Starting work and impact on benefits

calcotti

Not loose talk at all. You are still a carer (but not the right kind to help you with the benefit cap).

You’ve obviously had a horrendous 15 months and no doubt still very raw. I hope the work proves successful.

astronautoreo

tomtom256 said:

calcotti said:

How long does that decision normally take? 

Presumably this is a much easier decision for UC to make in a case where someone has obtained employment than in the case of someone who wants to reduce their self employment in order to be a jobseeker. Will OP be expected to take to appointment evidence of the new employment?

Decision made by the end of the hour long appointment and yes if moving to PAYE, just need contract of employment or proof of job offer. If ceasing self-employment, will need evidence to show that, yes not as easy to proev, but should get an answer within the hour, unless further evidence is required.

Thank you for this, that's really helpful to know. I have a contract of employment and a job offer already, all in writing, but the Job Centre are not interested until I actually start work. And then they said they don't need any documents about my pay, as they will get notified by HMRC anyway. I just really hope HMRC are efficient about that notification so it's in time for my assessment periods.

How do people attend this appointment when they have only just started work and can't really take annual leave just yet? I will have to cancel a couple of hours of my self employed work to do this. And I will only have a tight window in office hours that I could be available, as apart from that window I'm either in my employed role or I'm taking my kids to their weekly hospital appointments 

astronautoreo

calcotti said:

Not loose talk at all. You are still a carer (but not the right kind to help you with the benefit cap).

You’ve obviously had a horrendous 15 months and no doubt still very raw. I hope the work proves successful.

Thank you for your kind and encouraging words. It has indeed been tough.  The job is going to be a real turning point for my family and our future. 

Spoonie_Turtle

astronautoreo said:

Spoonie_Turtle said:

What are your caring responsibilities?  If you get the carer element you should be exempt from the cap.

I probably used the term more loosely than I should have as I am aware that caring has a specific meaning in the context of Benefits- sorry for this. I'm not eligible for any extra payments in this regard. I used the term to refer to me being a single parent with 3 children aged 8-12, and having experienced the loss of my husband 15 months ago when he passed away. Each of my children have 121 bereavement therapy in the local hospital and I spend about 7.5 hours in total each week taking them there, waiting there and bringing them home/back to school. 

Ah, understood.  I'm sorry for your loss, and sorry that you're having to deal with this complexity on top of everything else.

From another of your posts out sounds like you've worked out how to manage the earnings though, so I'm glad there seems to be a way for you to work it and not be penalised for moving into employment.

tomtom256

astronautoreo said:

Thank you for this, that's really helpful to know. I have a contract of employment and a job offer already, all in writing, but the Job Centre are not interested until I actually start work. And then they said they don't need any documents about my pay, as they will get notified by HMRC anyway. I just really hope HMRC are efficient about that notification so it's in time for my assessment periods.

How do people attend this appointment when they have only just started work and can't really take annual leave just yet? I will have to cancel a couple of hours of my self employed work to do this. And I will only have a tight window in office hours that I could be available, as apart from that window I'm either in my employed role or I'm taking my kids to their weekly hospital appointments 

Some jobcentres are open on a Saturday, which may help, if you have one nearby that does Saturday working. If you have a contract etc, it should literally take about 10 minutes, depending on how many hours you are contracted for and if you are doing PAYE for more hours then your self-employment, self-employment would in theory no longer be your main employment, so you wouldn't be deemed to be gainfully self-employed for UC purposes and the MIF should be removed if applicable.

calcotti

tomtom256 said:

astronautoreo said:

Thank you for this, that's really helpful to know. I have a contract of employment and a job offer already, all in writing, but the Job Centre are not interested until I actually start work. And then they said they don't need any documents about my pay, as they will get notified by HMRC anyway. I just really hope HMRC are efficient about that notification so it's in time for my assessment periods.

How do people attend this appointment when they have only just started work and can't really take annual leave just yet? I will have to cancel a couple of hours of my self employed work to do this. And I will only have a tight window in office hours that I could be available, as apart from that window I'm either in my employed role or I'm taking my kids to their weekly hospital appointments 

Some jobcentres are open on a Saturday, which may help, if you have one nearby that does Saturday working. If you have a contract etc, it should literally take about 10 minutes, depending on how many hours you are contracted for and if you are doing PAYE for more hours then your self-employment, self-employment would in theory no longer be your main employment, so you wouldn't be deemed to be gainfully self-employed for UC purposes and the MIF should be removed if applicable.

From what OP stated previously they have never been treated as gainfully employed.

astronautoreo said:

I was never classified as 'gainfully self employed' unfortunately. They said I needed to be earning significantly more. 

I assume they will need to continue to report self employment income and expenditure (even if nil) until such time as any outstanding invoices have been paid and at that point OP can ask Job Centre to drop the requirement to report. (Alternatively if they may still occasionally do dome self employment that should just let it continue and report each month even if nil.)

OP, there may be some confusion about whether or not you are treated as 'gainfully' employed for UC. Under UC you can be treated as 'gainfully' employed but not treated as earning enough. If that is the case after 12 months you would have the Minimum Income Floor applied which mans that you retreated as earning a certain amount even if actually earning less. Have UC been requiring you to look for employment, if so they have you as a jobseeker. If you haven't been asked to look for employment then they probably have you down as gainfully self employed.

astronautoreo

@tomtom256 I didn't know about Saturday opening, that's great to know- thank you.

Trying a tag for the first time rather than a quote, hoping it works !

astronautoreo

@calcotti I was told in August 2022 in my assessment that I am not gainfully self employed. I had understood I needed to be earning above £1000 to be treated as such (that is what they told me). In August 2022 my self employed earnings were around £150-£200pm so although I could show I could increase my earnings they said I had to be treated as 'looking for employment' and have been required to have fortnightly appointments since. 

From September I was able to increase my earnings but I had understood I still wouldn't be classed as gainfully self employed so I never asked for a re-assessment of this. Instead, I had already decided I wanted to seek employment instead and worked really hard to look for a job.

Going forward I will be reporting a small amount of self employed income each month but most of my earnings will be from employment. 

I can't wait to be out of the fortnightly appointments. Since I was offered the job in late November, I have still had to go every 2 weeks and have the same conversation.

'Are you looking for a job?'
'No, because I have got a job, and I'm waiting to start. In the meantime I am continuing to work self employed'
'OK, come back in two weeks'

  

astronautoreo

btw, I quote the £1000 as a rough figure, i can't remember the precise amount

calcotti

astronautoreo said:

@calcotti I was told in August 2022 in my assessment that I am not gainfully self employed. ..

That's clear. 
Being employed will undoubtedly make life easier in terms of financial stability and not having to do job search with UC (at the expense of some flexibility managing work and family life afforded by self employment).
Good luck.