Friend got pulled for no insurance paid fine but got to wait for replacement license

Standingstrong

Bit long story but my mate got pulled over for no insurance .. stupid !!!!

She paid the £300 fine and will get points on her licence , 

this is what the fixed office has said to her 

According to HMCT you have supplied an old driving licence which cannot be accepted. Please note that the driving licence issue ** that you have supplied to HMCTS has

been sent to the DVLA for destruction as, according to the DVLA, you have been issued with a new licence issue **.

 

If your driving licence issue ** has been lost, you will need to apply to DVLA for a new licence and then respond to the Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty when the new driving licence has been received.

 

Therefore, in order to fully comply with the Conditional Offer of Fixed Penalty, please ensure that your current photo card driving licence is  sent by 30/11/2022 to the Fixed Penalty Office 

 

She has done a replacement license but she’s worried that it won’t arrive in time , she is going to ring them in morning to say it’s not arrived yet , 

she is worried that she’ll get in trouble 

Standingstrong

What happenes to her if it don’t arrive by the 30th?? 

Car_54

If she does not submit her licence, she hasn’t met the conditions of the Conditional Offer. The matter will be referred to court, which could take several months. Her £300 will be refunded.
If the court can be persuaded that she was unable to submit her licence through circumstances outside her control, they may fine her at the fixed penalty level. I’d suggest she should post on pepipoo.com, where someone will give her the details of the magistrates’ guidelines.
Failing that, it’s a higher fine, victim surcharge and prosecution costs. Still only six points.

elsien

Is it not about time you got your friend to join this forum and post for herself?

Goudy

She is already in trouble, it's now down to how it's resolved.

The penalty is either submit a valid license and fine by that date for the fixed penalty.
Or
Don't and matter gets referred to court.

If the new license doesn't arrive in time, is it anyones fault that she couldn't comply to the fixed penalty terms?
It's not DVLA's, the police's or the courts fault she hasn't got her valid license because she lost or misplaced it.

It would now be as Car_54 states, down to a court appearance.
I would be careful and take some more knowledgeable advice over trying to persuaded the court over circumstance, it could backfire and there is no second chance.

For instance, if the license had been recently stolen, it should have been reported to the police and she would have a crime number.
If that was the case, this could be used to sway the court on why the fixed penalty wasn't an option for her at the time and perhaps result in a similar penalty.

On the other hand, if the case looks like your friend didn't know or care she wasn't insured and didn't know or care she wasn't in the possession of a valid driving license, that wouldn't look that good in court and perhaps result in a poorer outcome.

It just might (I say might, not will be) better just to stand there and plead guilty rather than present a circumstance that shows herself in a bad light, but take appropriate advice first.

Forgetfulness or being a bit dozy won't be good circumstances in court, they really show you just don't really care or take it seriously.

TooManyPoints

If she submits her licence later than the 28 days she as to accept the fixed penalty, the offer may be withdrawn. They may be generous and accept a late submission of her licence but the absolute cur-off is four months after the date of the offence. This is because the police only have six months to begin court proceedings. 

If it does go to court, here's the Magistrates' guidance on the matter:

Where a penalty notice could not be offered or taken up for reasons unconnected with the offence itself, such as administrative difficulties outside the control of the offender, the starting point should be a fine equivalent to the amount of the penalty and no order of costs should be imposed. The offender should not be disadvantaged by the unavailability of the penalty notice in these circumstances.

Whether she can persuade the court that this guidance is applicable depends on what the circumstances are. If she simply allowed her licence to expire I doubt they will be sympathetic.

MattMattMattUK

The court will not accept that she had to apply for a new license as the legal requirement is to have a valid license, so that will potentially lead to further action. If the license does get issued and accepted for the purpose of the Fixed Penalty action may still be taken for not having a valid license at the time of the incident. 

sheramber

elsien said:

Is it not about time you got your friend to join this forum and post for herself?

Make that plural unless one friend has endless problems.

elsien

sheramber said:

elsien said:

Is it not about time you got your friend to join this forum and post for herself?

Make that plural unless one friend has endless problems.

That was indeed my presumption. 

Car_54

MattMattMattUK said:

The court will not accept that she had to apply for a new license as the legal requirement is to have a valid license, so that will potentially lead to further action. If the license does get issued and accepted for the purpose of the Fixed Penalty action may still be taken for not having a valid license at the time of the incident. 

That won't happen unless she was over 70. Otherwise, your entitlement to drive remains regardless of changes of address, expired photos, etc.

TooManyPoints

The court will not accept that she had to apply for a new license as the legal requirement is to have a valid license, so that will potentially lead to further action. If the license does get issued and accepted for the purpose of the Fixed Penalty action may still be taken for not having a valid license at the time of the incident. 

 Unless restricted to a shorter term for medical reasons, a driving licence is valid until the driver reaches age 70. The driver's "entitlement to drive" does not lapse until then. Only the photocard has to be renewed (at 10 yearly intervals). So unless the licence has been revoked for some reason (because of, say, a disqualification of 56 days or more) a court will not be dealing with somebody who is not a licence holder. As well as that, the court cannot raise a prosecution of its own volition and will only be interested in the matter put before it by the police.

It is not at all clear why she had to apply for a new licence and unless we know the circumstances it is impossible to give an opinion as to whether the court will use its discretion to sentence at the fixed penalty level or not.