Problem With Executors & A Beneficiary

ThankUMrJones

Advice please.

Two executors over a will leaving everything 50/50 to two siblings. A very basic will no specific things allocated to anyone just an equal split of the Estate with Executors in charge.

Several problems over the course.

1. One of the beneficiaries unable to go to family home as the other beneficiary decides to move in. 

2. Same beneficiary lies to Executors about funds received from tenants, is witnessed finding money in a book they were about to burn and tells witness not to tell the other beneficiary.

3. Same beneficiary has spent money on the late parent credit and debit account after their passing. The other beneficiary had a bank statement with dates that give very clear indication they had taken the card whilst visiting parent two days before their passing on end of life care whilst in an unresponsive state. Purchases made in the town in which the beneficiary lived. No external purchases had been made prior to the visit. Thankfully knowing that it was likely once passed that something like this might happen the other Beneficiary phoned the bank to request the accounts be frozen until the executors contacted them so no large sums were taken from the bank accounts.

4 Present day and the estate is coming to a close finally and due to lack of communication, failure to deal with concerns regarding the beneficiary, one or two questionable transactions by the Executors themselves and now the selling of the property with the one beneficiary moving out and taking anything they wanted with no intervention by the executors and no list of belongings by the executors despite being asked if they had done one, despite being told there would be a draw done of belongings by the executors the other beneficiary has been left without being able to have the option of any sentimental items.

Executors are now it appears not even reading any messages sent.

Advice? Anyone have any experience of this or similar? Is it worth my writing to the solicitor they've used to handle the Estate outlining each issue, pointing out the wording in the will and pointing out what their legal obligation is as executor in treating both beneficiaries the same and saying this had clearly not happened and is mismanagement of the Estate.

Useful advice and suggestions welcomed.

Marcon

ThankUMrJones said:

Advice please.

Two executors over a will leaving everything 50/50 to two siblings. A very basic will no specific things allocated to anyone just an equal split of the Estate with Executors in charge.

Several problems over the course.

1. One of the beneficiaries unable to go to family home as the other beneficiary decides to move in. 

2. Same beneficiary lies to Executors about funds received from tenants, is witnessed finding money in a book they were about to burn and tells witness not to tell the other beneficiary.

3. Same beneficiary has spent money on the late parent credit and debit account after their passing. The other beneficiary had a bank statement with dates that give very clear indication they had taken the card whilst visiting parent two days before their passing on end of life care whilst in an unresponsive state. Purchases made in the town in which the beneficiary lived. No external purchases had been made prior to the visit. Thankfully knowing that it was likely once passed that something like this might happen the other Beneficiary phoned the bank to request the accounts be frozen until the executors contacted them so no large sums were taken from the bank accounts.

4 Present day and the estate is coming to a close finally and due to lack of communication, failure to deal with concerns regarding the beneficiary, one or two questionable transactions by the Executors themselves and now the selling of the property with the one beneficiary moving out and taking anything they wanted with no intervention by the executors and no list of belongings by the executors despite being asked if they had done one, despite being told there would be a draw done of belongings by the executors the other beneficiary has been left without being able to have the option of any sentimental items.

Executors are now it appears not even reading any messages sent.

Can the beneficiary just go to the Police? 

Anyone can go to the police, but given how overstretched they are, the chances of their having both the willingness and the capacity to get involved in what appears to be largely a civil matter suggests it may not yield the desired outcome, particularly as any 'evidence' looks circumstantial rather than actual.

Better bet is to seek legal advice.

ThankUMrJones

Marcon said:

ThankUMrJones said:

Advice please.

Two executors over a will leaving everything 50/50 to two siblings. A very basic will no specific things allocated to anyone just an equal split of the Estate with Executors in charge.

Several problems over the course.

1. One of the beneficiaries unable to go to family home as the other beneficiary decides to move in. 

2. Same beneficiary lies to Executors about funds received from tenants, is witnessed finding money in a book they were about to burn and tells witness not to tell the other beneficiary.

3. Same beneficiary has spent money on the late parent credit and debit account after their passing. The other beneficiary had a bank statement with dates that give very clear indication they had taken the card whilst visiting parent two days before their passing on end of life care whilst in an unresponsive state. Purchases made in the town in which the beneficiary lived. No external purchases had been made prior to the visit. Thankfully knowing that it was likely once passed that something like this might happen the other Beneficiary phoned the bank to request the accounts be frozen until the executors contacted them so no large sums were taken from the bank accounts.

4 Present day and the estate is coming to a close finally and due to lack of communication, failure to deal with concerns regarding the beneficiary, one or two questionable transactions by the Executors themselves and now the selling of the property with the one beneficiary moving out and taking anything they wanted with no intervention by the executors and no list of belongings by the executors despite being asked if they had done one, despite being told there would be a draw done of belongings by the executors the other beneficiary has been left without being able to have the option of any sentimental items.

Executors are now it appears not even reading any messages sent.

Can the beneficiary just go to the Police? 

Anyone can go to the police, but given how overstretched they are, the chances of their having both the willingness and the capacity to get involved in what appears to be largely a civil matter suggests it may not yield the desired outcome, particularly as any 'evidence' looks circumstantial rather than actual.

Better bet is to seek legal advice.

The deceased was in hospital for approximately 2/3 months before their death. The latter part being whilst on lockdown with nobody able to visit. Both beneficiaries were only able to go because the deceased had been put on end of life care due to catching Covid off someone whilst in the hospital after lockdown.  

No transactions on the cards whilst they were in hospital until the day after that final visit then at a location in a totally different city where only the other beneficiary lived at that time. Would that not be more than circumstancial?

Marcon

ThankUMrJones said:

Marcon said:

ThankUMrJones said:

Advice please.

Two executors over a will leaving everything 50/50 to two siblings. A very basic will no specific things allocated to anyone just an equal split of the Estate with Executors in charge.

Several problems over the course.

1. One of the beneficiaries unable to go to family home as the other beneficiary decides to move in. 

2. Same beneficiary lies to Executors about funds received from tenants, is witnessed finding money in a book they were about to burn and tells witness not to tell the other beneficiary.

3. Same beneficiary has spent money on the late parent credit and debit account after their passing. The other beneficiary had a bank statement with dates that give very clear indication they had taken the card whilst visiting parent two days before their passing on end of life care whilst in an unresponsive state. Purchases made in the town in which the beneficiary lived. No external purchases had been made prior to the visit. Thankfully knowing that it was likely once passed that something like this might happen the other Beneficiary phoned the bank to request the accounts be frozen until the executors contacted them so no large sums were taken from the bank accounts.

4 Present day and the estate is coming to a close finally and due to lack of communication, failure to deal with concerns regarding the beneficiary, one or two questionable transactions by the Executors themselves and now the selling of the property with the one beneficiary moving out and taking anything they wanted with no intervention by the executors and no list of belongings by the executors despite being asked if they had done one, despite being told there would be a draw done of belongings by the executors the other beneficiary has been left without being able to have the option of any sentimental items.

Executors are now it appears not even reading any messages sent.

Can the beneficiary just go to the Police? 

Anyone can go to the police, but given how overstretched they are, the chances of their having both the willingness and the capacity to get involved in what appears to be largely a civil matter suggests it may not yield the desired outcome, particularly as any 'evidence' looks circumstantial rather than actual.

Better bet is to seek legal advice.

The deceased was in hospital for approximately 2/3 months before their death. The latter part being whilst on lockdown with nobody able to visit. Both beneficiaries were only able to go because the deceased had been put on end of life care due to catching Covid off someone whilst in the hospital after lockdown.  

No transactions on the cards whilst they were in hospital until the day after that final visit then at a location in a totally different city where only the other beneficiary lived at that time. Would that not be more than circumstancial?

By all means put that to the police and see what they say.

msb1234

I would think the police would Say this is a civil matter. It may be very hard to prove the person used the debit card without  permission. 
Regarding access to the property, the executors should not have allowed this to happen technically, but I’m sure it does happen - presumably the beneficiary had a key to access the property?
I suggest asking a solicitor to write to the executors asap with your concerns, reminding the executors of their duties in administrating the will in accordance with what it says, and that if they have veered from the will they could be held accountable financially. State that you will require access to the property immediately and want a full inventory of the contents.
The sight of such a letter may well push the executors into acting within the terms of the will.

p00hsticks

msb1234 said:

 State that you will require access to the property immediately and want a full inventory of the contents.

I think unless we are talking stately home the request for a full inventory of the contents is really uneccessary and over the top. The topic of valuing a deceased persons house contents and personal possessions for probate comes up on this board from time to time and the general consensus is that unless there are valuable antiques, an arbitrary low valuation of a few hundred pounds is acceptable for probate purposes, and there is certainly no need to produce a list of every item in the house. In practise, if the house is to be sold it's likely that it will actually cost the estate to clear the house of its contents.

If the main aim of beneficiary number 2 (who I'm guessing is actually the OP) is to obtain possession of some items of sentimental rather than intrinsic value that were in the house , as opposed to simply anatagonising the executors and /or other beneficiary, I'd simply be writing to the executor and/or turning up at the property with a list of a small number of items that they'd like, hopefully before the house clearance arrives.

ThankUMrJones

Yes I am the other beneficiary.

I was actually born at that property.

The deceased and myself returned there and lived together for many years after they divorced my other parent.

The other beneficiary lived with the other parent.

There as been very little to no communication to myself from the Executors. I found out the property was on the market via an alert I had set up.

Yes it is not a stately home. This is very much about sentimental items being distributed equally.

From day one I was told that a draw would take place. Which to me was perfectly fair. What has happened is the property is now sold. I was told late morning of day the keys were handed over to go there and get anything when I had been of the understanding things were to be split via the draw. At the time I was contacted the other beneficiary had finished moving out and left.  I had no warning at all. I work. I was not able to go.

The following day I went there as I know the person who has purchased it. It has been stripped bare. I have also been told the other beneficiary was burning things that were being left behind until the new owner stopped them.

Every item of sentiment or value gone or burnt and not with the Executors.

user1977

What do you think going to the police would achieve? The police aren't going to recover the money for you. You have civil remedies available (with a lower standard of proof and more likelihood of action actually occurring) so use those.

ThankUMrJones

It's not about money. It's about sentimental items. I care about those. 

The hope would be that by them even saying something it would prompt these people to realise this is wrong and I'm serious.

user1977

The police are hardly likely to get involved in a family dispute about sentimental items.

If you want to show you're serious, take legal action yourself.

Pennylane

I have been in this situation and can tell you the Police will not get involved as they say it is a civil matter. We had them out at least 3 times and wrote a full report and timeline which they didn’t even look at!  

 It seems people can go into a family home, remove anything they like, even if it is left to somebody else in a Will and nothing will happen to them.  Yes it is heartbreaking when you lose sentimental items which have been left to you and it has taken me a long time to accept they are gone forever.  

It also breaks my heart to think that the person who wrote the Will’s wishes have not been followed through so I still wonder what is the point of writing a Will.  However, I am a firm believer in karma and hope they will one day get their comeuppance!