Worth getting a 'smart' electricity energy monitor, or pushing out supplier for a smart meter?

Bendy_House

This is for a village hall.

Like everyone, we are trying to keep tabs on the energy consumption - when it happens, and how much is being used.

Is it worth buying a 'Smart' energy monitor so all this can be monitored remotely (which is what we ideally want), or just ask the energy providers (not sure who they are) to fit Smart meters, to which we can hopefully then monitor real-time use?

DO Smart meters come with remote App-based monitoring features, so you can look at current and past use over days and weeks? If not, and we therefore have to buy our own device, any recommendations? 

Is it even worth going multi-sensor such as the Emporia Electricity Monitor which has a sensor clamp for 8 or 16 circuits: https://www.amazon.co.uk/EMPORIA-ENERGY-Emporia-Electricity-Metering/dp/B08CJGPHL9

Anyone used one of these types of devices?

Thanks.

[Deleted User]

Do you want to know how much is "lights" compared to "things plugged into sockets", or are you happy enough just to estimate that bit?  That's the only thing the multi-sensor adds.  It won't be able to tell you how much was kettle / vacuum / fridge unless each is those is from its own circuit breaker (which they almost certainly won't be).

Both smart meter and smart monitor at the fusebox will break down your use - normally into 30 minute intervals.  The normal smart meters have the supplier's own app (which is often terrible) but can also be read by free third-party apps (Bright is often referred to on this forum).

If you want to know how much an individual appliance uses, then you'll need a smart plug - many are available (I use Gosund) but the most commonly referred to here is a Tapo P110 (not the 100 because that is only remote control, not monitoring).

Bendy_House

Cheers Sparky.

I think you've summed up the options nicely:

Have a Smart meter installed, and this will give us a monitorable figure for the whole building's leccy use. Fit an Emporia (seems like good value?) or similar to monitor up to 16 individual circuits, or Smart plugs if they can narrow down the specific sockets they wish to monitor.

I suspect it's the multi-circuit!

I'll have a chat with the person who runs the hall, and see what they say.

Many thanks

[Deleted User]

I’m partially responsible for a similar building and would (perhaps surprisingly) find the middle option least useful.

 If either want to know the split between different periods of occupancy (open vs closed or different users), in which case the smart meter would likely be fine, or I’d want to be investigating specific appliances so would need smart plug(s) s as simply knowing “it’s the stuff in the sockets” would not be useful.

As you say, depends on their needs and to some extent on how split up their circuits are.

EssexHebridean

And of course Smart plugs by their nature are both desirable items and also easily portable - not necessarily a good combination in a building used by many members of the general public, a lot of whom won't have any loyalty to the building and those who are custodians of it. Not saying anyone who uses YOUR individual hal would do that, but worth a mention, I suspect. 

Phones4Chris

Depending on the size of your hall etc. it may have a 3-phase electricity supply. I don't know what the current situation is regarding installation of smart meters for 3 phase. Do they come with IHDs? Probably not. Worth asking about first perhaps.
Also beware the "possibilities" with smart meters, ie. load shedding, limiting etc which may become more of a reality in the not too distant future! OK I know we'll all have them eventually, but you might want to delay in current circumstances if not forced to have one by current meter certification expiring!

[Deleted User]

Can 3-phase smart meters come with IHDs? Yes they can, but they might not, and the OP is interested in reading remotely, not sitting in the hall watching an IHD anyway.

Ignore scare stories about smart meters, they’re mainly conspiracy theories and misunderstandings.

Bendy_House

Thanks all - great stuff.

It's single-phase (sadly, as we were hoping to fit a new fancy kitchen).

The current leccy bill is apparently around £400pm, and that's for just a few hours use of lighting (flories) per week. The Emporia would help us determine if there's anything else making a call on the leccy, or is it really just the crazy rate we are on.

I note it also has a physically large CU, so hopefully would be easy to fit inside there.

(Yes, we are pricing up replacing the florie tubes with LEDs)

Phones4Chris

Deleted_User said:

Can 3-phase smart meters come with IHDs? Yes they can, but they might not, and the OP is interested in reading remotely, not sitting in the hall watching an IHD anyway.

Ignore scare stories about smart meters, they’re mainly conspiracy theories and misunderstandings.

The point about IHD's for example, is you need one assigned to your meter to activate the Bright App, n3rgy data download etc. for which you don't sit in the hall !!!
As for scare stories, which ones do you think are conspiracy theories? Load shedding & Limiting are already being talked about due to the potentially shortage that might occur this winter, but personally I doubt that those with Smart Meters will be targetted over and above those without on the same substation. BUT that sort of thing MIGHT happen in the future, so bear it in mind.
Also the talked about "payment" for using energy at non-peak times and cutting use at peak times will only be for those with smart meters!

[Deleted User]

Phones4Chris said:

The point about IHD's for example, is you need one assigned to your meter to activate the Bright App, n3rgy data download etc. for which you don't sit in the hall !!!

You don't.  The apps have nothing to do with your IHD.  They rely on data from the central system that your smart meter sends readings to.

Phones4Chris said:

Load shedding & Limiting are already being talked about due to the potentially shortage that might occur this winter, but personally I doubt that those with Smart Meters will be targetted over and above those without on the same substation. BUT that sort of thing MIGHT happen in the future, so bear it in mind.

Load shedding is only going to happen at the substation as you say.  There is no plan, scheme or current capability to do load limiting.  They might decide in the future that only people named Kevin can have power on Thursdays - should I keep that in mind too?

Phones4Chris said:

Also the talked about "payment" for using energy at non-peak times and cutting use at peak times will only be for those with smart meters!

How else would you suggest that they work out if you used energy at the peak time or not?  Ask you to phone in a meter reading every 30 minutes?

As you've quite neatly pointed out here - all the innovations and benefits are (or will be) restricted to those with smart meters.  That is not a good argument for avoiding one.

Chrysalis

Octopus you can view historical usage with your choice of granularity on their app and website.  (hourly/daily/weekly/monthly consumption).   all accessed remotely over the internet.

For other suppliers I think you can get the same using the Bright app.

You should also get an IHD which is useful for showing live consumption.  But this has to be used locally within a few feet of the meter.

For what you have described, a smart meter would be a good decision.