EDF

[Deleted User]

My PC has completely locked up 
I will re- post shortly with a clearer post as this has gone off tangent as I wasnt clear in original OP 

What_time_is_it

I'm having similar problems with EDF. They cancelled and replaced my old bills too. The current one is totally wrong as it omits gas entirely! I've told them a number of times and I'm waiting for them to respond.

[Deleted User]

Densol said:

Submitted readings this month and EDF produce a bill from APRIL 2021 to SEP 2022 “ replacing all previous bills” They cannot go back 12 months anyway. No reason given. 

They can.

Densol said:

With all previous bills cancelled and deleted on my account - how strange . ( lucky I have copies ) Lucky I have photos of meter readings. 

That's what they do when something happens to update their estimations.

Densol said:

Fake bill 1 Sep - 
As the tariffs have changed over time, they have taken energy units out of the cheaper tariffs ( contrary to previous readings and bills and my contract with them ) and loaded them into the more recent expensive tariffs for electric obviously increasing the bill retrospectively. 

Fake bill 2. 

I gave further readings ( 2 days later) and next day another Jackanory bill is produced, this time changing all the gas units from cheaper tariffs, to dearer tariffs obviously increasing the bill.

If your readings indicate that they had incorrectly estimated you use earlier, this is exactly what should have happened.

Densol said:

However Ive caught them out. MP involved, and will go to Ombudsman. Ive asked MP to raise with Ofgem. 

Yeah, you haven't.  Your MP and OFGEM have nothing to do with it.  I presume, since you say you're involving the Ombudsman, that you have raised the required official complaint with the supplier, and gone through the complete resolution process or got a deadlock letter?

[Deleted User]

Deleted_User said:

Densol said:

Submitted readings this month and EDF produce a bill from APRIL 2021 to SEP 2022 “ replacing all previous bills” They cannot go back 12 months anyway. No reason given. 

They can.

Densol said:

With all previous bills cancelled and deleted on my account - how strange . ( lucky I have copies ) Lucky I have photos of meter readings. 

That's what they do when something happens to update their estimations.

Densol said:

Fake bill 1 Sep - 
As the tariffs have changed over time, they have taken energy units out of the cheaper tariffs ( contrary to previous readings and bills and my contract with them ) and loaded them into the more recent expensive tariffs for electric obviously increasing the bill retrospectively. 

Fake bill 2. 

I gave further readings ( 2 days later) and next day another Jackanory bill is produced, this time changing all the gas units from cheaper tariffs, to dearer tariffs obviously increasing the bill.

If your readings indicate that they had incorrectly estimated you use earlier, this is exactly what should have happened.

Densol said:

However Ive caught them out. MP involved, and will go to Ombudsman. Ive asked MP to raise with Ofgem. 

Yeah, you haven't.  Your MP and OFGEM have nothing to do with it.  I presume, since you say you're involving the Ombudsman, that you have raised the required official complaint with the supplier, and gone through the complete resolution process or got a deadlock letter?

Sorry did you ACTUALLY read any of my post? Do you work for EDF ?! 

They have billed on READINGS not estimates ! Readings when I have a contract with them to supply energy at contracted rates in that period of time. changing a unit from 12.83p to 27.80p which changes bills. Readings !

The rules about billing beyond 12 months - very black and white and in any event my bills were not incorrect. The reason being they were based on READINGS !! https://www.ofgem.gov.uk/check-energy-back-billing-rules#:~:text=What are the back-billing,it was set too low.

lastly MPs do get involved when big companies are involved in scams and do get Ofgem involvex 

dunstonh

This post is to see if others are facing same issue to see if this is a large scale fraud. 

No fraud going on.

I read my meters every month. I take photos. I am very diligent and now use little energy ( house of 5 to one and abroad a lot now ) 

You need to submit them to EDF each month.  

Submitted readings this month and EDF produced a bill from APRIL 2021 to SEP 2022 “ replacing all previous bills” They cannot go back 12 months anyway. No reason given. 

This is the likely cause of your issue.   By not supplying the reads monthly but in one go, EDF recreates the bill by removing the estimates but using the meter readings in their place.    

Most members of public would not have a clue and are freezing to death whilst EDF craftily and subliminally alter their bills to EDF’s financial advantage. However Ive caught them out. MP involved, and will go to Ombudsman. Ive asked MP to raise with Ofgem. 

As you can only access the ombudsman after you have raised a complaint and reached deadlock, what was the actual response from EDF about your complaint?

[Deleted User]

To put some balance into the above post. Suppliers can re-bill as and when they wish; however, under The BackBilling Regulations they can in a number of situations not charge for energy used for any period 12 months from the date of re-billing. However, whilst charges are written off any payments made under DD payments during the write off period are not carried forward.

It follows that a supplier can raise a bill for the period April 2021 to September 2022. If backbilling applies then all charges prior to September 2021 have to be written off. However, if, say, the written off charges were £300 and 6 payments of £45 per month were paid in the write off period, then the total write off would be £300 less £270 or £30. The whole purpose of backfilling is to prevent bill shock, it is not to penalise suppliers per se.

FWiW, I think that writing to a MP when all the facts are not properly understood and the supplier's complaints procedure has not be followed in full may be a tad premature. 

[Deleted User]

What_time_is_it said:

I'm having similar problems with EDF. They cancelled and replaced my old bills too. The current one is totally wrong as it omits gas entirely! I've told them a number of times and I'm waiting for them to respond.

Id just lodge a complaint - I had a complaint from last month running about too high direct debits - so Ive asked both mine are linked and its going to the Ombudsman ( soon ) as I wont settle with them so we’ll dead lock very quickly Id imagine

[Deleted User]

Densol said:

 Do you work for EDF ?! 

And there we have it.  No intention to actually understand any of the points raised, just an accusation that you work for THE MAN if you provide any sort of rebuttal.

MWT

Densol said:

The rules about billing beyond 12 months - very black and white...

Just on that point, the rules only come into play if they are billing you for use that was not previously billed at the time, if there is no new use in this re-billing exercise the back-billing rules have no part to play in it, so it will not help your case to make reference to it.

For the rest, you said you have been taking photos of your meter readings every month, but you didn't say if you have been submitting those readings to EDF each month as well?

If you have then it should be easy to deal with this re-billing exercise through their complaints system, if you had not previously given them the actual readings then the re-billing exercise would have been triggered by your recent actual readings and while it should still be possible to sort things out with a complaint, it will be more difficult as the readings were not submitted at the time...

What_time_is_it

One thing I am not sure about in my dealing with EDF is this... When they cancel a bill and I can no longer see or download it, does that mean that the bill and all my previous meter readings have also been wiped from THEIR systems too? I foolishly didn't keep my own copies and I thought I would always be able to access my bills in my online account.

maisie_cat

It isn't clear to me, have the readings that were taken actually been given to EDF on the date they were taken?
If they were, do the readings appear on any of the new bills?
When BG did this to me I could reconcile their new bills to my readings, and when there were tariff changes requiring estimates they made sense.
If the readings were not given to EDF they will have had no choice but to estimate, and are not correcting having had real readings.
My brother had a similar problem, except in his case he knew his supplier was underestimating for years and he decided that by not supplying actual readings he would save money. When the readings were corrected he ended up paying new higher rates for prior year usage.