UKPC restricted area invoice

Half_way

Ditch the word fine and replace it with parking charge notice - also use the fact that the vehcile was not parked as a means to contradict the term "parking " charge notice

Add in that UKPC are an un regalted parking company acting as the site owners agents, and the site owners are jointly liable for the actions of their agents

 Add in  something about GDOR, as the vehcile was not parked, then your personal details have been accessed without just cause

KeithP

Civic2056 said:

fisherjim said:

As Le_Kirk says this is is ridiculous What is a "registered user" apparently the sign says you will find out on signs after entering the car park.

The site owners have also placed a sign stating "deliveries" and "service road" inviting drivers in with no restriction then the muppets at UKPC trap you with a further sign of their own, typical honeytrap.

I would start by complaining to the owners: Royal London Asset Management, or their agents Savilles (Dominic Rodbourn drodbourne@savills.com)

https://cdn.completelyretail.co.uk/media/scheme/3/3214/CG_Gallows_Corner_Retail_Park_Romford_brochure_2021-06-23-09-51-03.pdf

Sending from an alternate email account which doesn't have my real name.

Don't they already know your real name?

If you are going to respond, then surely you want them to know who is responding?

Umkomaas

KeithP said:

Civic2056 said:

fisherjim said:

As Le_Kirk says this is is ridiculous What is a "registered user" apparently the sign says you will find out on signs after entering the car park.

The site owners have also placed a sign stating "deliveries" and "service road" inviting drivers in with no restriction then the muppets at UKPC trap you with a further sign of their own, typical honeytrap.

I would start by complaining to the owners: Royal London Asset Management, or their agents Savilles (Dominic Rodbourn drodbourne@savills.com)

https://cdn.completelyretail.co.uk/media/scheme/3/3214/CG_Gallows_Corner_Retail_Park_Romford_brochure_2021-06-23-09-51-03.pdf

Sending from an alternate email account which doesn't have my real name.

Don't they already know your real name?

If you are going to respond, then surely you want them to know who is responding?

Savills will need to know your real name and your UKPC PCN number, otherwise how will they be able to have any reference point with which to have any conversation with UKPC about having the ticket cancelled?

Civic2056

Umkomaas said:

KeithP said:

Civic2056 said:

fisherjim said:

As Le_Kirk says this is is ridiculous What is a "registered user" apparently the sign says you will find out on signs after entering the car park.

The site owners have also placed a sign stating "deliveries" and "service road" inviting drivers in with no restriction then the muppets at UKPC trap you with a further sign of their own, typical honeytrap.

I would start by complaining to the owners: Royal London Asset Management, or their agents Savilles (Dominic Rodbourn drodbourne@savills.com)

https://cdn.completelyretail.co.uk/media/scheme/3/3214/CG_Gallows_Corner_Retail_Park_Romford_brochure_2021-06-23-09-51-03.pdf

Sending from an alternate email account which doesn't have my real name.

Don't they already know your real name?

If you are going to respond, then surely you want them to know who is responding?

Savills will need to know your real name and your UKPC PCN number, otherwise how will they be able to have any reference point with which to have any conversation with UKPC about having the ticket cancelled?

I haven't had a PCN yet.It's merely a hypothetical question. If I do get a PCN, surely I will need to contact UKPC?

That's why I was asking yesterday about whether the sign implies you simply can't park there, or you can drive on the road providing you don't park, as I did. Just want to be prepared for if a fine comes though, the newbie guide says don't respond until Day 26, and also don't give them any more details than they already have, eg, the driver. Sure they will know I am the registered keeper of the vehicle through any DVLA check, but I have other registered drivers and presumably they can't see these. I was driving the vehicle I'm registered to on that day, but they don't know that and at this stage, they don't need to. 

Umkomaas

I haven't had a PCN yet.It's merely a hypothetical question. 

If you'd have pointed that out from the start it might have saved a lot of time. I did ask you to confirm whether you'd actually received a PCN, to which you made no reply. 

Forget about this unless/until you receive an actual PCN fro UKPC. 

Fruitcake

Civic2056 said:

KeithP said:

Where exactly did this event take place?

Nope that was my photograph. It's not on GSV 2022 hence me suggesting it must be new. Here it is roughly here this road Romford, England

https://maps.app.goo.gl/m73LZ6YJYRsWKiKN9

The GSV image capture date on that link is November 2020. I can't see any images taken later by following the route the camera car took from the main road to the end of that service road.

I would also point out that outside Scotland, the CAB are singularly useless where the unregulated parking industry is concerned and routinely give terrible advice.

Civic2056

Fruitcake said:

Civic2056 said:

KeithP said:

Where exactly did this event take place?

Nope that was my photograph. It's not on GSV 2022 hence me suggesting it must be new. Here it is roughly here this road Romford, England

https://maps.app.goo.gl/m73LZ6YJYRsWKiKN9

The GSV image capture date on that link is November 2020. I can't see any images taken later by following the route the camera car took from the main road to the end of that service road.

I would also point out that outside Scotland, the CAB are singularly useless where the unregulated parking industry is concerned and routinely give terrible advice.

ah. it seems i might have got confused as i was using streetview on my phone and it just said "2022 google", must have just been a copyright rather than gsv date.

Isn't UKPC *technically* regulated though, by the BPA, which are useless but still, not actually un-regulated?

What about the new government rules I linked from a MSE article, surely they must at least abide by these, though it does say they've got up until early 2023 to adopt them. 

Can any of you make out what the sign is actually against  - against you parking on the site, or simply driving onto it, even if you're not parking? If its simply the former, I should be in the clear, if not I'm expecting a fine - sorry, invoice. Which I will not pay, and will basically outline why I won't in a similar fashion to the email. 

Could I also simply argue i didn't know who was driving at the time, and thus i am not obliged to pay the fine? Obviously I'm lying, I admit to driving, but this isn't a legally enforceable document like a notice from police asking to identify the driver where you cannot pevert the court of justice, or have to prove you've taken all reasonable steps to identify the driver? Theoretical question.

There's no way a council would get away with such bad signage, where it conflicts with existing signage advising people to use the road for deliveries. 

Coupon-mad

No-one has to lie.

There is no requirement to name the driver.

I know this is theoretical question but this is already explained in the NEWBIES thread that a registered keeper has a right to appeal without naming the driver (and without lying).

And there won't be a PCN anyway, because the BPA CoP (which is just a set of trade body AOS member rules, not regulation) mandates a minimum 5 minute consideration period for vehicles to drive in and leave.

Do the CAB not even know that basic stuff?

Sadly, in our experience, the CAB are utterly appalling at private parking advice - worse than embarrassing.  Dangerous for your wealth with the rubbish they come out with; I seem to recall that they actually took advice from the BPA!

That's like asking a scam industry 'are you a scam industry?'

And when told "no" by suits at the BPA, and fed a load of simplistic cobblers about contract law, the CAB has actually swallowed the lot. CAB in E&W should be ashamed of what they tell people about private parking charges.

Do their advisers even know from their online information pages about PPC World, that the law is changing and real regulation (a robust statutory Code of Practice) is in the offing?

CAB Scotland knows.  Decent articles come from them.

fisherjim

Civic2056 said:

I haven't had a PCN yet.It's merely a hypothetical question.

That's why I was asking yesterday about whether the sign implies you simply can't park there, or you can drive on the road providing you don't park, this stage, they don't need to. 

That is the whole point the signage is basically as confusing as your original post.

Do nothing until you get something if at all from UKPC, which is probably unlikely, but if you do the newbies thread tells you the procedure.

Civic2056

Yeah haven't had anything yet, and not expecting to, I thought maybe it was just me but it seems everyone I have spoken to either here or other drivers seem to be in universal agreement that the sign is ridiculous and given i wasn't even parked up, they cannot possibly issue me a parking notice.