standing charges

MikeJXE

diystarter7 said:

Hi

Standing charges vary area to area and reasons behind this

Thanks
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-60878314

diystarter7 said:

Hi

Standing charges vary area to area and reasons behind this

Thanks
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-60878314

Interesting 

So it's not so much an increase in infrastructure costs it's more of a tax to pay for companies that have gone bust

The companies that went bust I assume had money in the bank and spent some that didn't  belonged to them it belonged to their customers

They got it by taking excess direct debits and in some cases not enough  just like is happening now 

I had a big row with OVO about my unjustified DD increase that has put me over £250 in credit paying £125 a month instead of what I'm using £90 a month 

Thank goodness I leave them next month and have done a home move and got my DD for next month down to £5 yes five pounds finally admitting they were taking too much. 

diystarter7

Brie said:

The problem is that we see the standing charge separate from the use charge.  That's what makes it different from most other things we purchase.  Yes, everything that is purchased has a charge for infrastructure/delivery/etc as well as the actual product but we just don't notice as it's built into the cost.  

So if I go to Tescos to buy a tin of beans it will cost £1 (or whatever) and in that is the cost of the beans, the tin and getting it to the shop and on the shelf and staff to dust around it and take my money when I want to buy a tin of beans.  There's more infrastructure attached the more beans I buy.  But if I'm on a reduced income and can't afford a tin of beans every day I can cut my use and therefore pay for less infrastructure.  If I just buy a tin every other day rather than every day my "standing charges" are also reduced by 1 half.  

Hi

You could say vehicle road tax was a standing charge, ie to park on a public road even if you never drive it

Thanks

MikeJXE

diystarter7 said:

Brie said:

The problem is that we see the standing charge separate from the use charge.  That's what makes it different from most other things we purchase.  Yes, everything that is purchased has a charge for infrastructure/delivery/etc as well as the actual product but we just don't notice as it's built into the cost.  

So if I go to Tescos to buy a tin of beans it will cost £1 (or whatever) and in that is the cost of the beans, the tin and getting it to the shop and on the shelf and staff to dust around it and take my money when I want to buy a tin of beans.  There's more infrastructure attached the more beans I buy.  But if I'm on a reduced income and can't afford a tin of beans every day I can cut my use and therefore pay for less infrastructure.  If I just buy a tin every other day rather than every day my "standing charges" are also reduced by 1 half.  

Hi

You could say vehicle road tax was a standing charge, ie to park on a public road even if you never drive it

Thanks

No you couldn't say that it would be misleading the public because everyone knows it's a tax

Like I said energy standing charge is more a tax but it's not admitted as such 

diystarter7

MikeJXE said:

diystarter7 said:

Brie said:

The problem is that we see the standing charge separate from the use charge.  That's what makes it different from most other things we purchase.  Yes, everything that is purchased has a charge for infrastructure/delivery/etc as well as the actual product but we just don't notice as it's built into the cost.  

So if I go to Tescos to buy a tin of beans it will cost £1 (or whatever) and in that is the cost of the beans, the tin and getting it to the shop and on the shelf and staff to dust around it and take my money when I want to buy a tin of beans.  There's more infrastructure attached the more beans I buy.  But if I'm on a reduced income and can't afford a tin of beans every day I can cut my use and therefore pay for less infrastructure.  If I just buy a tin every other day rather than every day my "standing charges" are also reduced by 1 half.  

Hi

You could say vehicle road tax was a standing charge, ie to park on a public road even if you never drive it

Thanks

No you couldn't say that it would be misleading the public because everyone knows it's a tax

Like I said energy standing charge is more a tax but it's not admitted as such 

Who would be "misleading the public" I did say it was a "tax" in my post or did you not see that?
I was merely implying I'm not sure what your point is as Im a bit confused.
Thanks



I

Ectophile

Brie said:

The problem is that we see the standing charge separate from the use charge.  That's what makes it different from most other things we purchase.  Yes, everything that is purchased has a charge for infrastructure/delivery/etc as well as the actual product but we just don't notice as it's built into the cost.  

So if I go to Tescos to buy a tin of beans it will cost £1 (or whatever) and in that is the cost of the beans, the tin and getting it to the shop and on the shelf and staff to dust around it and take my money when I want to buy a tin of beans.  There's more infrastructure attached the more beans I buy.  But if I'm on a reduced income and can't afford a tin of beans every day I can cut my use and therefore pay for less infrastructure.  If I just buy a tin every other day rather than every day my "standing charges" are also reduced by 1 half.  

But if you want Tesco to deliver the beans to you, that's £3.99 a month.  Or £6.99 if you want your beans delivered the same day.

diystarter7

MikeJXE said:

diystarter7 said:

Hi

Standing charges vary area to area and reasons behind this

Thanks
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-60878314

diystarter7 said:

Hi

Standing charges vary area to area and reasons behind this

Thanks
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-60878314

Interesting 

So it's not so much an increase in infrastructure costs it's more of a tax to pay for companies that have gone bust

The companies that went bust I assume had money in the bank and spent some that didn't  belonged to them it belonged to their customers

They got it by taking excess direct debits and in some cases not enough  just like is happening now 

I had a big row with OVO about my unjustified DD increase that has put me over £250 in credit paying £125 a month instead of what I'm using £90 a month 

Thank goodness I leave them next month and have done a home move and got my DD for next month down to £5 yes five pounds finally admitting they were taking too much. 

TBH, until I read the BBC link I wrongly thought the standing charges were the sames in England - just shows the tricks of making money.

bagand96

km1500 said:

You don't pay a standing charge plus pence-per-litre to fill up you car, and I am sure Shell have infrastructure charges too.

Ditto Tesco for food as posted above.

It seems like energy is unique in charging you this way. Oh sooy, landlines have 'line rental' - luckily mobiles came along so you just pay per call (or buy a bundle, or pay for a  monthly bundle)

But Shell don't install and maintain a fuel pipeline into your property.  I suppose you could ask them to install one but they might want paying for it's installation and maintenance costs.

Tesco will supply their groceries to your front door, but they levy a charge for that.

There were tariffs some years ago that didn't have standing charges, the first few units per day were charged at an increased rate.  These were stopped, partly because it was viewed customers found them too confusing or unfair. Part of the problem when dealing with so many customers is that none of us are the same and what some people are happy with others won't be.  There will never be an ideal that everyone agrees on.  As seen on this board, plenty of low users will always feel standing charges are unfair, others won't mind so much or even care, high users probably don't care at all.

markin

If coal delivery is £10 and you only buy 1 bag thats a very costly bag vs buying 10 bags, You could cancel it and go pick it up yourself, You can swap coal for LPG or Petrol for cooking or a generator as you see fit.

Spoonie_Turtle

markin said:

If coal delivery is £10 and you only buy 1 bag thats a very costly bag vs buying 10 bags, You could cancel it and go pick it up yourself, You can swap coal for LPG or Petrol for cooking or a generator as you see fit.

Yes but a) only if the supplier would let you do that, and you have to pay the fuel for the journey there anyway, and b) it's a false analogy, where and how are you storing your bulk-bought mains gas and electricity?  [Unless you have a battery you can charge, of course, but that by itself costs the equivalent of probably a couple of decades of standing charge and you're still not buying it in bulk, you're buying a unit at a time as you use it to charge the battery.]  It's effectively on tap; utilities are nothing like physical goods. 

markin

You store in in LNG bottles/tanks, Or petrol cans/tanks, or the like the member that has stored it as £200 on a top up meter and £200 on the key.