need rapid chargers where I live but anyone visiting the area might. To give an idea of just how bad provision can be in some areas (not all), here is a Zap-Map image showing rapid chargers in Scunthorpe (population 81,000). There are just 3 rapids in the town. All are single devices. One is at Lidl, one at Morrisons (currently out of service) and the third, CCS only, is at a Peugeot garage. 

Petriix

JKenH said:

Like most current EV drivers who can charge at home, I don’t need rapid chargers where I live but anyone visiting the area might. To give an idea of just how bad provision can be in some areas (not all), here is a Zap-Map image showing rapid chargers in Scunthorpe (population 81,000). There are just 3 rapids in the town. All are single devices. One is at Lidl, one at Morrisons (currently out of service) and the third, CCS only, is at a Peugeot garage. 

That's obviously not ideal, but you're missing the obvious: you don't need to rapid charge at your destination, you need to rapid charge on your journey.

Suppose I was driving to Scunthorpe and back from Norwich. I'd probably need to stop for a break mid-journey so, in practice, I'd likely stop at one of the Podpoint or Instavolt sites en route. But if I was in a hurry and had a bladder of steel then I'd aim for the Podpoint at Scunthorpe Lidl.

If that was unavailable I could head for the MFG site at Barnetby as a reliable plan B on my way home. Perfectly located with a Starbucks on site, cafés nearby, the Viking Way footpath if you want a walk or even axe throwing at the activity centre next door.

If I needed then a 5 minute zap-and-dash at Necton on my way home would be fine. That's all assuming I couldn't charge at my destination in Scunthorpe while I was there.

That's 5 minutes of research. Obviously it's not ideal that it's necessary to do this, but it avoids the stress and inconvenience of mistakenly assuming that the Geniepoint at Morrisons would be reliable.

born_again

Sea_Shell said:

Out of interest...

What's the current situation regarding access to public chargers exclusively for Blue Badge holders?

Extra wide spaces, close to the facilities etc.

 

Some Gridserve locations have dedicated disabled bays.

Herzlos

JKenH said:

Like most current EV drivers who can charge at home, I don’t need rapid chargers where I live but anyone visiting the area might. To give an idea of just how bad provision can be in some areas (not all), here is a Zap-Map image showing rapid chargers in Scunthorpe (population 81,000). There are just 3 rapids in the town. All are single devices. One is at Lidl, one at Morrisons (currently out of service) and the third, CCS only, is at a Peugeot garage. 

Of course if you zoom out a bit you'll see that you can't get to Scunthorpe from anywhere without passing rapid chargers on route, and there are other slower charges in Scunthorpe.

It also looks at a quick skim to be one of the quieter parts of the zap map.

ComicGeek

But look at a map of the existing petrol stations in that same area, there is obviously a need for people to refuel - there definitely needs to be massive infrastructure improvements to get ready for increased EV numbers. Not everyone is going to be travelling between towns, what about local delivery drivers, carers, driving instructors, taxis, tradesmen etc who might not be passing by out of town charging stations very often but can still clock up the miles each day? 

Not sure why we can't just admit that the charging network is rubbish - we might put up with it while EV driving is saving us money (and there are still relatively small numbers of EVs on the road), but the situation in 7 years is going to be dire if things don't improve. Might be easier then to fly to different parts of the UK than drive, not going to help the zero carbon campaign! Especially as we're not going to have an operating rail system by that point...

NBLondon

ComicGeek said:

Not everyone is going to be travelling between towns, what about local delivery drivers, carers, driving instructors, taxis, tradesmen etc who might not be passing by out of town charging stations very often but can still clock up the miles each day? 

There's probably an assumption that fleets will charge at a depot but you're right - a peripatetic carer, a Hermes Evri driver, a driving instructor could well do over 100 miles a day.  If they can't charge at home each night - planning becomes burdensome; and they may well be running to a tight timescale so long charging stops are not convenient.   Before anyone chunters about new EVs having much longer ranges - these can be self-employed folk on quite low wages - they are looking in the sub £10K range not the over £40K.

Sea_Shell

Another thought...

Charging at home could be tricky in multi car households.

Especially if they don't have chargers at their place of work.

Herzlos

ComicGeek said:

Not sure why we can't just admit that the charging network is rubbish

I don't think anyone has denied the charging network is rubbish?

It's got a long way to go to be able to keep up with the EV adoption rate.

This forum has a real problem with people cherry picking data to make EV's look bad though, for whatever reason.