Compensation from estate agent for mismeasuring 25 October 2022 at 11:56PM in House buying, renting & selling 52 replies 6K views

lincroft1710

My first house purchased in 1977 had an L shaped lounge-diner which a previous owner had partitioned off to form 2 separate rooms. It was obvious that there was an error in the sales particulars as the lounge had the depth measurement including the part that had been partitioned off and separately listed as the dining room with its own measurements.


So inaccuracies in room measurements have been happening for a long time

YoungBlueEyes

My father was military as was ex husband, so I've moved around a lot.  We always took our furniture with us and arranged it as it would fit.  You might want that sofa against that wall but if don't fit it'll have to go over there.  It is what it is.

As we don't have the size of the discrepancy, that may not be close to reality. It may be that the floorplan says 'this is a double bedroom' when what it really is is the size of a double bed. But that would have been visible on viewing, surely.

HRH_MUngo

penners324 said:

If your furniture doesn't fit there is FB marketplace.....

Bought 2 sofas for £30 when I moved as sofas we had bought we're not due for delivery for awhile

We got a hardly used  Ercol chair for £30 and a good IKEA chair for £10 on FB marketplace.  I never see what the problem is if 'the sofa won't fit'.  Buy another sofa and sell the old one!

elsien

I wish I could get bargains like that. The things I’ve been looking at haven’t been much cheaper than buying new.

BikingBud

lincroft1710 said:

BikingBud said:

lincroft1710 said:

fourmarks said:

BikingBud said:

Whether there is currently any liability or not it is not satisfactory that such leeway is given.

Measuring is not rocket science, the pyramids were built with simple devices and with the ready availability of laser measuring and scanning even the dullest of the dull EAs should be able to present accurate data.

I agree. You'd have thought 1st lesson at Estate Agent school would be how to use a ruler.

EAs have been using laser measurers rather than manual measuring devices for many years.


As someone (not an EA) who used 20m/30m measuring tapes and 2m measuring rods in their job for 35 yrs, the most likely mistake an EA would make using a manual measuring device would be putting down the wrong figure in their notes and if you've got the vendor prattling in your earhole it's easily done. 


It is carelessness rather than incapability

I don't really care what excuse is given, incorrectly read, incorrectly recorded, inadequate skill, inaccurate tools or whether they only had elephants trunks or clown shoes to measure with, it should not be acceptable and accepted.  

But as with most things to do with property and housing the whole system is too lax, else the profiteers would not get their coin.

Basically, there are two types of calculation of living space that are currently practiced:

https://www.grundriss-schmiede.de/en/living-space-calculation

Calculation according to the Living Space Ordinance and calculation according to DIN standard 277.

The living space calculation according to the living space ordinance is the most common calculation. Here, the floor areas of the rooms actually to be used for living purposes and areas such as a balcony are added. Parts that can only be used to a limited extent are then subtracted. Terraces and balconies can be mentioned here as examples. Depending on the season, these areas may be used more or less and are therefore only counted as 25 to 50% of the living space. Cutbacks are also made for roof slopes. Since these are to be used only partly, can be deducted here even up to 100% of the floor space under a roof inclination.

When calculating living space according to DIN standard 277, the floor area of a property plus a surcharge of 3% for wall construction with plaster and wallpaper is used. In addition, a comparatively large amount of floor space is taken into account and rooms are added together. Among other things, it is the basis for calculating rental space in industrial and office buildings. In this calculation, living space and usable space are often equated, which leads to high deviations compared to the calculation according to the Living Space Ordinance.

Both types of calculation basically lead to a valid and recognized living space figure. In principle, one should use the calculation according to the living space ordinance, since this is the most common method and is recognized in court or is used there as a calculation method in the event of a dispute.

I don't see that UK EAs adopting German floor measurement standards will stop measurement inaccuracies. If the person doing the measuring in ill trained, incompetent or careless, mistakes will still happen

Because with the obligation comes liability!

eddddy

lincroft1710 said:

So inaccuracies in room measurements have been happening for a long time

Yep. But regulation of Estate Agents and consumer protection for buyers and sellers has been getting a lot tougher over the years.

In the 'bad old days', estate agents could write almost anything they liked in property descriptions - and then hide behind the 'buyer beware' or 'caveat emptor' principle. But consumer protection laws doesn't allow that any more.

(Having said that, I think quite a few estate agents still stray onto the wrong side of consumer protection laws.)

lincroft1710

BikingBud said:

lincroft1710 said:

BikingBud said:

lincroft1710 said:

fourmarks said:

BikingBud said:

Whether there is currently any liability or not it is not satisfactory that such leeway is given.

Measuring is not rocket science, the pyramids were built with simple devices and with the ready availability of laser measuring and scanning even the dullest of the dull EAs should be able to present accurate data.

I agree. You'd have thought 1st lesson at Estate Agent school would be how to use a ruler.

EAs have been using laser measurers rather than manual measuring devices for many years.


As someone (not an EA) who used 20m/30m measuring tapes and 2m measuring rods in their job for 35 yrs, the most likely mistake an EA would make using a manual measuring device would be putting down the wrong figure in their notes and if you've got the vendor prattling in your earhole it's easily done. 


It is carelessness rather than incapability

I don't really care what excuse is given, incorrectly read, incorrectly recorded, inadequate skill, inaccurate tools or whether they only had elephants trunks or clown shoes to measure with, it should not be acceptable and accepted.  

But as with most things to do with property and housing the whole system is too lax, else the profiteers would not get their coin.

Basically, there are two types of calculation of living space that are currently practiced:

https://www.grundriss-schmiede.de/en/living-space-calculation

Calculation according to the Living Space Ordinance and calculation according to DIN standard 277.

The living space calculation according to the living space ordinance is the most common calculation. Here, the floor areas of the rooms actually to be used for living purposes and areas such as a balcony are added. Parts that can only be used to a limited extent are then subtracted. Terraces and balconies can be mentioned here as examples. Depending on the season, these areas may be used more or less and are therefore only counted as 25 to 50% of the living space. Cutbacks are also made for roof slopes. Since these are to be used only partly, can be deducted here even up to 100% of the floor space under a roof inclination.

When calculating living space according to DIN standard 277, the floor area of a property plus a surcharge of 3% for wall construction with plaster and wallpaper is used. In addition, a comparatively large amount of floor space is taken into account and rooms are added together. Among other things, it is the basis for calculating rental space in industrial and office buildings. In this calculation, living space and usable space are often equated, which leads to high deviations compared to the calculation according to the Living Space Ordinance.

Both types of calculation basically lead to a valid and recognized living space figure. In principle, one should use the calculation according to the living space ordinance, since this is the most common method and is recognized in court or is used there as a calculation method in the event of a dispute.

I don't see that UK EAs adopting German floor measurement standards will stop measurement inaccuracies. If the person doing the measuring in ill trained, incompetent or careless, mistakes will still happen

Because with the obligation comes liability!

What "obligation"?

jonnydeppiwish!

elsien said:

I wish I could get bargains like that. The things I’ve been looking at haven’t been much cheaper than buying new.

You need to look at the darker wood colours as these don’t sell easily. You can get some amazingly priced furniture if you’re not too worried about the colour.

BikingBud

lincroft1710 said:

BikingBud said:

lincroft1710 said:

BikingBud said:

lincroft1710 said:

fourmarks said:

BikingBud said:

Whether there is currently any liability or not it is not satisfactory that such leeway is given.

Measuring is not rocket science, the pyramids were built with simple devices and with the ready availability of laser measuring and scanning even the dullest of the dull EAs should be able to present accurate data.

I agree. You'd have thought 1st lesson at Estate Agent school would be how to use a ruler.

EAs have been using laser measurers rather than manual measuring devices for many years.


As someone (not an EA) who used 20m/30m measuring tapes and 2m measuring rods in their job for 35 yrs, the most likely mistake an EA would make using a manual measuring device would be putting down the wrong figure in their notes and if you've got the vendor prattling in your earhole it's easily done. 


It is carelessness rather than incapability

I don't really care what excuse is given, incorrectly read, incorrectly recorded, inadequate skill, inaccurate tools or whether they only had elephants trunks or clown shoes to measure with, it should not be acceptable and accepted.  

But as with most things to do with property and housing the whole system is too lax, else the profiteers would not get their coin.

Basically, there are two types of calculation of living space that are currently practiced:

https://www.grundriss-schmiede.de/en/living-space-calculation

Calculation according to the Living Space Ordinance and calculation according to DIN standard 277.

The living space calculation according to the living space ordinance is the most common calculation. Here, the floor areas of the rooms actually to be used for living purposes and areas such as a balcony are added. Parts that can only be used to a limited extent are then subtracted. Terraces and balconies can be mentioned here as examples. Depending on the season, these areas may be used more or less and are therefore only counted as 25 to 50% of the living space. Cutbacks are also made for roof slopes. Since these are to be used only partly, can be deducted here even up to 100% of the floor space under a roof inclination.

When calculating living space according to DIN standard 277, the floor area of a property plus a surcharge of 3% for wall construction with plaster and wallpaper is used. In addition, a comparatively large amount of floor space is taken into account and rooms are added together. Among other things, it is the basis for calculating rental space in industrial and office buildings. In this calculation, living space and usable space are often equated, which leads to high deviations compared to the calculation according to the Living Space Ordinance.

Both types of calculation basically lead to a valid and recognized living space figure. In principle, one should use the calculation according to the living space ordinance, since this is the most common method and is recognized in court or is used there as a calculation method in the event of a dispute.

I don't see that UK EAs adopting German floor measurement standards will stop measurement inaccuracies. If the person doing the measuring in ill trained, incompetent or careless, mistakes will still happen

Because with the obligation comes liability!

What "obligation"?

The obligation that should come with marketing assets valued at many hundreds of thousands or even millions of pounds.

However, I said before: "But as with most things to do with property and housing the whole system is too lax, else the profiteers would not get their coin."

housebuyer143

jonnydeppiwish! said:

elsien said:

I wish I could get bargains like that. The things I’ve been looking at haven’t been much cheaper than buying new.

You need to look at the darker wood colours as these don’t sell easily. You can get some amazingly priced furniture if you’re not too worried about the colour.

This! Buy some furniture paint and do them up. There are loads of loads of cheap items of furniture on Facebook. I almost never buy new if I can help it.