Rights regarding change of package holiday/flights

dtsn

@eskbanker Thanks, I've said exactly that verbatim with the link to the corresponding regulations.

They are being quite responsive at the moment so I will let you know the outcome.

bagand96

dtsn said:

Westin said:

Are you sure no one gave approval to TUI to make the change from the TUI to BA flights?  It seems really strange that TUI would go ahead and buy seats on a schedule airline without lead passenger approval.

I am not sure why a flight/carrier change on the same dates would mean the hotel element was lost. Assume this was an onsite WDW hotel. Can you explain more?

Sorry, @Westin  @bagand96 @eskbanker thanks for replying and my delay. I thought I got email notifications but I didn't

To clarify the situation. TUI has amended and moved our holiday without consent to the only available flight they have on the 17th of October, instead of the 20th. I don't believe this was a suggestion because the new flights/package deal can be seen in both the TUI app and the My Disney Experience app.

When challenged they offered us BA flights for the same day but had some problems regarding the offer for these dates.

As an update, they now say they can give us our holiday back but are unwilling to pay the extra £500 per person it would cost them.

They have now giving us 3 choices:
- Keep the 17th holiday as the 'like for like'
- Cancel and get a full refund
- Pay an extra £500 per person to get our original holiday back but via BA.

Here's the relevant paragraph from the TUI T&C's for TUI Packages:

If We Change Your Holiday

We aim to give you what we promise but, as we plan our holidays a long time in advance, sometimes things can change. We can make a change at any time but will let you know before your holiday if there’s time.

Flight times given are for guidance only – your actual times will be shown on your e-ticket. Check that carefully when you receive it. Aircraft type can change and some facilities such as entertainment or advertised seat pitch may not be available. If we can’t provide a seat option, we’ll refund the price you paid for that option.

Occasionally, we may have to make a major change to your holiday such as a change of destination, a change of accommodation to a lower category, a change in flight time by more than 12 hours or a change of UK departure airport. A change in flight time that we need to make within 24 hours before you are due to fly is not a major change unless the time changes by more than 24 hours.

If we tell you about a major change after you book your holiday, you can accept the new arrangements offered by us; or accept a replacement holiday from us of the same or similar standard and price at the date of the change (we’ll always refund the difference in price if the replacement holiday is a lower price at the date of the change), if we are able to offer you one; or cancel your holiday with us and receive a full refund.

If we make a major change, and you choose to cancel your holiday and receive a full refund, we’ll pay the compensation shown below, unless the change is because of an event beyond our control. Any compensation payable is based upon how many days before your holiday departure we tell you about a major change. We’ll pay 50% of the compensation for each person who paid a child price. No compensation will be paid for free child places.

How long before your holiday we tell you about a major change	Compensation per person
84 days or more	0
83 - 29 days	£25
28 - 15 days	£35
14 - 8 days	£50
7 - 0 days	£100

It looks to me like TUI are acting within their T&C's, that you agreed to when booking.  They've had to make a major change to your holiday, they've offered new arrangements (alternative date), they've offered an alternative holiday at the price at the date of change (£500 extra for the BA flights on original date), and failing that they're offering you a full refund.

That said it's good TUI are being responsive and I wish you luck with pushing them.  Regulations like the PTRs are often down to interpretation but it's always worth asking as you may get what you want!

eskbanker

TUI Ts & Cs can't override statutory consumer rights though, so the PTRs take precedence over them, but in any case they're clearly worded to echo the 'significant change' provisions within the PTRs, so I'd stand by my view that TUI didn't have to make a significant/major change (see the paragraph above the bolded wording in the extract), in that they have access to alternative flights that would allow the holiday to proceed without changing any of the main characteristics as defined in PTR Schedule 1.

bagand96

eskbanker said:

TUI Ts & Cs can't override statutory consumer rights though, so the PTRs take precedence over them, but in any case they're clearly worded to echo the 'significant change' provisions within the PTRs, so I'd stand by my view that TUI didn't have to make a significant/major change (see the paragraph above the bolded wording in the extract), in that they have access to alternative flights that would allow the holiday to proceed without changing any of the main characteristics as defined in PTR Schedule 1.

I agree that the TUI's (or anyone else's) T&C's can't override statutory rights.  I'd just be surprised if they did as written.  TUI are the biggest tour operator in the country and those terms around cancellation are fairly standard, the other biggest tour operator have very similar terms.  It's not unheard of for flight schedules to change and original dates not be available and it would usually be treated in this manner.

I do see your point about whether TUI have to make a change, given alternative flights are available.  However their packages are generally built around flights on their own airline and with those flights no longer available it would be unusual for them to book flights ad-hoc on another airline (again pretty standard in the industry for the integrated tour operators)

I'm not disagreeing with you, just appears that what's happening here is pretty standard stuff within the industry.  Although standard practices may not be fully conversant with regulations - the laws/regulations are only as good as the next court case - and I happily admit I'm no lawyer!

dtsn

Just heard back from TUI. They are saying there is nothing they can do and we must either accept the new holiday or cancel. We have had to cancel.

I will be pursuing their complaints department and then ABTA regarding this.

As I was telling the people at TUI is that it just doesn't seem fair that we would be at that much of a disadvantage from a no-fault change to our holiday. I don't think we will be successful, but it'll be worth a try.

eskbanker

bagand96 said:

I'm not disagreeing with you, just appears that what's happening here is pretty standard stuff within the industry.  Although standard practices may not be fully conversant with regulations - the laws/regulations are only as good as the next court case - and I happily admit I'm no lawyer!

Likewise I'm not a lawyer, but it just seemed to be that there was an angle that supported OP here, although am sure you're right that TUI's response isn't unusual!

OP - sorry to hear that they've stopped playing ball, let us know how you get on with complaints....

bagand96

dtsn said:

Just heard back from TUI. They are saying there is nothing they can do and we must either accept the new holiday or cancel. We have had to cancel.

I will be pursuing their complaints department and then ABTA regarding this.

As I was telling the people at TUI is that it just doesn't seem fair that we would be at that much of a disadvantage from a no-fault change to our holiday. I don't think we will be successful, but it'll be worth a try.

Not sure if it will be any help or not, but if the BA flight suits then it might be worth looking at BA Holidays as they can often work out quite reasonable.  Not sure if they offer similar incentives with WDW hotels as you had from TUI though.  Virgin will also be worth a look.

dtsn

bagand96 said:

dtsn said:

Just heard back from TUI. They are saying there is nothing they can do and we must either accept the new holiday or cancel. We have had to cancel.

I will be pursuing their complaints department and then ABTA regarding this.

As I was telling the people at TUI is that it just doesn't seem fair that we would be at that much of a disadvantage from a no-fault change to our holiday. I don't think we will be successful, but it'll be worth a try.

Not sure if it will be any help or not, but if the BA flight suits then it might be worth looking at BA Holidays as they can often work out quite reasonable.  Not sure if they offer similar incentives with WDW hotels as you had from TUI though.  Virgin will also be worth a look.

The problem is we booked with a special offer worth ~£1000 per family (free dinning credit + gift card). This was a time-based offer from Disney which we cannot get now.

We will most likely wait to go in Feb/next year and never book a holiday with TUI again.

All the other airlines operate multiple flights per day so it's rare they would cancel both flights on a day.