Mis-sold tickets for gig online - how likely is a claim?

MT1975

Hi Everyone,

I bought some concert tickets online before Xmas for a gig in Finland. I used a site called Gigsberg that looked almost identical (to me anyway) to the usual sellers. Took me through the pic of the venue, let me choose section etc.
When I paid, I got no confirmation, so I dug a little. Turns out that they are rated as 'potential scam site' as they are actually a reseller of tickets listed by individuals.

Down in the Ts and Cs (that I admit I didn't carefully read every line of unfortunately) they say "legitimacy of tickets is not guaranteed". So I contacted them & received a response of "don't worry your purchase is guaranteed". When I pressed them on this...

• They couldn't say on what basis it was "guaranteed" or what the "guarantee" was.
• They said tickets were "verified" but then I asked to be shown verification they then stated "we do not yet have the tickets" and "we do not tell customers how we verify".
• They even said that "if you are not happy then simply list your tickets for resale on here" ! To which I responded that in doing so I'd be listing something that I had no idea of existence or legitimacy.
• When I questioned this they stopped responding.

They have now taken payment & I have no conformation email or anything from them.

I have reported this as disputed to Barclaycard, who were most helpful on the phone & did seem to agree that 1) it potentially wasn't made clear enough at point of purchase what the actual basis of sale was and 2) that their refusal to provide any reassuring/clarifying info was a concern.

Reading some reviews online, there are enough mentions of them having sold on fake tickets for this to look like fact vs rumour.

I completed an online claim form for BC and attached screenshots of buying process (where it looks identical to Ticketmaster etc) and then unhelpful correspondance.

Any idea what chance of success I have here? 

(and before anyone says it.....yes, lesson learned!!!)

eskbanker

If you paid for tickets and you don't receive them then that should be a valid chargeback, but it's not uncommon for ticket sellers not to release tickets until close to an event, so at this stage they probably haven't breached the contract - is there anything specified about delivery timescales?

MT1975

Nothing re timescales.

But how can they be selling tickets as "verified" that they haven't seen? Problem is that gig is in Helsinki - had I known that this was 1) a reseller and 2) not guaranteed, then no way I'd have bought them. I'll be travelling to Finland potentially in the hope that the tickets exist & are legit. I'm not sure if there is even a way to check legitimacy without actually trying to walk into the venue...

eskbanker

Yes, I understand your concerns, but was simply differentiating between two separate questions, i.e. does this all sound dodgy, and is it an issue that a card provider is responsible for resolving?  The answer to the first would certainly seem to be 'yes' but that doesn't necessarily mean that the card provider is on the hook, unless it qualifies for chargeback protection within the finite list of reasons associated with that scheme, such as non-delivery.

Alderbank

MT1975 said:

Hi Everyone,

I bought some concert tickets online before Xmas for a gig in Finland. I used a site called Gigsberg that looked almost identical (to me anyway) to the usual sellers. Took me through the pic of the venue, let me choose section etc.
When I paid, I got no confirmation, so I dug a little. Turns out that they are rated as 'potential scam site' as they are actually a reseller of tickets listed by individuals.

Down in the Ts and Cs (that I admit I didn't carefully read every line of unfortunately) they say "legitimacy of tickets is not guaranteed". So I contacted them & received a response of "don't worry your purchase is guaranteed". When I pressed them on this...

• They couldn't say on what basis it was "guaranteed" or what the "guarantee" was.
• They said tickets were "verified" but then I asked to be shown verification they then stated "we do not yet have the tickets" and "we do not tell customers how we verify".
• They even said that "if you are not happy then simply list your tickets for resale on here" ! To which I responded that in doing so I'd be listing something that I had no idea of existence or legitimacy.
• When I questioned this they stopped responding.

They have now taken payment & I have no conformation email or anything from them.

I have reported this as disputed to Barclaycard, who were most helpful on the phone & did seem to agree that 1) it potentially wasn't made clear enough at point of purchase what the actual basis of sale was and 2) that their refusal to provide any reassuring/clarifying info was a concern.

Reading some reviews online, there are enough mentions of them having sold on fake tickets for this to look like fact vs rumour.

I completed an online claim form for BC and attached screenshots of buying process (where it looks identical to Ticketmaster etc) and then unhelpful correspondance.

Any idea what chance of success I have here? 

(and before anyone says it.....yes, lesson learned!!!)

Gigsberg are brokers of tickets. People with tickets to sell register with them. When you tell Gigsberg you wish to buy, they send your address and payment (minus their cut) to a suitable seller. The seller should then sent you the tickets.

Gigsberg never handle or see the tickets, hence they can't guarantee their legitimacy. Gigsberg's guarantee is that if you don't receive tickets as promised by the seller they will send you alternatives from another seller and if tickets turn out to be forgeries (and you make your claim within two days of being refused entry) they will give a full refund of what you paid.

Because they are ticket brokers you could not make a s75 claim even if each ticket cost more than £100, as BarclayCard no doubt told you.

If after buying you decide you will not be able to use tickets you have bought, Gigsberg do not seem to offer any cancellation service as such. As they have told you, they will set you up as a seller so you could attempt to sell on your tickets. You decide the price to offer them at. If it is a popular gig you might resell for more than you paid. If you have to sell at a loss or can't sell at all, you could claim from your travel insurance if the reason for cancellation is appropriate.

You question is 'what chance of success have I here?'
I presume you mean 'what chance do I have of seeing the gig I have paid for?'

I think the chance of receiving tickets is quite good. However if they turn out to be fake you will only find out at the venue when you are refused admission. Gigsberg will refund ticket costs but not travel or accommodation 

born_again

I would say that they will look at it & then say. Can not do anything till the day after the event.

Can we take it that you live in the UK? So that would mean that your tickets should be sent to your UK address, which are often only sent out week before event to original purchaser.? Then just how soon before the event are you travelling to Finland?

Cancelling them is not going to help, may even make it harder to get a refund.

https://www.gigsberg.co.uk/
But how obvious is this... right at top of screen just under their logo.

Gigsberg is a secondary ticket marketplace. All tickets are guaranteed and secure. Prices are set by sellers and may be above or below face value.

Alderbank

MT1975 said:

Nothing re timescales.

But how can they be selling tickets as "verified" that they haven't seen? Problem is that gig is in Helsinki - had I known that this was 1) a reseller and 2) not guaranteed, then no way I'd have bought them. I'll be travelling to Finland potentially in the hope that the tickets exist & are legit. I'm not sure if there is even a way to check legitimacy without actually trying to walk into the venue...

They don't sell the tickets as 'verified'. They point out that they don't even see your tickets so they can't guarantee they are genuine. Their 'guarantee' is that if you are refused entry they will refund you.

You say 'How could I have known this was a reseller?'
You could have known by reading the banner at the top of every page of their website which says 'Gigsberg is a secondary ticket marketplace.' 

MT1975

Alderbank said:

MT1975 said:

Nothing re timescales.

But how can they be selling tickets as "verified" that they haven't seen? Problem is that gig is in Helsinki - had I known that this was 1) a reseller and 2) not guaranteed, then no way I'd have bought them. I'll be travelling to Finland potentially in the hope that the tickets exist & are legit. I'm not sure if there is even a way to check legitimacy without actually trying to walk into the venue...

They don't sell the tickets as 'verified'. They point out that they don't even see your tickets so they can't guarantee they are genuine. Their 'guarantee' is that if you are refused entry they will refund you.

You say 'How could I have known this was a reseller?'
You could have known by reading the banner at the top of every page of their website which says 'Gigsberg is a secondary ticket marketplace.' 

Not quite correct....

They do sell tickets as "verified". See this from their helpdesk that I have in email...

"We can assure you that all the tickets on our website have been fully verified before being made available for purchase, and sellers do not receive payment until after the event takes place to guarantee the tickets are for single use of the purchaser only."

...if they claim this, then how come there is any chance of a ticket being fake & only found at entry? Its clearly !!!!!!.

but then when I asked how they were verified...

"Unfortunately, hat's not something we are allowed to tell customers. We hope you understand that."


Yes I see that message on first page re marketplace & I admit I missed it. But you click past that onto the specific event pages & it is not there, nor are there any indications that it is the case - so you are way off the mark there.

You click on sections of the stadium & get indications like "6 tickets left" etc. There are even seat numbers displayed...which disappear when you have parted with your money.

The site says "e-ticket" and implies you will get a download of the ticket. Nowhere in that process does it mention a seller.

MT1975

born_again said:

I would say that they will look at it & then say. Can not do anything till the day after the event.

Can we take it that you live in the UK? So that would mean that your tickets should be sent to your UK address, which are often only sent out week before event to original purchaser.? Then just how soon before the event are you travelling to Finland?

Cancelling them is not going to help, may even make it harder to get a refund.


But how obvious is this... right at top of screen just under their logo.

Gigsberg is a secondary ticket marketplace. All tickets are guaranteed and secure. Prices are set by sellers and may be above or below face value.

Yes I think this is most likely - only a case after the event unfortunately.

Leaves me with a choice now...take chance, or buy tickets that are definitely not fake...?

Alderbank

You didn't say they were e-tickets so I assumed they were what they describe as 'hard copy' tickets. Hard copy tickets are sent directly to the buyer.

For E-Tickets they say to sellers:

You will upload the E-Tickets to Gigsberg's Website when you list them for sale.

If you do not possess the Ticket when listing the Ticket on the Website, you must upload a proof of your ownership of the Ticket and the right to receive the Ticket, that shall be verified by Gigsberg and listing of such Ticket will be subject to Gigsberg's confirmation before it can be uploaded on the Website.

It is reasonable that they won't reveal to you exactly how they verify e-tickets because that information could be used to cheat the system.

They say: Gigsberg does not control and cannot guarantee the availability, quality and/or legality of the Tickets

Gigsberg's guarantee is done by escrow.
They tell sellers:
When the Tickets have been sold, your payment will be released within fourteen (14) business days after the event takes place and the receipt of the Buyer’s confirmation that the Ticket is valid and authentic, all in accordance with the Terms.

So after the gig expect an email from Gigsberg saying they hoped you enjoyed the event and asking you to confirm that you had no problems gaining access.

You ask how there is any chance of a ticket being fake if they verify them?

You are not very streetwise are you? There is that chance because in this digital world there are naughty but clever boys who are always trying to defeat any security systems.

I'm sorry that you did not realise that Gigsberg is a reseller site. I looked at lots of their pages and they all had the same header. As well as the page headers there are numerous references to buyers and sellers of tickets. They also explain that the nature of their business is enabling people to sell their tickets to others who want to buy them.

Alderbank

MT1975 said:

born_again said:

I would say that they will look at it & then say. Can not do anything till the day after the event.

Can we take it that you live in the UK? So that would mean that your tickets should be sent to your UK address, which are often only sent out week before event to original purchaser.? Then just how soon before the event are you travelling to Finland?

Cancelling them is not going to help, may even make it harder to get a refund.


But how obvious is this... right at top of screen just under their logo.

Gigsberg is a secondary ticket marketplace. All tickets are guaranteed and secure. Prices are set by sellers and may be above or below face value.

Yes I think this is most likely - only a case after the event unfortunately.

Leaves me with a choice now...take chance, or buy tickets that are definitely not fake...?

I do sympathise with you and I appreciate your anxiety about the tickets will only get worse, spoiling what should be your enjoyment of looking forward to the show and your trip.
Have you actually bought the tickets? If so, could you just resell them on the same site, perhaps asking €5 less than you paid?