No electricity but metre box has lights.

Section62

Bendy_House said:

You have a 32A MCB labelled 'Ring'. That means 'sockets'. There is a 16A MCB to its immediate right labelled 'f'all'. What is that for? I'm guessing upstairs sockets?

There's always a possibility the labels on the consumer unit bear no relationship to what actually is connected to the circuit/device in that position.....

[Deleted User]

Bendy_House said:

I wonder if the 'ground floor lighting' tripping the RCD was a red herring? It just happened to be the one that seemingly tripped the RCD, whereas it may only have been contributing a couple of mA to the equation, and the downstairs sockets are still the real culprit?

Jackson, with the 'downstairs sockets' MCB OFF, will the RCD stay on? Or are you saying you now cannot get the RCD to stay on REGARDLESS of whether ALL the MCBs are off?!

If the latter, then stop and call a sparky.

You have a 32A MCB labelled 'Ring'. That means 'sockets'. There is a 16A MCB to its immediate right labelled 'f'all'. What is that for? I'm guessing upstairs sockets?

What, exactly, is on the 32A 'ring'? Does it include the kitchen?

What's the 40A jobbie on the left - is that an electric shower? 

This morning, with everything but the fridge, washing machine and outdoor extension unplugged, the RCD turned on but tripped 5 minutes or so later. Unlike previous times, I didn't have to wait too long before it would switch back on with all the MCBs off. One by one, and giving an hour gap between, I turned everything back on aside from the ground floor and first floor lights. A few hours in, no tripping. Going to turn on the lights when I get some work done.

To answer your questions. 

1. The RCD would stay on with the MCBs off initially, BUT if it then tripped when I switched a MCB on, it would immediately switch off even with the MCBs switched off. I would have to wait a few hours before it would stay on.

2. Right of the ring circuit is the garden lights and socket.

3. The first MCB I have no idea what it's for. Switched it on this morning and went around see what was now working but couldn't figure it out.

4. The ring circuit includes everything in the kitchen. 

victor2

I'm getting confused just trying to understand what has been tested!

OP, now that you hopefully understand some of the terms and how the RCD an MCBs work, perhaps it's time to start over. It looks like the problem lies within the circuits protected by the left RCD and the MCBs between that and the RCD to the right in your picture. As has already been suggested, start with the RCD and all MCBs off. Then confirm that the RCD will switch on and stay on.

Then switch on three of the MCBs one by one and see if the RCD trips. GIve it a bit of time (as much as you can really) and if it is all OK, switch the other MCBs on and wait for the fault to appear. Use that process to narrow it down to one MCB with the problem circuit or equipment on it.

Intermittent faults can be very hard to track down, as can ones that are an accumulation of other small issues. I once had faulty wiring causing an RCD to trip occassionally. Only when the fault became permanent and tripped it with absolutely nothing plugged into the ring main, was I able to pinpoint it!

Still took a sparky to rewire it, but at least I'd identified the fault.

Edit: Typed this before I saw the OP's message above.

Bendy_House

Deleted_User said:

This morning, with everything but the fridge, washing machine and outdoor extension unplugged, the RCD turned on but cut 5 minutes or so later. Unlike previous times, I didn't have to wait too long before it would switch back on with all the MCBs off. One by one, and giving an hour gap between, turned everything back on aside from the ground floor and first floor lights. A few hours in, no tripping. Going to turn on the lights when I get some work done.

To answer your questions. 

1. The RCD would stay on with the MCBs off initially, BUT if it then tripped when I switched and MCB on, it would immediately switch off even with the MCBs switched back off. I would have to wait a few hours before it would stay on.

2. Right if the ring circuit is the garden lights and socket.

3. The first MCB I have no idea what it's for. Switched it on this morning and went around see what was now working but couldn't figure it out.

4. The ring circuit includes everything in the kitchen. 

Typos and awkward grammar really isn't helping us, Jackson!

What does "BUT if it then tripped when I switched and MCB on, it would immediately switch off even with the MCBs switched back off" mean?

Anyhoo, you still have the W/M plugged in? Why?! Doesn't it have an isolator above worktop level? Have you tried a wash? Does it work exactly as it should?

What's an 'outdoor extension'? Can that be isolated from within the house?

The fridge is presumably working exactly as it should?

[Deleted User]

Bendy_House said:

Deleted_User said:

This morning, with everything but the fridge, washing machine and outdoor extension unplugged, the RCD turned on but cut 5 minutes or so later. Unlike previous times, I didn't have to wait too long before it would switch back on with all the MCBs off. One by one, and giving an hour gap between, turned everything back on aside from the ground floor and first floor lights. A few hours in, no tripping. Going to turn on the lights when I get some work done.

To answer your questions. 

1. The RCD would stay on with the MCBs off initially, BUT if it then tripped when I switched and MCB on, it would immediately switch off even with the MCBs switched back off. I would have to wait a few hours before it would stay on.

2. Right if the ring circuit is the garden lights and socket.

3. The first MCB I have no idea what it's for. Switched it on this morning and went around see what was now working but couldn't figure it out.

4. The ring circuit includes everything in the kitchen. 

Typos and awkward grammar really isn't helping us, Jackson!

What does "BUT if it then tripped when I switched and MCB on, it would immediately switch off even with the MCBs switched back off" mean?

Anyhoo, you still have the W/M plugged in? Why?! Doesn't it have an isolator above worktop level? Have you tried a wash? Does it work exactly as it should?

What's an 'outdoor extension'? Can that be isolated from within the house?

The fridge is presumably working exactly as it should?

Typing on my phone so sorry for the issues. Just amended my post. I was saying that the RCD would stay on but when I switched an MCB on, it would trip. It would then immediately trip even if all the MCBs are off. Only way it would stay on would be to wait a few hours.

I've now got all the MCBs on. 5 minutes in and nothing has tripped. Will still get an electrician in to check it out. 

shiraz99

Deleted_User said:

3. The first MCB I have no idea what it's for. Switched it on this morning and went around see what was now working but couldn't figure it out.

Given that it's rated at 40A I'd guess it's a dedicated cooker spur in the kitchen, or if you have an electric shower it could be for that.

Bendy_House

Deleted_User said:

Bendy_House said:

Deleted_User said:

This morning, with everything but the fridge, washing machine and outdoor extension unplugged, the RCD turned on but cut 5 minutes or so later. Unlike previous times, I didn't have to wait too long before it would switch back on with all the MCBs off. One by one, and giving an hour gap between, turned everything back on aside from the ground floor and first floor lights. A few hours in, no tripping. Going to turn on the lights when I get some work done.

To answer your questions. 

1. The RCD would stay on with the MCBs off initially, BUT if it then tripped when I switched and MCB on, it would immediately switch off even with the MCBs switched back off. I would have to wait a few hours before it would stay on.

2. Right if the ring circuit is the garden lights and socket.

3. The first MCB I have no idea what it's for. Switched it on this morning and went around see what was now working but couldn't figure it out.

4. The ring circuit includes everything in the kitchen. 

Typos and awkward grammar really isn't helping us, Jackson!

What does "BUT if it then tripped when I switched and MCB on, it would immediately switch off even with the MCBs switched back off" mean?

Anyhoo, you still have the W/M plugged in? Why?! Doesn't it have an isolator above worktop level? Have you tried a wash? Does it work exactly as it should?

What's an 'outdoor extension'? Can that be isolated from within the house?

The fridge is presumably working exactly as it should?

Typing on my phone so sorry for the issues. Just amended my post. I was saying that the RCD would stay on but when I switched an MCB on, it would trip. It would then immediately trip even if all the MCBs are off. Only way it would stay on would be to wait a few hours.

I've now got all the MCBs on. 5 minutes in and nothing has tripped. Will still get an electrician in to check it out. 

No prob :-)

If the RCD trips with ALL associated MCBs off, then you need a sparky.

Something seriously weird is going on. You've had the RCD trip, but also an MCB, and that's quite different.

It could even be as S62 suggested, and one or more of these components are faulty. You REALLY want that sorted.

Please come back with the solution to the mystery!

fenwick458

victor2 said:

It looks like the problem lies within the circuits protected by the left RCD and the MCBs between that and the RCD to the right in your picture. As has already been suggested, start with the RCD and all MCBs off. Then confirm that the RCD will switch on and stay on.

Then switch on three of the MCBs one by one and see if the RCD trips. GIve it a bit of time (as much as you can really) and if it is all OK, switch the other MCBs on and wait for the fault to appear. Use that process to narrow it down to one MCB with the problem circuit or equipment on it.

I highly doubt the OP will succeed with this method, I could probably spend hours trying that method and get zero repeatable results. IMO the most reliable way to identify the faulty circuit is to remove neutrals and perform IR tests on each circuits to earth, and thats an electricians job

Scrounger

Could be moisture ingress, especially at outdoor lights or sockets.

Had much rain lately @Deleted_User ?


Scrounger

[Deleted User]

Funny you should mention that @Scrounger

An electrician came round today and there were a host of problems with the garden lights. There are 8 lights in the garden along the ground.

At least 2 were just faulty with no obvious reason. Another 2 had wires cut, probably a fox yanking it (they like to hang around there). There was also a connection box (not sure on the proper term) that had quite a bit of water in it. 

The electrician has disconnected the lights. Hopefully that was the issue and things stay on.

Thanks everyone for the help.