Buying house (with solar panels)

diystarter7

Spies said:

The fact is it's going to cost him a lot to have them removed and then reinstalled at another property so I don't think he is seriously considering this, if he is, he needs to have them professionally removed and to show evidence as such.

If he suggests you keep them and he keeps the FIT, you could then re-register them for metered export and he would no longer get FIT.

Never have I considered that solar panels already on a house would not be part of the sale.

If the seller does take them, need to be aware of any roof damge that may only first sfow up in heavy rain

you made great points!

macman

Your vendor is an idiot. They're bolted to the roof structure, and as such a permanent fitting and fixture-they should never be excluded from the house price.
Just say he's welcome to remove them and pay for the cost of the scaffolding, removal, transport and roof repairs...
If you are to inherit them then you'll need him to contact the FIT's supplier and inform the of the change of ownership. 
None of this should cost you anything.

ProDave

JuzaMum said:

I wouldn't want them taking the panels due to potential for damage to the roof on removal. I wouldn't want to pay extra for them either. If I viewed a house with panels I would expect the panels to be included as fixtures and fittings unless stated otherwise.

So an alternative attack would be to say you are not prepared to pay for them and you want the vendor to remove them AND make good any damage to the roof in doing so.  By the time he has costed the scaffold and labour to do that and the true value of second hand panels, he will realise it is easier and cheaper to just leave them.

mi-key

That is quite cheeky ! It's a bit like selling a house and then telling the buyer the roof tiles are extra and you'll take them with you!  It is a lot of work to remove them, repair any beams, replace tiles etc... It would probably cost him more than he could just buy the panels second hand.

I would tell him you don't really want them, but make him an offer for a few thousand to save him the hassle and cost of removing and see what he says

Woolsery

macman said:

Your vendor is an idiot.
If you are to inherit them then you'll need him to contact the FIT's supplier and inform the of the change of ownership.

The vendor won't be such an idiot they'll think the FIT isn't worth some outlay from the OP. It's not as if they can get the same FIT deal now. And as you say, the OP will need the vendor's cooperation to receive it.

All other things being equal, the advantage is with the purchasers just now, so playing hard ball may well work, but personally I'd not sour a deal for the sake of a few thousand. £8.5k way too high though.

MoreProbs

Your vendor can do what they want. But they need to understand there are consequences.

They could state they are going to take the kitchen with them - a 'fixture and fitting' - and that's fine, as long as it's made clear in the sale. So, if they really want the panels, they can take them as long as this is made clear in the sale agreement.

Like others, I suspect the vendor originally had great plans to take the panels and the FIT with them. Then they found out that their system would now be considered 'second-user', so would not quality for FIT. Seriously miffed, they are now looking at ways of recouping their outlay. The problem with PV systems is that they are very emotive, and owners set more fiscal store by them than they actually deserve. They set out for a long-term return on their investment, and cannot abide the thought that this might not happen. If they lost £10k on the value of their house, that would mean less to them in comparison.

I believe there are three options here for the vendor: one is to sell the system to you along with the FIT, the second is to sell the system to you and keep the FIT, and the third is to take it all away.

The first option is the best one for you, so it might be worth negotiating. The second I would not entertain for a second, as there are quite a few potentially serious drawbacks. The third is unlikely to happen. For the first, your vendor's price point is OTT, but it is a starting point.

Two things you need to confirm before you begin to negotiate; the first is what the actual FIT rate is. The second is whether the exported electricity is metered, and you get paid for what you actually provide to the grid. These two factors should help to determine the value of the system to you.

The early FITs included an additional payment for a presumed level of export, estimated at around 50:50 - ie they reckoned you'd use half, and the grid got the other half. They gave you a fixed sum for this, and it saved having to actually 'meter' the export. I think this has changed? Now they do measure what you export, and pay you for this actual amount? What difference does this make? If it's the latter system, then anything extra you 'use' from your PVs, you will then lose income for. If it's the former system, then you can use it ALL, but still get paid for half! (But this sum is still a lot less than the actual FIT).

For example, if you were to fit an immersion heater controller to soak up all the excess generation, or decide to install some batteries, then you wouldn't lose any overall FIT with the first agreement, but would lose the export payment for the second because you'd no longer be exporting any.

Where does that leave you? I would suggest that the third option - the vendor takes the panels with them - is unlikely to happen, but a bolshie person might well do it just to spite you as well as themselves. It would not be a good option for them, but not good for you either - you'd lose on what is a very useful asset.

Why is it not a good option for them? Because it would cost them around £2k? (at least) to remove and then refit them, they'd lose the FIT, they'd have to patch up the existing roof, and they'd show themselves up as being very petty indeed. So, it isn't 'worth' them doing this. But they could still do it, because that's who they are.

So you need a sum that'll be good for you, and be suitably emollient for them. I'd suggest you explain to the estate agent your understanding of the vendor's position - how they'd lose out in a major way if they actually took the panels with them, how you'd expect them to patch up the roof afterwards before you'd proceed any further - but you are prepared to consider a figure that will hopefully see them 'happy' to leave the panels and the FIT. (They will never be 'happy'...)

What's that sum? No idea. I hope that helps :-)

MoreProbs

(I'd pay £5k)

subjecttocontract

I had 14 solar panels installed in 2018 that cost me £5K......so he's looking to get his money back......which isn't right. He should be pricing the property with the solar installation already included.

I'd walk away......there are plenty of other places for sale at this time of year.

Gycraig

They are second hand panels he is charging like they are brand new and including fitting. 

I’d offer 2k or ask him to politely remove them and fix the roof after, it won’t be cheap in the slightest for him, he’s a complete chancer. 

I bet he’s had a quote to have them removed thought screw that and tried to get you to pay for panels on his new house 

MoreProbs

The rate of FIT being received by this system is the biggie. 
Any system that doesn't have a FIT income needs to be managed properly in order to make it a cost-effective installation. For instance, a non-FIT installation could be a good option for people who work from home, or use the house during the day, or who have maximised its use by heating a thermal store for later consumption (CH&DHW). Or if batteries are added, although that's a significant extra cost.
Without such careful use, however, I'm not sure a non-FIT system makes much financial sense - which is what this vendor has discovered. Mind you, as electricity costs rise, it does become more so. 
So, OP, I'd ask your solicitor to find out the FIT rate and type of export payment so you can make a judgement on its value. Also let your solicitor know that YOU know how much the system is worth to the vendor; by the time they've removed it AND lost their FIT, not a lot